Sunset limited schedule to change in may

[Trogdor]

The impression I got from a conversation with the Director of National Operations is that normally it will be a same day turn around at LAX and overnight turn around in NOL. But as usual, with everything, what really happens is the final arbiter in these things. So we will just have to wait and see.

Technically, the train could have a same-day turnaround in LAX on Wednesday and Friday.

However, with the change in days of operations (which enables all the cost savings and the equipment set to be freed up in NOL), you'll have a train leaving LAX on Sunday, but the inbound equipment won't get in until Monday.

So, whether they do a same-day turn around on Wednesday and Friday, and hold the Monday arrival as a spare all week until the Sunday departure, or whether they have the two-day turnaround for each set, makes no real difference in the end as far as equipment utilization and availability goes.

My bet is that both will happen, depending on the needs of the specific equipment on the specific day/week.

 

[The Davy Crockett]

Bottom line: People who perceive a benefit in the new schedule are going to like it, and the people who don't won't. I wouldn't be surprised if initially ridership will slow or slacken some while riders adjust to the new schedule.

If I lived in Houston, wanted to ride from LAX to TUS, or was directly connecting to/from the CS, I'd be happy.

None of the above apply to me. Anyone know of a good breakfast place open at 5:00 AM in LA? :wacko: Think there will be coffee in the sleepers at 4:30 in the AM? :blink: And what time does the Gold Line start operating? :lol:

 

[jis]

The impression I got from a conversation with the Director of National Operations is that normally it will be a same day turn around at LAX and overnight turn around in NOL. But as usual, with everything, what really happens is the final arbiter in these things. So we will just have to wait and see.

Technically, the train could have a same-day turnaround in LAX on Wednesday and Friday.

However, with the change in days of operations (which enables all the cost savings and the equipment set to be freed up in NOL), you'll have a train leaving LAX on Sunday, but the inbound equipment won't get in until Monday.

So, whether they do a same-day turn around on Wednesday and Friday, and hold the Monday arrival as a spare all week until the Sunday departure, or whether they have the two-day turnaround for each set, makes no real difference in the end as far as equipment utilization and availability goes.

My bet is that both will happen, depending on the needs of the specific equipment on the specific day/week.

You are correct of course!

 

[jis]

Bottom line: People who perceive a benefit in the new schedule are going to like it, and the people who don't won't. I wouldn't be surprised if initially ridership will slow or slacken some while riders adjust to the new schedule.

If I lived in Houston, wanted to ride from LAX to TUS, or was directly connecting to/from the CS, I'd be happy.

None of the above apply to me. Anyone know of a good breakfast place open at 5:00 AM in LA? :wacko: Think there will be coffee in the sleepers at 4:30 in the AM? :blink: And what time does the Gold Line start operating? :lol:

LAUS needs a more substantial food concession somewhere in its vast interior.

 

[russianrail]

First, I want to thank Amtrak for thinking like a transportation system and concerned about train connections.

However, I have some issues/concerns (and I hope I am not giving anyone bad ideas about what to do).

1. Same day connections between the Southbound Coast Starlight and Eastbound Sunset Limited have a 1 hour connection. Does this mean that if #11 is more than say 2 hours late into Sacramento, will the connecting passengers be put on the San Joaquin at Martinez for a bus/train connection to LAX? If yes, at least they will get breakfast on #11.

2. Dining Car - we have all seen the problems with the 9:30pm eastbound departure of the Lake Shore Limited out of Chicago has been. With this in mind, are they going to do a similar reception for Sleeping Car passengers leaving LAX. I hesitate to write this, but are they going to "Eagle" the dining car crew (taking them on/off at Maricopa) meaning #1 will have an early dinner the night before and if running late no breakfast (or boxed breakfasts) into LAX? This means that #2 would end up with boxed breakfasts eastbound the first day, especially if running even a little bit late. We really need a dining car crew all the way into LAX.

3. Early arrival into LAX for #1 - Amtrak press release notes that sleeper car passengers can stay onboard until 0630. But, will they be woken up by the early morning announcement for the arrival? If #1 arrives early, will they kick the coach passengers off immediately or let them sleep in until 5:30? Also, will there be boxed breakfasts provided for sleeper passengers?

4. Eastbound connection with #22 is now down to under 3 hours (a little more with slack into SAS). How late will they hold #22 for the thru-cars if #2 is delayed?

Again, I think we are moving in a positive direction, even if some of the details are worrysome.

 

[The Davy Crockett]

LAUS needs a more substantial food concession somewhere in its vast interior.

YES!!! IMHO it is the one thing truly lacking at LAUS. ...Well that and maybe a Metropolitan Lounge. hboy:

 

[Trogdor]

2. Dining Car - we have all seen the problems with the 9:30pm eastbound departure of the Lake Shore Limited out of Chicago has been. With this in mind, are they going to do a similar reception for Sleeping Car passengers leaving LAX. I hesitate to write this, but are they going to "Eagle" the dining car crew (taking them on/off at Maricopa) meaning #1 will have an early dinner the night before and if running late no breakfast (or boxed breakfasts) into LAX? This means that #2 would end up with boxed breakfasts eastbound the first day, especially if running even a little bit late. We really need a dining car crew all the way into LAX.

Can't specifically answer the others, but for this one: The dining car crew is based in LAX, so they will run all the way through.

 

[Anderson]

In general, I like the shift around...the main thing I think that Amtrak needs to be clear on is allowing rooms to be occupied until a decent hour (even guaranteed occupancy until 6:30 AM wouldn't be that bad). To put it plainly, policy or not, I generally try to tip well...but there's a good chance that I would omit the tip in such a situation (either out of irritation or out of it's-4-AM-and-I'm-not-awake-ness). And so help me if I'm getting booted at 2 AM because the train ran early.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

In general, I like the shift around...the main thing I think that Amtrak needs to be clear on is allowing rooms to be occupied until a decent hour (even guaranteed occupancy until 6:30 AM wouldn't be that bad). To put it plainly, policy or not, I generally try to tip well...but there's a good chance that I would omit the tip in such a situation (either out of irritation or out of it's-4-AM-and-I'm-not-awake-ness). And so help me if I'm getting booted at 2 AM because the train ran early.

What seems to be missing from some of the pro-change posts is WHY the poster likes the change. Or why only sleeper passengers should be allowed to remain on board until a decent hour. Who do you think represents the vast majority of passengers Amtrak hauls? Sleeper passengers are a tiny minority of the total and will remain so into the foreseeable future. If only sleeper passengers can be accommodated at a reasonable arrival hour then the passenger totals and the revenue for the SL will likely drop even further.

To get a better feel for where all the pro-change views are coming from I'd like to make a list of MAJOR on-route cities with improved scheduling.

So far I have Houston and Tuscon.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

The impression I got from a conversation with the Director of National Operations is that normally it will be a same day turn around at LAX and overnight turn around in NOL. But as usual, with everything, what really happens is the final arbiter in these things. So we will just have to wait and see.

Technically, the train could have a same-day turnaround in LAX on Wednesday and Friday.

However, with the change in days of operations (which enables all the cost savings and the equipment set to be freed up in NOL), you'll have a train leaving LAX on Sunday, but the inbound equipment won't get in until Monday.

So, whether they do a same-day turn around on Wednesday and Friday, and hold the Monday arrival as a spare all week until the Sunday departure, or whether they have the two-day turnaround for each set, makes no real difference in the end as far as equipment utilization and availability goes.

My bet is that both will happen, depending on the needs of the specific equipment on the specific day/week.

So what you're saying is that there will not be saved equipment because it needs to sit in LAX for 6 days? Not good...

 

[johnny.menhennet]

Bottom line: People who perceive a benefit in the new schedule are going to like it, and the people who don't won't. I wouldn't be surprised if initially ridership will slow or slacken some while riders adjust to the new schedule.

If I lived in Houston, wanted to ride from LAX to TUS, or was directly connecting to/from the CS, I'd be happy.

None of the above apply to me. Anyone know of a good breakfast place open at 5:00 AM in LA? :wacko: Think there will be coffee in the sleepers at 4:30 in the AM? :blink: And what time does the Gold Line start operating? :lol:

LAUS needs a more substantial food concession somewhere in its vast interior.

Spending a lot of time at the station, I appreciate the food vendors they have now. Having a Wetzel's Pretzels, Subway, Starbucks, and a Famima convenience store are all welcome changes. In regards to food, I just wish they would have the Traxx restaurant open for lunch. It would be nice to be able to eat at a sit-down restaurant in the station for lunch.

 

[guest]

LAUS needs a more substantial food concession somewhere in its vast interior.

YES!!! IMHO it is the one thing truly lacking at LAUS. ...Well that and maybe a Metropolitan Lounge. hboy:

LAX has a full-service restaurant, a Subway, a Starbucks, Wetzel's Pretzels, and a 24 hour convenience store...not to mention an entire city downtown right outside the doors and/or a couple of stops away on the subway...I think that's sufficient...

 

[trainman74]

I'm currently booked via an AGR redemption on 421 CHI-LAX, departing on Thursday, June 14 (connecting from 49) -- I guess now I get to play a little game called When Will Amtrak Notify Me of the Change to 421's Day of Operation, and What Will They Want to Do About My Reservation?

My semi-educated guess is that the computer will say "hey, he wants to go CHI-LAX departing on 6/14" and automatically transfer me to the Chief, and they won't get around to notifying me of this until early June.

 

[Donctor]

The impression I got from a conversation with the Director of National Operations is that normally it will be a same day turn around at LAX and overnight turn around in NOL. But as usual, with everything, what really happens is the final arbiter in these things. So we will just have to wait and see.

Technically, the train could have a same-day turnaround in LAX on Wednesday and Friday.

However, with the change in days of operations (which enables all the cost savings and the equipment set to be freed up in NOL), you'll have a train leaving LAX on Sunday, but the inbound equipment won't get in until Monday.

So, whether they do a same-day turn around on Wednesday and Friday, and hold the Monday arrival as a spare all week until the Sunday departure, or whether they have the two-day turnaround for each set, makes no real difference in the end as far as equipment utilization and availability goes.

My bet is that both will happen, depending on the needs of the specific equipment on the specific day/week.

So what you're saying is that there will not be saved equipment because it needs to sit in LAX for 6 days? Not good...

No, what he's saying is that one of the four current sets will be saved, but that a third set is still required because a same-day turn isn't possible for one of the three weekly LAX turns. With three sets still needed, and with two LAX turns able to be same-day, the equipment turns can be done multiple ways.

Three sets will be needed regardless of how LAX decided to turn the equipment.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

The impression I got from a conversation with the Director of National Operations is that normally it will be a same day turn around at LAX and overnight turn around in NOL. But as usual, with everything, what really happens is the final arbiter in these things. So we will just have to wait and see.

Technically, the train could have a same-day turnaround in LAX on Wednesday and Friday.

However, with the change in days of operations (which enables all the cost savings and the equipment set to be freed up in NOL), you'll have a train leaving LAX on Sunday, but the inbound equipment won't get in until Monday.

So, whether they do a same-day turn around on Wednesday and Friday, and hold the Monday arrival as a spare all week until the Sunday departure, or whether they have the two-day turnaround for each set, makes no real difference in the end as far as equipment utilization and availability goes.

My bet is that both will happen, depending on the needs of the specific equipment on the specific day/week.

So what you're saying is that there will not be saved equipment because it needs to sit in LAX for 6 days? Not good...

No, what he's saying is that one of the four current sets will be saved, but that a third set is still required because a same-day turn isn't possible for one of the three weekly LAX turns. With three sets still needed, and with two LAX turns able to be same-day, the equipment turns can be done multiple ways.

Three sets will be needed regardless of how LAX decided to turn the equipment.

Ok thanks for clarifying Donctor.

 

[Gratt]

One hopes that Amtrak can use this announcement to start putting the pressure on UP to cave on their daily sunset extortion demands.

Again not hopeful, but it would make taking the sunset a heck of a lot easier knowing I could leave/return on any day of the week instead of trying to shoehorn my trip into the Sunset timetable.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

One hopes that Amtrak can use this announcement to start putting the pressure on UP to cave on their daily sunset extortion demands.

Again not hopeful, but it would make taking the sunset a heck of a lot easier knowing I could leave/return on any day of the week instead of trying to shoehorn my trip into the Sunset timetable.

Except that as part of the deal to go back to this schedule, Amtrak agreed to not pursue a daily Sunset for at least two more years.

 

[the_traveler]

All I can add is it's about time. Finally some decent times in and out of Houston and good times from Houston to SAS. I don't understand all the bitching as this was the plan all along.

You really can't understand why someone wouldn't want to head downtown at 2:00AM? You really can't fathom why people don't want to be kicked off the train at 4:30AM?

I feel sorry for you in SAS!

Having to get an early wake up call to get off!

How about SLC eastbound, receiving a 3 am wake up for about a 3:30 am arrival! Or PGH eastbound, receiving a 4:30 am wake up call for a 5 am arrival! And these happen EVERY DAY and have happened FOR YEARS! So poor SAS! You must change!

 

[Gratt]

One hopes that Amtrak can use this announcement to start putting the pressure on UP to cave on their daily sunset extortion demands.

Again not hopeful, but it would make taking the sunset a heck of a lot easier knowing I could leave/return on any day of the week instead of trying to shoehorn my trip into the Sunset timetable.

Except that as part of the deal to go back to this schedule, Amtrak agreed to not pursue a daily Sunset for at least two more years.

Really? I did not know that. Johnny, do you have any source I could read? I would love to see the details on that, and if their is any indication that a two year delay is more UP kicking the can down the road or their is a good chance that in two years we could see a concrete date (and reasonable cost) for a daily sunset.

 

[MikefromCrete]

One hopes that Amtrak can use this announcement to start putting the pressure on UP to cave on their daily sunset extortion demands.

Again not hopeful, but it would make taking the sunset a heck of a lot easier knowing I could leave/return on any day of the week instead of trying to shoehorn my trip into the Sunset timetable.

Except that as part of the deal to go back to this schedule, Amtrak agreed to not pursue a daily Sunset for at least two more years.

Really? I did not know that. Johnny, do you have any source I could read? I would love to see the details on that, and if their is any indication that a two year delay is more UP kicking the can down the road or their is a good chance that in two years we could see a concrete date (and reasonable cost) for a daily sunset.

A two-year moratorium on requests for any non-state supported trains was part of the deal, as reported by Trains News Wire. I doubt if it means that UP will cut its request for a BAZZILLION dollars to run a daily Sunset. It just means they don't even have to listen to any request for two years.

 

[njulian]

One hopes that Amtrak can use this announcement to start putting the pressure on UP to cave on their daily sunset extortion demands.

Again not hopeful, but it would make taking the sunset a heck of a lot easier knowing I could leave/return on any day of the week instead of trying to shoehorn my trip into the Sunset timetable.

Except that as part of the deal to go back to this schedule, Amtrak agreed to not pursue a daily Sunset for at least two more years.

Well darn as the 3 day a week schedule is difficult and I more often than not have to go to ABQ for the train because of it.

The new schedule is OK I guess (are there day changes eastbound? didn't catch that) for me, leaving ELP early is not a big deal and getting into LAX isn't so bad as I think Surfline starts early. But leaving LAX at 10 is a bit icky as being in downtown LA at night isn't such a great idea to me.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

One hopes that Amtrak can use this announcement to start putting the pressure on UP to cave on their daily sunset extortion demands.

Again not hopeful, but it would make taking the sunset a heck of a lot easier knowing I could leave/return on any day of the week instead of trying to shoehorn my trip into the Sunset timetable.

Except that as part of the deal to go back to this schedule, Amtrak agreed to not pursue a daily Sunset for at least two more years.

Well darn as the 3 day a week schedule is difficult and I more often than not have to go to ABQ for the train because of it.

The new schedule is OK I guess (are there day changes eastbound? didn't catch that) for me, leaving ELP early is not a big deal and getting into LAX isn't so bad as I think Surfline starts early. But leaving LAX at 10 is a bit icky as being in downtown LA at night isn't such a great idea to me.

The first Surfliner leaves LAX southbound at 6:10. An on-time or early arrival would allow you just enough time to get your checked bags or go the Starbucks before boarding. I think the 10:00P departure is a good thing though. The times are much much better for getting to Tucson and Maricopa. There are still Pacific Surfliner trains that leave at 10:10PM, so leaving at 10:00P, there will still be plenty of people inside the station, and there should not be any security problems.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

Will this new schedule change the consist at all? If Amtrak is predicting much higher ridership from the schedule change alone, then will another sleeper be added to the consists that aren't cut, etc.? Also, is demand high enough to warrant making two through-coaches to the Eagle?

 

[the_traveler]

But leaving LAX at 10 is a bit icky as being in downtown LA at night isn't such a great idea to me.

You'll be in the station anyway, so what's the difference?

It's not like Security kicks you outside and then only lets you in at train time!

 

[LA guest]

One hopes that Amtrak can use this announcement to start putting the pressure on UP to cave on their daily sunset extortion demands.

Again not hopeful, but it would make taking the sunset a heck of a lot easier knowing I could leave/return on any day of the week instead of trying to shoehorn my trip into the Sunset timetable.

Except that as part of the deal to go back to this schedule, Amtrak agreed to not pursue a daily Sunset for at least two more years.

Well darn as the 3 day a week schedule is difficult and I more often than not have to go to ABQ for the train because of it.

The new schedule is OK I guess (are there day changes eastbound? didn't catch that) for me, leaving ELP early is not a big deal and getting into LAX isn't so bad as I think Surfline starts early. But leaving LAX at 10 is a bit icky as being in downtown LA at night isn't such a great idea to me.

There are LOTS of bars, nightclubs, restaurants, stores, hotels, etc., all open and buzzing at that hour every night...most of downtown LA is walkable, shoppable, and safe, certainly on par with any other major city in the US.