Midwest flooding

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I'm supposed to take the EB from Spokane to Seattle on the 18th. I see the EB hasn't run at all the last couple of days. I'm supposed to go from Spokane on the EB, Seattle-Eugene and Eugene-Portland on the Cascades and Portland-Spokane on the EB. There are many ways to get from Spokane to Seattle other than by Amtrak, but taking the train is much more fun. Hopefully they'll be up and running by next week.
The EB has been running for the past few days, it's just taking a detour route between MSP and CHI. But that messes up the computers, which then report a service disruption. But member Wayman just came off a detoured EB, as noted in another topic.

I did see that and was aware that the EB was detoured over the old Great Northern route. What had me concerned, however, is that while it did list the EB running from MSP and points west yesterday, there's no indication of that today at all and I was worried that possibly it hasn't run over the detour route as well.
 
Sweet. <_< I called Julie this morning, and it appears that I have no options other than to cancel the trip with Amtrak. There's no way to use Amtrak to get from ROC to SAC on the dates we need. Delaying the trip a couple of days was no good, as all seats on the later trains were booked full.

In a hurry, today we elected to fly from ROC to SAC (or SMF, as the airline calls it). Interestingly, the round trip ticket on US AIR for the two of us is half the price of the round trip train ticket for the two of us, although we both think that that the train would have been a lot more fun. :D

Mother Nature just didn't seem to be in a cooperative mood on this Friday the 13th. <_<
Sorry to hear that. That is the nightmare scenario for me. I consider the traveling as part of the vacation. Air travel is definitely not. We are on the SWC and LSL next week. So far so good for those two trains, however, then seem to come awful close to all this flooding.
Please continue your travel info!!!
Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by that. Do you want more of my itinerary?
 
Does anyone know if the EB is definitely running (on a detoured route) from Chicago to MSP?

I am leaving Philadelphia tomorrow (Saturday) on the Pennsylvanian (#43) and am transferring to the Cap Limited (#29)

in Pittsburgh to Chicago, where I should be taking the EB (#7) on Sunday to Seattle.

I spoke to Amtrak this afternoon and they guy told me they would put me on a bus from CHI to MSP,

and then get on the EB at MSP.

Does anyone know if this is true, because I read somewhere else that the EB was running from CHI to SEA,

but they were just taking different tracks between CHI and MSP.

I'm also scheduled to be coming back on the CZ on the 21st of June from Sacramento to CHI. I hope they

have that running by then.
 
I just got home from a trip on the Empire Builder and arrived into Chicago yesterday (June 13th). The day before, I had heard the crew talking about a detour, and our attendant later confirmed that the train would be detouring east of MSP, as previously described here, with busses for connecting passengers. However, that night, the crew started saying that the train might be annulled totally in St. Paul, and the next morning, there was an announcement that everyone would have to detrain and board buses in the MSP because the BNSF detour route was also closed.

So, we arrived a little over an hour late into Midway Station at 8:15, and everyone proceeded to the station, where a long line stretched from a desk on the street side of the station all the way to the platform. One by one, each party went up to that desk, and was assigned to a bus. There were about five buses, but none of the would be serving Columbus or Portage because apparently they couldn't even get buses into those areas. I'm not sure I believe that--maybe Amtrak just didn't feel like taking the time to drive around flood waters to access the stations. Anyway, we finally got to the desk, boarded our assigned bus, and departed MSP by 9am.

A little before 11am, we pulled off I-94 in Osseo, WI, and the driver said that everyone could get off the bus to eat lunch at a Subway joint, and proceeded to tell us that they needed to find a new route because I-94 was closed...wonder why they needed to stop to do that with 2 drivers. Apparently, Amtrak had arranged for free lunch at a Burger King at exit 87, but the drivers were unable to find that exit--they said it didn't exist!

By 11:45, everyone was back on the bus, and we departed, soon exiting the interstate and taking route 21, where we encountered a lot of traffic, probably because of the closure. A few hours later, we finally merged onto I-39, but going NORTH! We finally exited and took another smaller road whose name I can't remember. The drivers seemed confused, and asked to borrow my map. Around 2pm, we pulled into a gas station, but there was absolutely no explanation from the drivers, so a few people got off and the rest stayed on, as everyone quickly lost faith in these drivers, especially as we saw one returning from the store with none other than an atlas! We finally got on highway 41 south in Oshkosh, WI, and reached Milwaukee around 7, where we encountered more traffic. As the Sears Tower came into view and we started crossing under Metra railroad bridges every few minutes, I thought this might be over, but that was not to be. We arrived in CUS at 7:50pm, 3 hours and 55 minutes late. The 2 buses parked right on busy Canal Street, trapping several taxis, who immediately lay on the horns.

We emerged from the bus to find a chaotic mess of luggage and people, with no Amtrak personnel in sight and a bunch of angry drivers and taxis. As the drivers pulled every last bit of checked luggage out of the buses, and dumped it on the sidewalk and some of it in the street, people began searching for their bags, but some of it was not to be found. Several Redcaps came out of the station, and we and several other people asked him about our bags. Some people weren't so friendly--one lady screamed at him that she would sue him for every piece of luggage she didn't have! He wasn't sure exactly what was going on, but soon found out from Amtrak that there were only two buses. He took us down to Passenger Services, where they told us to go to "Lounge G". Apparently, this is a room that is used for passengers who miss connections or have other problems such as hours but is also a wi-fi hotspot. We waited in a long line of people from our train in this messy room, with computers strewn everywhere and only a few agents handling passengers. We decided to come back the next day, and the next morning, we did indeed find our luggage, which had probably come in on a later bus which made stops at the missed stations.

I could comment forever about what Amtrak should have done better, but I understand that this is a difficult situation, and we were the first train to be totally cancelled. This turned out a lot longer than I intended...I'll post a trip report of the full trip later.
 
I've eaten at that very Burger King, courtesy of Amtrak. The EB was super late arriving to MSP one time, so they took us from MSP to CUS on buses, and stopped at that Burger King and Amtrak provided lunch. I can't say it was great, but I was happy that Amtrak took care of us.

I'd probably try to cut the drivers some slack on their long and winding journey through the nether regions of Wisconsin. Get off of 94/39 and it's easy to get lost; been there, done that.
 
By 11:45, everyone was back on the bus, and we departed, soon exiting the interstate and taking route 21, where we encountered a lot of traffic, probably because of the closure. A few hours later, we finally merged onto I-39, but going NORTH! We finally exited and took another smaller road whose name I can't remember. The drivers seemed confused, and asked to borrow my map. Around 2pm, we pulled into a gas station, but there was absolutely no explanation from the drivers, so a few people got off and the rest stayed on, as everyone quickly lost faith in these drivers, especially as we saw one returning from the store with none other than an atlas! We finally got on highway 41 south in Oshkosh, WI, and reached Milwaukee around 7, where we encountered more traffic. As the Sears Tower came into view and we started crossing under Metra railroad bridges every few minutes, I thought this might be over, but that was not to be. We arrived in CUS at 7:50pm, 3 hours and 55 minutes late. The 2 buses parked right on busy Canal Street, trapping several taxis, who immediately lay on the horns.
I think I personally would see acquiring a missing tool (the atlas) in that situation to be a good sign. And I certainly wouldn't want to strand myself at a gas station in the middle of nowhere.

Getting lost when traveling in unfamiliar territory also isn't unique to buses in the midwest. I was talking with an MBTA inspector today who mentioned that some of the bus drivers from across town got lost trying follow the Red Line route from Kendall to JFK. (We had scheduled bustitution because of track work on the Longfellow bridge. Then this afternoon there was an unscheduled fire near South Station that dramatically extended the length of the bustitution.)
 
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Oof! :blink: Well, first and most important, I'm glad you made it home!

However, that night, the crew started saying that the train might be annulled totally in St. Paul, and the next morning, there was an announcement that everyone would have to detrain and board buses in the MSP because the BNSF detour route was also closed.
.

I had no idea I'd be on the last EB eastbound from MSP, though I started wondering about the safety of the BNSF detour once I was traveling down the Hudson on the LSL. When the LSL skirts the riverbank, it looked like there was always a good six feet or more of elevation difference between railbed and waterlevel, with maybe a 45-degree rocky slope down to the river. On the BNSF detour, that elevation difference was maybe two feet.

Is the detour closed to all traffic, or just to Amtrak? Do we know?

I can forgive the drivers not knowing how best to get from MSP to CHI, given that they probably don't drive that route regularly and they certainly wouldn't have practice doing it with the Interstate closed and heavy traffic. I can forgive the drivers not being skilled at unloading at CHI (though it sounds like they weren't just unskilled, but totally inept at unloading luggage).

But Amtrak should have gotten the right bags on the right buses. And Amtrak should have Met You At CHI, At The Buses, and taken care of you from there. That they didn't do that for you, and didn't do that for my EB a day earlier (meeting us on the platform) is just inexcusable, given how much advance time they had to prepare for passengers' late arrival.

At least you arrived well in time (as did we) for anyone connecting to the LSL, for getting people who need them to hotels before 10pm, etc. It sounds like every connecting train except the LSL was missed (unlike in our case, where I assume the buses from MSP got to CHI in time for people to make the Cardinal and Michigan trains... don't know for sure either way, though).

Here's hoping that after two days of blowing it, they'll start to develop a routine and get it right. They've got a week of this to deal with, it sounds like.
 
If Amtrak used the same charter company since the 10th or whenever the detour/busing for connecting passengers started, then they should be able to find their way, but I guess I was a little harsh on them...the only thing that should have been handled much better was the baggage situation. I'm pretty sure the BNSF route is closed to all traffic--the crew said that one or more bridges were "washed out"-whether that means collapsed or just underwater.
 
Yeah, definitely agree that the way the handled luggage sounds like it sucked. That's not cool; they ought to be able to get a bag from point A to point B.
 
OK - I need help. Am traveling EB (7) on Wednesday the 18th out of Chicago to the west coast. I am a big guy - 6'5' AND 280. My wife is not small either. How much room is there on these buses between seats. Am I going to be squashed? Still time to book a plane or drive. Don't want to but may have to. Must leave that date if driving.

Anyone?

Thanks!!!!!
 
If Amtrak used the same charter company since the 10th or whenever the detour/busing for connecting passengers started, then they should be able to find their way, but I guess I was a little harsh on them...the only thing that should have been handled much better was the baggage situation. I'm pretty sure the BNSF route is closed to all traffic--the crew said that one or more bridges were "washed out"-whether that means collapsed or just underwater.
Even if Amtrak did use the same bus company, SO WHAT?

Bus drivers have hours of service laws too, so the odds are good that it wasn't the same drivers. There were probably already down in Chicago. And Amtrak didn't bus everyone the first few days, only those getting off in between CUS and MSP, so that means that less buses and drivers were needed. Finally, during the first few days that buses might have been running, I-94 wasn't closed.

This is a very dynamic situation that is changing daily. Frankly IMHO you should be down on your knees thanking those drivers for even agreeing to drive those buses under those conditions. Sorry to be harsh, but quite honestly under the tragic circumstances that are seeing floods at levels never seen before, you're lucky that you weren't left standing in MSP.

Now I won't disagree that some aspects of things could have been done better, like having people meet the buses at CUS, having more staff and computers in room G, and stuff like that. Although it also needs to be remembered that it's not just the EB that's being affected by this. The CZ is also cancelled between CUS and points further west. But still it does sound like they could have done a bit better on things at CUS.

But again, this is a dynamic and very difficult situation for anyone to handle. We're approaching the magnatude of loosing both Midway and O'Hare to a 5 day blizzard in Chicago. This is not a situation where one can snap a few fingers and fix things. Sorry. :(
 
OK - I need help. Am traveling EB (7) on Wednesday the 18th out of Chicago to the west coast. I am a big guy - 6'5' AND 280. My wife is not small either. How much room is there on these buses between seats. Am I going to be squashed? Still time to book a plane or drive. Don't want to but may have to. Must leave that date if driving.
I don't think there is any guarantee about how much legroom will happen to be available on whichever random bus Amtrak ends up finding for your particular trip.
 
Looks like the cancellation in MSP was only for one day....at least according to Amtrak.com. The latest advisory mentions the BNSF detour but nothing about the bussing on MSP-CHI. It looks like they just posted the original advisory again which was sent out on June 13th.

Empire Builder, Trains 7/27/807 & 8/28/808

Service by the Empire Builder to all points in Wisconsin, plus Red Wing and Winona, Minn., has been temporarily suspended since June 10, due to flooding on the Canadian Pacific Railway route and a resulting detour on the BNSF Railway.

Alternate transportation by chartered motorcoach has been provided to Minnesota and Wisconsin points, but flooding conditions have led to a temporary suspension of alternate transportation for the Empire Builder to and from Wisconsin Dells, Portage, Columbus and Milwaukee, Wisc., and Glenview, Ill., effective June 13. Amtrak Hiawatha Service trains are available as alternate transportation to and from Glenview and Milwaukee.
 
The Empire Builder is not operating between Chicago and Minneapolis until at least Tuesday (6/17). Both the CP and BNSF routes are closed.

Empire Builder, Trains 7/27/807 & 8/28/808
Service by the Empire Builder between St. Paul and Chicago is temporarily suspended due to flooding on the Canadian Pacific Railway route, effective June 10, and the closing of a detour route on the BNSF Railway, effective June 15.

Alternate transportation by chartered motorcoach will be provided between St. Paul and Chicago, with the exceptions of Portage, Columbus and Milwaukee, Wisc., and Glenview, Ill. Amtrak Hiawatha Service trains are available as alternate transportation to and from Glenview and Milwaukee.
 
If Amtrak used the same charter company since the 10th or whenever the detour/busing for connecting passengers started, then they should be able to find their way, but I guess I was a little harsh on them...the only thing that should have been handled much better was the baggage situation. I'm pretty sure the BNSF route is closed to all traffic--the crew said that one or more bridges were "washed out"-whether that means collapsed or just underwater.
Even if Amtrak did use the same bus company, SO WHAT?

Bus drivers have hours of service laws too, so the odds are good that it wasn't the same drivers. There were probably already down in Chicago. And Amtrak didn't bus everyone the first few days, only those getting off in between CUS and MSP, so that means that less buses and drivers were needed. Finally, during the first few days that buses might have been running, I-94 wasn't closed.

This is a very dynamic situation that is changing daily. Frankly IMHO you should be down on your knees thanking those drivers for even agreeing to drive those buses under those conditions. Sorry to be harsh, but quite honestly under the tragic circumstances that are seeing floods at levels never seen before, you're lucky that you weren't left standing in MSP.

Now I won't disagree that some aspects of things could have been done better, like having people meet the buses at CUS, having more staff and computers in room G, and stuff like that. Although it also needs to be remembered that it's not just the EB that's being affected by this. The CZ is also cancelled between CUS and points further west. But still it does sound like they could have done a bit better on things at CUS.

But again, this is a dynamic and very difficult situation for anyone to handle. We're approaching the magnatude of loosing both Midway and O'Hare to a 5 day blizzard in Chicago. This is not a situation where one can snap a few fingers and fix things. Sorry. :(
Sorry, I should have clarified, it wasn't just the drivers who couldn't find their way, and i wouldn't expect them to be able to themselves, but it was the bus company who was giving the drivers directions by radio. But still I think you're right, considering the situation..I'm just now finding out about how much flooding there really was.
 
OK - I need help. Am traveling EB (7) on Wednesday the 18th out of Chicago to the west coast. I am a big guy - 6'5' AND 280. My wife is not small either. How much room is there on these buses between seats. Am I going to be squashed? Still time to book a plane or drive. Don't want to but may have to. Must leave that date if driving.
I don't think there is any guarantee about how much legroom will happen to be available on whichever random bus Amtrak ends up finding for your particular trip.
Yeah, but you can make a good guess; seems like those type of buses are all very similar. If you've ever ridden Megabus or Greyhound, or a longer-run commuter bus line (that has "nice buses" compared to locals), that's likely what you're going to end up on. That is indeed what I ended up on the one time Amtrak bussed me from MSP to CUS.

If I were Ed and I was pretty sure I was going to end up on a bus, I'd find another way to go. It is not roomy at all. It's just a bus, and you'll be squished. It didn't kill me -- and I take the Megabus periodically so I'm no stranger to the bus -- but if I had time and money to fly instead, I likely would. Much shorter time squished on a plane, versus a much longer time squished on a bus.
 
Ok...we leave for NYC via CHI from LNK in just 10 days. Today I looked at renting a car (too expensive) SWA (expensive but do you book 1 way or RT?!?) :angry: Greyhound (it almost took as much time to navigate thier website as it does to get to CHI......12 hours!) :angry: So I figure if worst comes to worst, we can just plain old drive to Chicago and board the Lakeshore. Is this jumping the gun on all of this flooding? We were going to keep this quiet from my girlfriends girls but their dad brought it up and now we have two teens saying, "we can't cancel the trip" :huh: we also have alot of moolah dumped in to Broadway tickets etc. So, should we just hope and pray? Starting lining up options? Or what? Thanks! We depart on the CZ from Lincoln NE on Wednesday June 25th. My 2nd option was the Southwest Chief out of KCY, but its sold out.
 
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Al,

Starting to look at alternative is ok, but I don't think that I'd panic just yet either. The water is already starting to go down in Cedar Rapids, so things are starting to receede. And they only just lost the CZ route a day or two ago, so that should mean that it will be one of the first things to dry out also. So I think that there is a pretty good chance that they'll have the route up and running by the time you depart.

One other alternative that you could talk to Amtrak about though, might be to go to KCS. Yes, I know that you said that the train is sold out, but first off Amtrak might well make an exception in this case, even though it might mean you don't get seats in coach. You might land in the cafe car.

Additionally, although it would most likely mean staying over in Chicago for one night, you could also take the Ann Rutledge from KCS to reach Chicago. Amtrak is bustituting the first part of the trip, since UP is diverting all of it's freight trains via that route, but it would still get you to Chicago.
 
Starting to look at alternative is ok, but I don't think that I'd panic just yet either. The water is already starting to go down in Cedar Rapids, so things are starting to receede. And they only just lost the CZ route a day or two ago, so that should mean that it will be one of the first things to dry out also. So I think that there is a pretty good chance that they'll have the route up and running by the time you depart.
Unfortunately, though, there is continuing flooding in other towns. The Cedar has crested, but other rivers have not yet.

Burlington and Ottumwa--two cities served by the CZ--are still in the process of fighting off rising waters.

It may be some time before service is restored.
 
So the SWC is sold out on coach fare but there's still sleeper space available. Our trip is all in sleepers and its AGR points both Brenda and I have acrued for the last 2 1/2 years combined. So would Amtrak put us in a sleeper? The duration of the trip isn't real long and there's still space available in all 3 sleeper catergories. I would be to the point where the baggage car would be fine! :lol:
 
Well it's up to you Al, but maybe you want to talk with AGR about getting reticketed onto the SWC. But that does still pose a problem for you as you need to get to that train, and then there is the issue of will that train go out of action as the waters head further south.

On the other hand, waiting could mean that the Chief does sell out in the next week or so.

It's a tough gamble I have to say, wait and hope that they get the CZ back online in time or trek down to KC and hope that they don't close that line in the next week.
 
My Mother, my Stepfather, and I are going from Chicago to Seattle on the Empire Builder in 1 week and 14 Days. would the Route be restored by then?
 
My Mother, my Stepfather, and I are going from Chicago to Seattle on the Empire Builder in 1 week and 14 Days. would the Route be restored by then?
I make no promises, since at least at the moment AFAIK the tracks are still underwater. But assuming that there are no major washouts, with the rivers in that area already starting to recede, I would think that they have a very good chance on getting through by train.

However even if things don't progress well enough to restore train service, Amtrak is at least bussing people between Minneapolis and Chicago.
 
So the SWC is sold out on coach fare but there's still sleeper space available. Our trip is all in sleepers and its AGR points both Brenda and I have acrued for the last 2 1/2 years combined. So would Amtrak put us in a sleeper? The duration of the trip isn't real long and there's still space available in all 3 sleeper catergories. I would be to the point where the baggage car would be fine! :lol:
I've ridden in an ex-PRR B60 baggage. It's quite roomy in there, a lot bigger than the Superliner family bedroom! :lol:

(The West Chester RR, where I briefly volunteered, turned a B60 baggage into their snack car for excursion runs.)

Good luck, Al. I can't offer much advice, I'm afraid.
 
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