Definitions of 'quiet' in the Quiet Car

[JackieTakestheTrain]

Question: What is 'quiet' in a the Quiet Car?

I traveled in the Quiet Car from Boston to DC RT because I needed to get some work done. Here is what I witnessed on both legs of my trip.

To DC:

Train attendent informed everyone as they boarded that they were in the Quiet Car and that included no loud or long converstations and no cellphone conversations of any kind and to turn off everything that beeped, whistled, chimed or rang electronically.

For the most part, this was observed -- EXCEPT two guys who got on in NYC and proceeded to sit at a table for 4 with another passenger who was sitting there first. The two guys immediately started in a quietish conversation but one that was continous. I don't know exactly what happened, BUT next thing I knew I heard some loudish words exchanged between the original guy sitting at the table and these two. Basically, he told them to "knock off the talking" because it was the Quiet Car. The two guys looked at him in disbelief because they couldn't believe that 1) someone had dared interrupted them and 2) who was this guy to tell them to be quiet -- the Noise Police?

I don't know what was said, but the next thing I knew the two guys got up kinda huffy and left...and life was good in the Quiet Car.

From DC to Boston:

Well, this was really amazing.. I had 3 incidents of a not-so-quiet Quiet Car all in one trip!

Incident One:

The train attendant comes through and reminds everyone about the rules and spirit of the Quiet Car. She said, and I am quoting "No conversations that last longer than a minute and even those should be whispers. It should not be audible to anyone else other than the person to whom you are speaking." Someone made a smart-a** crack about her being a drill sergerant and was probably hard on her kids, but she took this friendly jabs in stride as part of her work (her words not mine.)

Well as soon as she left, a female passenger comes from some other part of the train and YELLS in her best backyard voice 'Henry, Henry, I found us two seats!" She was giddy as if she had won the lottery. Henry, troddled up a bit later and sat beside her and so we thought we all OK...

Until the train attendant came back and repeated her instructions about the rules and spirit of the Quiet Car. Both of them said OK, loudly, I might add and she left them alone.

Well, you know what happened. They started to talk, and talk, and talk and as they did, Henry's voice got louder and louder and louder until finally, I, sitting 6 rows up in front of him heard every single word he said.

Train attendant comes back, politely reminds them of the rules and spirit of the Quiet Car, both swore they wouldn't talk again...and you know what happened...

Time #3, attendant comes to tell them to shut up (OK, my words, not hers!) and now Henry has a major tandrum. Yep, you read it..tantrum. He proceeds to tell her that in fact the sign for the Quiet Car says nothing about limiting conversation or about whispering. She told him she knew that but he was missing the point -- that his voice volume was annoying others (true!). He then went on to say that he had to talk his wife because he was explaining something to her. (DUH!) So, attendant said "OK, let me help you find another seat where you two can be comfortable." Henry continues to be pissy, basically, said "I have a right to sit here and talk. I can't help it if my voice is louder than you wish and you are just being mean to me."

Train attendant says OK and goes to get the conductor -- which is never a good thing....

Conductor, clearly visibly irritated that he has come back there, singles out Henry and asks what's the problem. Henry, now a little less hostile but still asserting his right to talk, explains his side of things. Conductor repeats attendant's instructions and asks if they need to be relocated. Henry said only if they could guarantee he and his wife could sit together. Conductor said there are no such guarantees on Amtrak but there were plenty of seats *AND* that Henry has now been warned and if the Conductor has to come back again, it won't be pretty. (Ok, I might have added that part, but he did warn him.)

So Henry and his equally loud wife sat and stewed for about 10 minutes and then Henry got up cursing and they left the Quiet Car....

Incident Two:

In NYC, two women get on the train and sit behind me across from each other and are talking about being in the Quiet Car. They agree it is OK because they won't talk.

You know what happened, they started talking...loud...

I gave them my polite "head turn" a signal to be quiet the first time...no response.

A second time, I turned my head, lasting a bit longer and trying to make eye contact..no response, kept talking...

Finally, before I could get "shut up" out of my mouth, the man sitting across from me told them to knock it off!

The one woman said to the other "Geesh, I guess we aren't even allowed to talk in the Quiet Car!" The one got up very huffy, nearly dropping her bag on my head and the other sat and stewed until she fell asleep.

Last Quiet Car incident:

Guy's cellphone rang and he started to talk on it quietly...train attendant (a different one than Henry's friend) walks by and rips the Quiet Car card from the ceiling and sticks it in the passenger's face!!!!!!!! I laughed...I couldn't help it.

Guy got off cellphone..immediately.

So, here's what I wanna know:

1. How quiet do you have to be in the Quiet Car? I ate an apple and was fearful it was too noisy --seriously.

2. What are the rules of etiquette for telling someone to knock it off who is being too noisy? I think going to get an attendant to rat someone out is not a good thing, however, I also am not sure that directly confronting someone is always the way to go. Henry was the type who would have not responded to another passnger who told him to keep it down. In fact, he would have escalated it into something far, far scarier than just a loud conversation....

Love to hear others' thoughts on this topic.

-- Jackie

 

[sky12065]

Question: What is 'quiet' in a the Quiet Car?
I traveled in the Quiet Car from Boston to DC RT because I needed to get some work done. Here is what I witnessed on both legs of my trip.

To DC:

Train attendent informed everyone as they boarded that they were in the Quiet Car and that included no loud or long converstations and no cellphone conversations of any kind and to turn off everything that beeped, whistled, chimed or rang electronically.

For the most part, this was observed -- EXCEPT two guys who got on in NYC and proceeded to sit at a table for 4 with another passenger who was sitting there first. The two guys immediately started in a quietish conversation but one that was continous. I don't know exactly what happened, BUT next thing I knew I heard some loudish words exchanged between the original guy sitting at the table and these two. Basically, he told them to "knock off the talking" because it was the Quiet Car. The two guys looked at him in disbelief because they couldn't believe that 1) someone had dared interrupted them and 2) who was this guy to tell them to be quiet -- the Noise Police?

I don't know what was said, but the next thing I knew the two guys got up kinda huffy and left...and life was good in the Quiet Car.

From DC to Boston:

Well, this was really amazing.. I had 3 incidents of a not-so-quiet Quiet Car all in one trip!

Incident One:

The train attendant comes through and reminds everyone about the rules and spirit of the Quiet Car. She said, and I am quoting "No conversations that last longer than a minute and even those should be whispers. It should not be audible to anyone else other than the person to whom you are speaking." Someone made a smart-a** crack about her being a drill sergerant and was probably hard on her kids, but she took this friendly jabs in stride as part of her work (her words not mine.)

Well as soon as she left, a female passenger comes from some other part of the train and YELLS in her best backyard voice 'Henry, Henry, I found us two seats!" She was giddy as if she had won the lottery. Henry, troddled up a bit later and sat beside her and so we thought we all OK...

Until the train attendant came back and repeated her instructions about the rules and spirit of the Quiet Car. Both of them said OK, loudly, I might add and she left them alone.

Well, you know what happened. They started to talk, and talk, and talk and as they did, Henry's voice got louder and louder and louder until finally, I, sitting 6 rows up in front of him heard every single word he said.

Train attendant comes back, politely reminds them of the rules and spirit of the Quiet Car, both swore they wouldn't talk again...and you know what happened...

Time #3, attendant comes to tell them to shut up (OK, my words, not hers!) and now Henry has a major tandrum. Yep, you read it..tantrum. He proceeds to tell her that in fact the sign for the Quiet Car says nothing about limiting conversation or about whispering. She told him she knew that but he was missing the point -- that his voice volume was annoying others (true!). He then went on to say that he had to talk his wife because he was explaining something to her. (DUH!) So, attendant said "OK, let me help you find another seat where you two can be comfortable." Henry continues to be pissy, basically, said "I have a right to sit here and talk. I can't help it if my voice is louder than you wish and you are just being mean to me."

Train attendant says OK and goes to get the conductor -- which is never a good thing....

Conductor, clearly visibly irritated that he has come back there, singles out Henry and asks what's the problem. Henry, now a little less hostile but still asserting his right to talk, explains his side of things. Conductor repeats attendant's instructions and asks if they need to be relocated. Henry said only if they could guarantee he and his wife could sit together. Conductor said there are no such guarantees on Amtrak but there were plenty of seats *AND* that Henry has now been warned and if the Conductor has to come back again, it won't be pretty. (Ok, I might have added that part, but he did warn him.)

So Henry and his equally loud wife sat and stewed for about 10 minutes and then Henry got up cursing and they left the Quiet Car....

Incident Two:

In NYC, two women get on the train and sit behind me across from each other and are talking about being in the Quiet Car. They agree it is OK because they won't talk.

You know what happened, they started talking...loud...

I gave them my polite "head turn" a signal to be quiet the first time...no response.

A second time, I turned my head, lasting a bit longer and trying to make eye contact..no response, kept talking...

Finally, before I could get "shut up" out of my mouth, the man sitting across from me told them to knock it off!

The one woman said to the other "Geesh, I guess we aren't even allowed to talk in the Quiet Car!" The one got up very huffy, nearly dropping her bag on my head and the other sat and stewed until she fell asleep.

Last Quiet Car incident:

Guy's cellphone rang and he started to talk on it quietly...train attendant (a different one than Henry's friend) walks by and rips the Quiet Car card from the ceiling and sticks it in the passenger's face!!!!!!!! I laughed...I couldn't help it.

Guy got off cellphone..immediately.

So, here's what I wanna know:

1. How quiet do you have to be in the Quiet Car? I ate an apple and was fearful it was too noisy --seriously.

2. What are the rules of etiquette for telling someone to knock it off who is being too noisy? I think going to get an attendant to rat someone out is not a good thing, however, I also am not sure that directly confronting someone is always the way to go. Henry was the type who would have not responded to another passnger who told him to keep it down. In fact, he would have escalated it into something far, far scarier than just a loud conversation....

Love to hear others' thoughts on this topic.

-- Jackie

Looks like these were situations where a big gruff gorilla of an individual whose knuckles were dragging on the floor could have come in handy! He could have gotten right in the face of these people and stare them in the eye with a mean look :angry2: that says "I eat nails and loud mouths for breakfast." How's that for a solution that stays within the quiet rule!

 

[AlanB]

Well the general rule that most crews actually announce over the PA is that one must maintain a library like atmosphere in the Quiet car. That would allow for some occasional whispered conversation, but not a steady and continuous conversation. And even if the signs don't mention the rules, they are listed in the timetable and online. Of course many people never bother to read the rules under any circumstances.

 

[wayman]

Of course many people never bother to read the rules under any circumstances.

And many people who do read the rules--sadly, I should limit this to "many Americans, and some Europeans" as there really is quite a difference in my experience--know deep in their hearts that "the rules are for other people" and that anyone who tells them otherwise is quite simply wrong.

 

[the_traveler]

Of course many people never bother to read the rules under any circumstances.

And many people who do read the rules--sadly, I should limit this to "many Americans, and some Europeans" as there really is quite a difference in my experience--know deep in their hearts that "the rules are for other people" and that anyone who tells them otherwise is quite simply wrong.

I agree. That think "The rule is for others - but it couldn't be meant for ME!"

 

[PRR 60]

Well the general rule that most crews actually announce over the PA is that one must maintain a library like atmosphere in the Quiet car. That would allow for some occasional whispered conversation, but not a steady and continuous conversation. And even if the signs don't mention the rules, they are listed in the timetable and online. Of course many people never bother to read the rules under any circumstances.

The rule, as stated in the timetable, is that speech must be "in subdued tones." There is no stated prohibition of steady conversation if it is reasonably quiet (not necessarily whispered). In fact, if you read the description, is does not appear that anything is "prohibited". Amtrak is asking, not requiring.

Quiet CarMany Northeast Corridor and Hiawatha Service trains have a Quiet car where customers are asked not to use cellular phones, pagers or the sound feature of laptop computers, and to speak only in subdued tones.

 

[MattW]

Got a question about the "spirit" of the quiet car. One the Crescent last July, my mom and I boarded in Gainesville bound for Birminghman while my dad drove ahead to pick us up. This was of course early in the morning when people were still asleep before Atlanta and I contacted my dad using my cellphone to let him know where we were and when we might reach Birmingham. Even though we weren't in the quiet car (that I know of) I still bent over in my seat and barely whispered into my phone (those things mics' have great fidelity!) for perhaps 20 seconds (no, I'm not talkative). If at some point in the future I do find myself in the quiet car would a brief, whispered 20 second talk into a cellphone be within the "spirit" of the car? (I keep it on vibrate any ways so no noise emitted)

 

[the_traveler]

Even though we weren't in the quiet car (that I know of)

The Crescent (and any other LD trains) do not have "Quiet Cars". Those are basically on the NEC, and only on trains that travel between BOS and WAS only. (If a train starts in BOS but goes to VA, it does not have a quiet car!)

 

[Crescent Mark]

This sounds really interesting to me. If you are a worn out traveler or a business person that needs some shut eye...the Quiet Car is perfect. I'd like to travel on one in the NEC sometime.....

They are on both Acela and Northeast Regionals, right? Interesting the Cascades and Surfliners don't have them as well.

 

[wayman]

Got a question about the "spirit" of the quiet car. One the Crescent last July, my mom and I boarded in Gainesville bound for Birminghman while my dad drove ahead to pick us up. This was of course early in the morning when people were still asleep before Atlanta and I contacted my dad using my cellphone to let him know where we were and when we might reach Birmingham. Even though we weren't in the quiet car (that I know of) I still bent over in my seat and barely whispered into my phone (those things mics' have great fidelity!) for perhaps 20 seconds (no, I'm not talkative). If at some point in the future I do find myself in the quiet car would a brief, whispered 20 second talk into a cellphone be within the "spirit" of the car? (I keep it on vibrate any ways so no noise emitted)

I would say that such a exceptional phone call is ok, under those particular circumstance (letting someone know you're ok, you made the train, when to meet you) and with that very thoughtful manner (brief, quiet). But be aware that someone else may see you making a call, and then make one of their own with less regard for the quiet car, etc; or that someone else may see you making a call and bark at you despite your care and situation.

I would recommend heading to the cafe to make any call if you're seated in the quiet car (and heading there in any event if you're intending to place a longer call, even if you're in regular coach or Acela BC or on a long-distance, etc). A quick call like that is quite important, but probably not so time-sensitive that it couldn't wait five or ten minutes until you can get to the cafe just to be extra safe.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

This sounds really interesting to me. If you are a worn out traveler or a business person that needs some shut eye...the Quiet Car is perfect. I'd like to travel on one in the NEC sometime.....
They are on both Acela and Northeast Regionals, right? Interesting the Cascades and Surfliners don't have them as well.

I think there is kind of a unique business oriented culture on the Acelas,for example. While we railfans are usually taking a vacation, many of those travelers are there purely because they decide it fits their busy non-vacation,non-chit chat travel times better than the plane.

Not sure how to say it and make sense, but I suspect the Pacific Surfliner does not have proportionately as many high--octane business travelers(some of them busy on the train) as in the N.E. corrider.

A place where a business person can pore over documents etc without 17 screaming babies around is kind of what this is about, I think. You don't see these passengers taking pictures, marveling over the scenery etc as on the California Zephyr, for example.

And the whole concept of a "quiet car" is really very new, so far as I can remember.

 

[JackieTakestheTrain]

On the spirit of the Quiet Car and making or taking a phone call:

You know, I think this really boils down to common sense and common manners (which I admit aren't always so common.)

I think, if possible, it is best to get up and leave your seat to take or make a call. If that is not possible, I think explaining to whomever you are calling or whomever is calling you that you are in the Quiet Car and can't talk long or loud and then make it a fast conversation. I think beyond that, you should try to arrange for the call later or call them at the next stop.

Even with this last approach, people still may look at you and roll their eyes or make eyecontact (like I did at the two ladies behind me). I was more annoyed with them because the nature of their conversation was *NOT* an emergency and I had heard them say when they boarded that they knew they were sitting in the Quiet Car and then they chose to talk loudly anyway!

I guess that is why they call it public transportation...

I have seen this go to some extremes.

On an overnight train from Boston to DC, which I am not sure runs anymore, a guy got on in Back Bay. It may have been about 10 p.m. or so, I don't recall. Anyway, he immediately sat down and got on his cellphone. He called one number after another telling everyone what a long night he had in front of him because he was riding the train and bored, yaddayaddayadda.

A conductor happened to come by and asked him to be quieter on the phone. Guy nodded and kept talking, only more softly.

An hour later, guy was back at full-volume and conductor comes by again and told the guy if he didn't shut off the phone, he would confisicate it.

The phone went off.

And I got some sleep.

Similiar kinda thing but on a bus:

I was on a very crowded NYC bus going uptown on a weekday during rush hour. The bus was packed. A young lady was on her cellphone in the seat in front of me and she was talking at full-tilt volume, laughing her head off. I was travelling with my mom.

Next thing I know a woman *standing* next to where my mother was seated, reaches past my mom, taps the girl on the shoulder and hands the girl a piece of paper that looked like a card or something with a big cellphone on it and the circle and diagonal line through it...like those signs that show you something is prohibited. She immediately glared at my mom, who quickly pointed to the lady standing.

I don't know what the words said,but next thing I knew, the girl's conversation ended and she turned around and gave the lady a nasty look.

I overheard the woman tell her friend she bought those cards because she was tired of hearing people talk too loudly on cellphones.

I don't think I would ever have the balls (or female equivalent) to hand someone a card, but ya never know. I guess I just want people to be a bit considerate when they are on cellphones.

-- Jackie

 

[Trogdor]

When I ride the Hiawatha, I usually head for the Quiet Car, because it is more relaxed.

Here are some simple rules that I made up:

Cell phone should be on vibrate, so nobody else hears it. If it rings (and, based on the number, you think it's important enough to answer), immediately start walking to the next car so you can answer it.

If you're expecting a phone call, just save yourself (and everyone else) the trouble, and sit in another car right off the bat.

In general, not all phone calls need to be answered right away. If it's important, they'll leave a message. If it's really important, they'll call back again.

If you need to make a quick phone call, head to the next car. If you need to make a longer phone call, find a seat in another car.

If you are traveling with someone else, it's okay to make brief statements (quietly), such as pointing out an item of interest that your train is passing. If you need to have a conversation, go to another car.

Simple as that.

 

[the_traveler]

On an overnight train from Boston to DC, which I am not sure runs anymore

Yes, it still runs.

hands the girl a piece of paper that looked like a card or something with a big cellphone on it and the circle and diagonal line through it...like those signs that show you something is prohibited.
...

I don't think I would ever have the balls (or female equivalent) to hand someone a card, but ya never know.

I like it - and just may do it!

 

[Alice]

Text messages instead of voice calls?

 

[tp49]

Text messages instead of voice calls?

If going that route then put the phone on "silent" as you can still hear the vibrate function especially if it's on the amtable which seems to amplify the phone's vibrate.

 

[VentureForth]

On Japan's commuter trains, they ask that your phone be placed on "Manner" mode. Nice how they so gently get to the point right away - it's all about manners.

 

[julieandrews]

I think maybe the quiet cars are better suited to people travelling on their own? It's human nature to talk and if you're travelling with somebody you know, the temptation to talk to them at some point on a long journey is pretty strong so maybe people travelling with others would be better off in a different carraige

Lots of English trains have quiet cars but all they enforce is no mobile phones/loud personal music players/beepy electronic stuff. Loud conversations are frowned upon but normal level conversations are perfectly fine

However English people don't tend to complain very much so often the cars are just as noisey as any others. Plus it doesn't help that the car is often on the way from other cars to the dining car so you just have endless noisey people walking up and down anyway.

I think there's very few countries that an Amtrak style quiet car would work in - it would be much too hard to enforce

 

[spacecadet]

On Japan's commuter trains, they ask that your phone be placed on "Manner" mode.

And they rarely actually need to ask... even in non-"quiet" cars. People rarely talk on their cell phones on the train there, they text instead. If they do talk, they cover their mouths and talk so low that you can't hear it even standing right next to them. The person on the other end understands, because they all do the same thing when talking on the train.

And the whole concept of a "quiet car" is really very new, so far as I can remember.

I don't think they're very new - I seem to remember them going back at least ten years, and they may have existed even before that without my knowledge.

It is nice that they actually enforce the rules, though - I had always assumed that it was probably just luck of the draw if you got a decent set of passengers or not, and that Amtrak wouldn't do anything if you got an unruly crowd.

 

[AlanB]

And the whole concept of a "quiet car" is really very new, so far as I can remember.

I don't think they're very new - I seem to remember them going back at least ten years, and they may have existed even before that without my knowledge.

It's not 10 years yet on Amtrak, I'd say it's more like 5 or 6 years at this point since Amtrak first introduced the quiet car. I know that they didn't exist back when Acela was introduced and it was probably two or three years after the launch that Amtrak first started experimenting with the quiet car, and back then it was only on a few regionals. However it quickly proved to be so popular that more and more trains started running with a Quiet car and Acela also started running with them.

Early on there were lots of problems with enforcement, or lack thereof. But most crews have gotten better about enforcing the rules today.

 

[frj1983]

On an overnight train from Boston to DC, which I am not sure runs anymore, a guy got on in Back Bay. It may have been about 10 p.m. or so, I don't recall. Anyway, he immediately sat down and got on his cellphone. He called one number after another telling everyone what a long night he had in front of him because he was riding the train and bored, yaddayaddayadda.

Yes,

I call these "serial" cell phone users! They cannot NOT use their cell phone because I think that for some people, cell phones are like drugs! When they're talking on the phone they get all animated and happy(read "high") and when they can't connect or get cut off, they get irritable and snappy (read "low"). And the volume for these people is always loud!

I see this regularly on my train ride home on Metra every night. Somone ought to do a study on this, it would probably be fascinating. If anyone is interested, I'll share the story about the French Woman on Metra, I tell people the title for the story is "There will be Blood!"

 

[spacecadet]

It's not 10 years yet on Amtrak, I'd say it's more like 5 or 6 years at this point since Amtrak first introduced the quiet car.

Apparently, it was first tested on one train in 1999: http://www.baltimoresun.com/topic/sns-bt-a...0,6464155.story

And then went into regular service in 2001.

I must have heard about it in 1999; there were probably some news reports about the "experiment" at the time that I'm remembering.

 

[BLOND37]

i loved this post. i rode the quiet car for the first time last week from PVD to NYP... it was perfect, nice & quiet, though I got a baq of chips at lunch time and I was worried about eating them in the quiet car. LOL.

not all trains have a quiet car though do they? 161 does, but 194 does not..

 

[Mark]

On an overnight train from Boston to DC, which I am not sure runs anymore, a guy got on in Back Bay. It may have been about 10 p.m. or so, I don't recall. Anyway, he immediately sat down and got on his cellphone. He called one number after another telling everyone what a long night he had in front of him because he was riding the train and bored, yaddayaddayadda.

Yes,

I call these "serial" cell phone users! They cannot NOT use their cell phone because I think that for some people, cell phones are like drugs! When they're talking on the phone they get all animated and happy(read "high") and when they can't connect or get cut off, they get irritable and snappy (read "low"). And the volume for these people is always loud!

I see this regularly on my train ride home on Metra every night. Somone ought to do a study on this, it would probably be fascinating. If anyone is interested, I'll share the story about the French Woman on Metra, I tell people the title for the story is "There will be Blood!"

Yes, yes, yes. Sorry to any smokers out there but cell phones are the new cigarettes. They are just as addictive and (to non-smokers or minimal cell users), just as annoying. In many cases they give people something to do while they wait to do something else. Almost every Amtrak cell conversation goes like this, "Hey, it me. How's it going? (pause), Yea? Great, no I'm on the train.... ha ha ha blab blab blab." After I hear the "I'm on the train, I'm waiting for the train, I'm something.... the train." part I turn up or on my headphones. Next time your waiting for a train, plane or whatever in a terminal near a group of other passengers, whip out your cell phone and pretend to check it for a message, text or whatever and watch how many others do the same thing within seconds. Just like smokers, when one lights up usually several others come forward to do the same. Smoking USED to be allowed everywhere now its only allowed in select areas sooooo the cell phone has now replaced one annoying habit with another for people, who are supposed to be adults and cannot be content to just sit still.

As for the quiet car/s? Well, why is it so darn hard to be quiet? There is typically ONE quiet car in a whole train set. Why do people who want to blab on their phones or to each other continue to sit there? The answer is: I don't know! I'm not all that old but I truly believe that manners in this country have fallen by the wayside. Americans, (more often than not), are rude and everybody on the planet knows this except, apparently us. As a society, we don't like rules and we certainly don't like somebody telling us that we aren't following them, perceived or not. I would guess that most of the offenders in the QC don't even realize they are sitting there. I have yet to sit in a QC and not have SOMEBODY talk or try to talk on a cell phone and that part IS printed on the hanging signs. Amtrak could print the rules word for word on the back of each and every quiet car seat and somebody would STILL try to break them.

 

[GG-1]

I have yet to sit in a QC and not have SOMEBODY talk or try to talk on a cell phone and that part IS printed on the hanging signs. Amtrak could print the rules word for word on the back of each and every quiet car seat and somebody would STILL try to break them.

But didn't you see the lettering, in the same color ink, as the background saying "this sign apply's to everyone but you" This can only be the reason. :lol: :unsure: :lol: :huh: :lol: :lol:

Aloha

Eric