Amtrak Fares

[Guest]

Allen,

Yes its the City of New Orleans. Problem always was that if you went up in the morning the short distance train left too early to get to spend much time in chicago. Thus throwing you to the long distance train as the way home. I have noticed that lots of people ride it after they get done shoppiing or work in chicago, and they seem to have a system for steering the passengers to certain cars which perhaps they wouldn't even run if they didn't have a great deal of short distance service on that line. Same thing going to chicago untill just recently, actually last month. The only way to chicago was the City Of New Orleans unless you went at 5 at night. Now the short distance train goes from here at 8:30 am. That is a great improvement over 4 am and usually it was hours late. Last time I rode it a few years ago it was over 5 hours late. That rather ruinned our holiday trip for the day. But if it were on time it got in at 10am or so which left you quite a bit of shopping time. Now we will get up there at 1pm if everything goes as planned. Return at 8 pm. Not a lot of time considering the 112.00 price, but then thats my problem. It all sort of boils down to the fact that the middle of the country hasn't had the frequent train travel options that the east has had for years. I was up there and it seemed you could go to new york every hour or so from other major cities.

Larry

You know I loved train travel, and still perhaps do. I guess I just don't care for the way the fares are arrived at. Planes, Buses you name it, a fare should be a fare. The price of operating the train is the same if it runs full or empty. They should decide what each passengers share is and thats what every one pays. If your service is good maybe it will run full, but I shouldn't have to pay extra because it is doing well. thats not my fault. I see its not amtraks problem alone, its the whole travel industry. Perhaps if they had the proper support from the goverment they wouldn't be left sticking it to the passengers who are late at booking the same triip someone else paid way less for. This is undoubtedly like Religion or Politics, those who think its a great system will defend it and those that don't, won't!

The price of operating the train doesn't necessarily remain the same depending on how many ride it on any given day. If the train is full, Amtrak may add an extra waiter in the dining car. A full train needs more cleaning than a half empty train. A full train also needs more fuel to haul the extra weight (not a whole lot I'll admit, but it does need more), and a full train uses more water and also has more sewage to dispose of.

And then there is the whole concept of overhead and capital costs, which I won't go into.

Ok I will own up to some thing here, I went back into the Amtrak reservation site suggested here and found that the one way fare is indeed 27.00 on two of the trains. The third showed up below the screen and I didn't catch the first time that it was 71.00 one way on it. Thats quite a difference though for the same coach seat as you went up on. But depending on the load, those figures are subject to being raised. I have run into that before.

Larry, one question. Is the more expensive train, train #58/59? If so, the reasons behind that would simply be that Amtrak first off wants short distance riders to ride the short distance trains when available, not the long distance train where they could sell the seat to someone going a longer distance. Secondly, the short haul trains are further subsidized by the State of Illinios and they have some say in what price is charged. The long distance train is not subsidized by Illinios and Amtrak must charge more to pay for the costs of operating the train.

 

[Bigval109]

Well this is just my experience, but I don't think I've ever seen a price go down for a specific date. The only time this really seems at all plausible is if you are in the sleepers and there is a cancellation. I mean I guess it could happen in coach if capacity was expanded, but I've never seen that.

This happened to me one in July for travel in Oct.. My ticket to Reno went from $248.00 to $220.00 the next day. Then it remained at the lower price for several days then when back up. Hey I was happy.

 

[PRR 60]

Funny story: not rail.

Two years ago I had a business trip to Salt Lake City (from Philadelphia). Salt Lake and the surrounding area is great, so my wife was coming along. Our corporate travel policy requires me to book through the approved agency but that agency does not book individual travel. So, I booked my seat through the agency on Delta at $460 round trip. I then went to the Delta web site where the seat next to mine was also $460, but JUST before I could complete the booking I got called into a meeting. Not to worry: I'd book it later.

Two hours later I got back to my desk and went back onto the Delta web site to book my wife's ticket. The price now? $208.20 round trip! I could not believe it. Must be a mistake. I checked the dates, city codes, everything. It was correct. That meeting saved me over $250. I booked it as fast as my mouse could click. I called our corporate agent and she said the fare was only available at the Delta web site and she could pull the fare and get my ticket changed. Too bad for the Company, but I was thrilled. Little victories.

Booking travel is like going to a casino. You place your bet, see what happens, and accept the outcome as fate.

 

[racer1735]

You know I loved train travel, and still perhaps do. I guess I just don't care for the way the fares are arrived at. Planes, Buses you name it, a fare should be a fare.Larry

As you probably are aware, the airlines operate on the same pricing principle. You'll see fares for '$89 one way, but you may or may not get that price because they only have 'x' number of seats on a particular flight at that price. Its just not as noticable because you have more flight options per day across multiple airlines, as opposed to just one rail operator.

And its also possible to find a fare that is higher than anticpated, but three days later find a lower fare over the same route due to a cancellation.

 

[Guest 2]

Amtrak had a nice 1/3 page color advertisement in Friday's Minneapolis StarTribune.

The ad very cleary stated "Fares as low as" $53 to Chicago. I picked one date, Sunday December 10 and a $53 fare quote was available for that departure. I knew better than to choose a peak Thanksgiving or Christmas departure, but I did pick a Sunday knowing that it is one of Amtrak's busier days on the Empire Builder.

 

[Dinker]

Anyone know why LD trains sometimes have more than one train number, at least in the Amtrak reservation system. The EB from CHI to MSP, for example, comes up on amtrak.com as trains 7, 27 and 807 (my guess is this doesn't depend on the date but the date I entered was 11/25/06).

 

[AlanB]

Anyone know why LD trains sometimes have more than one train number, at least in the Amtrak reservation system. The EB from CHI to MSP, for example, comes up on amtrak.com as trains 7, 27 and 807 (my guess is this doesn't depend on the date but the date I entered was 11/25/06).

It does not depend on the date. It is done for booking purposes to make sure that the seat/room you buy is in the correct car for your destination. If you book train #7, then you are in a car that is going to Seattle. Train #27 means that car is going to Portland and train #807 means that car only goes as far as the Twin Cities, Minneapolis/St. Paul.

Coming back to Chicago it's trains 8, 28, 808. Same thing happens with the Lake Shore which has 48/49 and 448/449, as well as the Texas Eagle which has 21/22, 421/422, as well as a short turn car into St. Louis that I think is 821 & 822.

 

[Dinker]

Anyone know why LD trains sometimes have more than one train number, at least in the Amtrak reservation system. The EB from CHI to MSP, for example, comes up on amtrak.com as trains 7, 27 and 807 (my guess is this doesn't depend on the date but the date I entered was 11/25/06).

It does not depend on the date. It is done for booking purposes to make sure that the seat/room you buy is in the correct car for your destination. If you book train #7, then you are in a car that is going to Seattle. Train #27 means that car is going to Portland and train #807 means that car only goes as far as the Twin Cities, Minneapolis/St. Paul.

Coming back to Chicago it's trains 8, 28, 808. Same thing happens with the Lake Shore which has 48/49 and 448/449, as well as the Texas Eagle which has 21/22, 421/422, as well as a short turn car into St. Louis that I think is 821 & 822.

Thanks. Why would they sell me a ticket to Minneapolis in a through-car? And for the same price moreover?

 

[battalion51]

Well I'm not sure, but I don't believe 807/808 runs everyday, just as needed, but I could be wrong. It's also possible that in the reservation system if someone has booked a MSP-SEA ticket it will sell the next ticket CHI-MSP so that seat is occupied for the duration of the trip.

 

[Trogdor]

Coming back to Chicago it's trains 8, 28, 808. Same thing happens with the Lake Shore which has 48/49 and 448/449, as well as the Texas Eagle which has 21/22, 421/422, as well as a short turn car into St. Louis that I think is 821 & 822.

Actually, the Lake Shore Limited is different. If one is traveling between Boston and Albany, one will get a ticket for 448/449. If one is traveling west of Albany, one will get a ticket for 48/49. There is no "through" ticket from Chicago to Boston on 448/449 (i.e. one will never see an option for both 48 and 448 for the same city pairs).

The St. Louis short-turn car for the Eagle is given the 321/322 designation.

It's also important to note that, in the case of the Empire Builder (for example), just because you buy a coach ticket on either 7 or 27 (or, perhaps, 807, if traveling east of St. Paul), that doesn't necessarily mean that's where you'll be seated. A passenger that books Portage to Whitefish on train 27 could be seated in the Seattle section, and likewise, someone traveling from Williston, ND, to Milwaukee with a ticket for train 8 could find him/herself in the Portland section. The only cases where a passenger *must* be seated in the proper section are for those traveling west of Spokane (or, west of St. Paul in the event of the local coach operating). Where a passenger actually winds up is dependent on train loading and wherever it may be most convenient for the crew to place them. For example, if there are only four or five passengers getting off at a middle-of-the-night stop (say, Detroit Lakes, MN), it would be easier to have them all in the same car, even if three of them decided to buy a train 7 ticket, and two bought a train 27 ticket.

Of course, this doesn't apply in the case of sleepers, as there, you're assigned a specific room and car when purchasing the ticket.

 

[Dinker]

Well I'm not sure, but I don't believe 807/808 runs everyday, just as needed, but I could be wrong. It's also possible that in the reservation system if someone has booked a MSP-SEA ticket it will sell the next ticket CHI-MSP so that seat is occupied for the duration of the trip.

But the amtrak website seems to let the passenger decided which 'train' he is going on (it gives you the three choices). But perhaps you're right and the reservations system simply overrides the passenger's choice.

 

[battalion51]

...the Texas Eagle which has 21/22, 421/422, as well as a short turn car into St. Louis that I think is 821 & 822.

The St. Louis short-turn car for the Eagle is given the 321/322 designation.

The 821/822 number set is used for the Heartland Flyer.

 

[AlanB]

We've had such a lively discussion on Amtrak pricing and such, with many comparisons made to other service industries. Convienently MSN's Slate has just posted a story on the way that the Airlines do things. One small quote from the article:

An airline will adjust its ticket prices on a minute-by-minute basis, depending on what competitors are charging.

You can read more about how the airlines set prices by clicking here.

 

[racer1735]

Anyone know why LD trains sometimes have more than one train number, at least in the Amtrak reservation system. The EB from CHI to MSP, for example, comes up on amtrak.com as trains 7, 27 and 807 (my guess is this doesn't depend on the date but the date I entered was 11/25/06).

Coming back to Chicago it's trains 8, 28, 808. Same thing happens with the Lake Shore which has 48/49 and 448/449, as well as the Texas Eagle which has 21/22, 421/422, as well as a short turn car into St. Louis that I think is 821 & 822.

Also, it pays to look into fares on each of the numbered trains assigned to a route. You will often find that fares for Train 421/422 is much lower than the same accomodation on trains 21/22.

 

[frj1983]

We've had such a lively discussion on Amtrak pricing and such, with many comparisons made to other service industries. Convienently MSN's Slate has just posted a story on the way that the Airlines do things. One small quote from the article:

An airline will adjust its ticket prices on a minute-by-minute basis, depending on what competitors are charging.

You can read more about how the airlines set prices by clicking here.

It also goes back to that old economic axiom: Charge what the market can bear or if he/she doesn't want it, someone else will pay for it!