Baltimore Sun: Girl's death ratchets up debate on rail safety

[DowneasterPassenger]

Put the NEC in a trench.
Reno has a nice one that eliminates all grade crossings and reduces trespassing (at least for shortcuts, I suppose you can still trespass by walking in the end of the trench). Also reduces train horn noise.

Accidents between trains and cars or pedestrians at 11 former rail crossings were eliminated. "Nobody has been hit by a train" since the trench opened in November 2005, Lee said....In all, the trench has cost the city $282 million.

And the trench is what - 4 miles long? :huh: Multiply that by all 300-400+ miles of the NEC!

Why should just that town in MD have a trench? We in KIN have the AE passing thru at 150 MPH, and want a trench too! And NLC has a number of grade crossings near the station (including to the ferries that cross Long Island Sound, and are right across from the station) - so that has to be in a trench, And ... So why not just put the whole NEC in a trench? :huh:

How about some stimulus money? I can't think of a better "shovel-ready" project than a trench. :lol:

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

Lets see, $282 million for 4 miles equals $28.2 billion for 400 miles. I think we just broke Amtrak's operating budget... for the next two decades...

 

[DowneasterPassenger]

Lets see, $282 million for 4 miles equals $28.2 billion for 400 miles. I think we just broke Amtrak's operating budget... for the next two decades...

The Reno Trench is 2.25 miles long. I'm not convinced a 4.5 mile long trench costs twice as much as 2.25 mile one, or that a 22.5 mile one costs ten times more. But clearly yes, the price tag for the whole NEC would be in the billions.

In all seriousness, there are probably a few miles of rail corridor in a small number of cities (northeast Philly and here in Richmond-Berkeley-Emeryville-Oakland are two that come to mind) that probably account for the majority of pedestrian trespassing incidents. Those would be the best places to start thinking "trench".

 

[Ryan]

Walls would probably be easier and cheaper, since it doesn't involve messing with the tracks. Also remember that a "NEC trench" would require the restringing of catenary, an expense not needed in Reno.

 

[Guest]

natural selection
–noun

the process by which forms of life having traits that better enable them to adapt to specific environmental pressures, such as predators fast moving trains, changes in climate, or competition for food or mates, will tend to survive and reproduce in greater numbers than others of their kind, thus ensuring the perpetuation of those favorable traits in succeeding generations

Yes, absolutely! It is only 4 ft 8.5 in from one side to the other. That is less than most people are tall. If you are walking and can't time that right then your gene pool needs to be cleansed from the population.

 

[TVRM610]

I also take offense to the idea that if someone has a good reason, then it is ok to break the law. What would you do if a kid cut through your backyard on the way to school? Would you say "well it saves them time cause they might have to walk all the way around the block if they didn't" perhaps some of you would think that, but I bet alot of you would threaten to call authorities or parents etc. Trespassing is against the law people.

Comprehending it and excusing it are not one and the same. I don't excuse it, though I can comprehend it, particulalry when one considers that this was probably a daily 2-way passage for this student. Was it the right thing to do - no.

rmadisonwi and Cascadia seem to get what I'm trying to convey. Instead of simply pinning it ALL on personal responsibility, someone should have taken a step back long before now to look at the root causes and try to address those. I'm sure students, parents, the County Police, and even Amtrak were well aware that this was happening regularly - the question is - did anyone try to do something to help prevent what happened?

I comprehend someone wanting to take a short cut. I do not comprehend someone passing through a chain-link fence, passing Warning signs, and then walking within the gauge of the track while listening to an ipod to be understandable at all though. Add to that the fact that these kids should be able to comprehend that these tracks are used all the time , and that ultra fast and quiet trains operate in the area and this is just simply not to be blamed on Amtrak in the slightest.

As AlanB pointed out... pedestrian bridges are not always the answer... the newspaper reports there is a pedestrian tunnel that cuts underneath the NEC but its "wet and dirty." I'm not sure how close it is to the accident or the school but it is there. In all honesty though the picture of it did look pretty creepy.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

Lets see, $282 million for 4 miles equals $28.2 billion for 400 miles. I think we just broke Amtrak's operating budget... for the next two decades...

The area around BBY is already in a trench. And I don't think you need to build a trench for the Hell Gate Bridge or NYP, either.

 

[AlanB]

Another factor though for those comparing trenches is that Reno was a two track railroad. The NEC is a two track RR for maybe 1/4th of it's total run. Otherwise it's either 3 or 4 tracks, that makes for a much bigger trench and a lot more work, and therefore greater expenses. And as someone else noted, Reno has no catenary to deal with either and only one station.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

The NEC is a two track RR for maybe 1/4th of it's total run. Otherwise it's either 3 or 4 tracks, that makes for a much bigger trench and a lot more work, and therefore greater expenses.

Is there a good diagram anywhere of how many tracks there are in various parts of the NEC? (And how does one account for the RI ``freight track''? Also, at 30th Street Station in Philadelphia, do only the intercity passenger leads count as the NEC, or do the commuter leads and freight bypass count as the NEC too?)

 

[Cascadia]

As AlanB pointed out... pedestrian bridges are not always the answer... the newspaper reports there is a pedestrian tunnel that cuts underneath the NEC but its "wet and dirty." I'm not sure how close it is to the accident or the school but it is there. In all honesty though the picture of it did look pretty creepy.

Pedestrian underpass tunnels are creepy, period. I don't care where they are or what time of day it is, if I am walking alone, you pretty much can't get me to go in one of those. And little junior high and high school girls are supposed to use them?

 

[tp49]

Another factor though for those comparing trenches is that Reno was a two track railroad. The NEC is a two track RR for maybe 1/4th of it's total run. Otherwise it's either 3 or 4 tracks, that makes for a much bigger trench and a lot more work, and therefore greater expenses. And as someone else noted, Reno has no catenary to deal with either and only one station.

Another factor to consider is I guarantee that construction costs in Reno are much lower then the costs for a comparable project anywhere in the Northeast Corridor.

 

[battalion51]

This issue came up after a couple of trespasser incidents in SoFla a few years back and they wanted FEC to fence in the entire railroad. Besides being stupid, it's prohibitively expensive. The simple fact is schools in close proximity need to do a better job of educating their students. And if there are multiple schools in proximity, go apply for a grant for an over/underpass and fencing for that area. Done.

 

[Dental Wiz]

This issue came up after a couple of trespasser incidents in SoFla a few years back and they wanted FEC to fence in the entire railroad. Besides being stupid, it's prohibitively expensive. The simple fact is schools in close proximity need to do a better job of educating their students. And if there are multiple schools in proximity, go apply for a grant for an over/underpass and fencing for that area. Done.

I found this story to be an horrible tragedy. That said, I have to question how anyone can legislate this. Would anyone decide to cross an eight lane highway with cars whizzing by at 70 MPH? Of course not. Highways are not fenced in my state of Connecticut and I know no one who would attempt this short cut. Why the railroad should be any different I don't know. Still, the railroad has trespassing signs, a chain link fence to keep people out and they still come. They illegally trespass thinking nothing could ever happen to them. On the NEC, trains travel well over 100 MPH at spots. It's a protected private right of way. If someone wants to cut the chain link fence, disregard protective signage, they do at their own peril. We cannot protect society from making stupid decisions. Regarding teenagers, personally, I don't think it's unreasonable for parents to teach their kids to not cross the interstate, you're likely to get killed. Likewise, they need to teach their kids that the chance of dying on a railroad track is significantly greater. One moment a track can appear tranquil and safe, the next all hell can break loose. Our children need to be taught to obey fences and trespassing warnings. The thought of anyone walking on the NEC with earphones on is unbelievable! Parents, please, you have a responsibility here. The tracks were there before your neighborhood. You know the dangers and if you don't you should. My wife and I are hands on parents .We think we teach our kids right and wrong. We make sure that they are safely on their way to school before we head off for work. Although this is no guarantee of safety, it most certainly betters the odds. "Teach your children well" or your hell may be your terrible loss.

Dr. L

 

[Guest]

Regarding teenagers, personally, I don't think it's unreasonable for parents to teach their kids to not cross the interstate, you're likely to get killed. Likewise, they need to teach their kids that the chance of dying on a railroad track is significantly greater. One moment a track can appear tranquil and safe, the next all hell can break loose.

Oh come on now. It is not that bad. Crossing the interstate is way more deadly than crossing railroad tracks. Trains have what, a couple of miles of free track ahead and behind them. Have you seen how people drive in cities, going 80+ bumper to bumper. If you can't time several miles between trains to cross over the measly 4'8.5" you are an idiot and deserve to die. Don't know how all hell can break loose in the 1.47 seconds it takes someone to cross a track.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

Cars also have the ability to stop and swerve.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

Of course everyone should take PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY but we are dealing with teen-agers!
I spent 20 years trying to teach them, I love them but they have some faults - like thinking they are invulnerable and not considering the possible bad results of their actions. Amtrak tries to do the right thing with chain link fencing but the kids swipe Dad's wire cutters. Trains are noisy but kids wear Ipods with the volume turned way up.

Adults try and teach kids but the little cherubs don't listen - actually some do and those that don't - some survive. Its a shame.

The teenage years were created by God to help weed out the idiotic. Excuse my saying so bluntly but it is the truth.

 

[TVRM610]

Regarding teenagers, personally, I don't think it's unreasonable for parents to teach their kids to not cross the interstate, you're likely to get killed. Likewise, they need to teach their kids that the chance of dying on a railroad track is significantly greater. One moment a track can appear tranquil and safe, the next all hell can break loose.

Oh come on now. It is not that bad. Crossing the interstate is way more deadly than crossing railroad tracks. Trains have what, a couple of miles of free track ahead and behind them. Have you seen how people drive in cities, going 80+ bumper to bumper. If you can't time several miles between trains to cross over the measly 4'8.5" you are an idiot and deserve to die. Don't know how all hell can break loose in the 1.47 seconds it takes someone to cross a track.

The NEC is quite different then you describe. We are talking about 2-6 MAINLINE tracks all capable of trains operating in excess of 100mph (obviously speed depends on location). Not only can trains sneak up on you, but they also can come on multiple tracks from multiple directions. Add to that they run electric trains which can be very quiet and yes crossing the NEC is very dangerous.

 

[DET63]

From page 2 of the article:

But local teenagers said their use of the tracks was an open secret. 

Yeager's son Brandon, a 16-year-old Kenwood junior, said that until he recently qualified for a driver's license, he could often be found on the tracks.

 

"I used to play on the tracks all the time," he said. "We'd just go to see how close we could get to the train."

 

Brandon and other students said the subject has seldom been raised by school officials - even since Anna's death. He said police officers assigned to Kenwood would watch teens walk up an alley to a well-known fence gap but wouldn't intervene.

 

[Emphasis added.]

The victim (yes, I know many here will argue that the train crew members are victims also):

 

[Rumpled]

Put the NEC in a trench.
Reno has a nice one that eliminates all grade crossings and reduces trespassing (at least for shortcuts, I suppose you can still trespass by walking in the end of the trench). Also reduces train horn noise.

Accidents between trains and cars or pedestrians at 11 former rail crossings were eliminated. "Nobody has been hit by a train" since the trench opened in November 2005, Lee said....In all, the trench has cost the city $282 million.

Check with Placentia, CA to see how well trenching can go. ( A bit of corruption doesn't help, either)

Baltimore's had four decades to fix their problem according to the article. Certainly they've had opportunity to find funding for a solution in that time.

Bummer for the family.

 

[rile42]

Amazingly, we had almost the exact thing happen here in a suburb of Columbus, Ohio. A boy was walking home from school, alone if I recall, on the tracks with Ipod headsets on his ears. A CSX freight came up behind him and he was killed. There are alot of blame to be thrown around in these tragedies but for me, most blame has to fall onto parents. I understand, I taught in a high school for 30 years and raised two sons, that teenagers will try to get away with what they can but there has to be limits. I emphasized to my sons when they got their drivers licenses that any ticket, no matter what it was for, would be cause to jerk their license away by me. It never had to be enforced.

Maybe some actions by the police need to be in order since the article claims that officers have noticed the kids on the tracks. Make it a law in the community that anyone seen on the tracks will be cited and make the fine high as a deterrent with higher fines for repeat offenders. If it is a minor, then double the fine to the parents. How many of you slow down in a town that is known as a speed trap? Make the same reputation in the community for being on the tracks.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

Amazingly, we had almost the exact thing happen here in a suburb of Columbus, Ohio. A boy was walking home from school, alone if I recall, on the tracks with Ipod headsets on his ears. A CSX freight came up behind him and he was killed. There are alot of blame to be thrown around in these tragedies but for me, most blame has to fall onto parents. I understand, I taught in a high school for 30 years and raised two sons, that teenagers will try to get away with what they can but there has to be limits. I emphasized to my sons when they got their drivers licenses that any ticket, no matter what it was for, would be cause to jerk their license away by me. It never had to be enforced.Maybe some actions by the police need to be in order since the article claims that officers have noticed the kids on the tracks. Make it a law in the community that anyone seen on the tracks will be cited and make the fine high as a deterrent with higher fines for repeat offenders. If it is a minor, then double the fine to the parents. How many of you slow down in a town that is known as a speed trap? Make the same reputation in the community for being on the tracks.

would a fix it ticket for a broken headlight etc also cause you to take you to take there license away.