Your Dream Consist

[battalion51]

There was talk several years about making Atlantic Coast Service Superliner equipment running out of Washington. But then all the people that live north of DC complained about not having a "direct route" to Florida. Well hell, it could/should be done. The only minor adjustment that may need to be made is the addition of a baggage car to Acela Reigonals. Even then they could make it so it's only available at large stations, and for those connceting to long distance trains. I WANT SUPERLINERS IN SOUTH FLORIDA!!!

 

[Amfleet]

Several years ago, they managed to get a small Superliner consist into Philadelphia's 30th Street Station for some sort of convention, but I believe something had to be temporarily removed. It came off the Keystone Corridor, most likely coming out from Chicago over the Three Rivers or Pennsylvanian's route. They had to use Track 1 at PHL, which has a low platform (on the opposite side from the revenue platform shared with Track 2) because it sits next to the station's mail facility.

There is an article about this in one of my 1996 Railpace magazines. The train had all new Superliner II equipment and a Viewliner carrying travel agents from Chicago to Philadelphia. I still deisagree about not being able to get Superliners into Baltimore. The tunnels look high enough.

 

[Viewliner]

There was talk several years about making Atlantic Coast Service Superliner equipment running out of Washington. But then all the people that live north of DC complained about not having a "direct route" to Florida. Well hell, it could/should be done. The only minor adjustment that may need to be made is the addition of a baggage car to Acela Reigonals. Even then they could make it so it's only available at large stations, and for those connceting to long distance trains. I WANT SUPERLINERS IN SOUTH FLORIDA!!!

I beg to differ, I like the Single Level fleet (especially those Viewliners) and the one seat ride to Florida. Maybe the Superliners could compliment the Silver Service rather than replace it. Maybe Run a train going through the Carolinas along the same route as the Silver Star then run the Palmetto's (I wish it were the Silver Palm) route via Tampa and/or an FEC train.

I'd rather see a daily Sunset Limited to Miami!!! Along with a Floridian (Chicago-Florida). Or, Extend the Auto train to WPB/MIA, while still stopping in Sanford.

 

[Amfleet]

I'm still waiting for a Silver train to come to Boston. B)

 

[Viewliner]

I'm still waiting for a Silver train to come to Boston. B)

I like the idea of that, more so than Battalion's but first we need more Viewliners!!!! We need to apply pressure until we have funding for them!!!!!!

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

I like Seajay's idea of a Dome Observation car such as was on the California Zephyr. At least we can still see that today on the Canadian. ALso, for Observation car buffs, the last time I passed through the Milwaukee Station one could spot an old "skytop" Observation lounge from the Olympian Hiawatha---yes, pre-AMtrak, but along the observation car line suggested. Anyone passing though Milwaukee should check it out---or see if it is even still there. It did not have a dome, though there weas a super dome elsewhere on the train.

More in line the with the present day, any train should have on it something like the Pacific Parlor car.

 

[Viewliner]

I like Seajay's idea of a Dome Observation car such as was on the California Zephyr. At least we can still see that today on the Canadian. ALso, for Observation car buffs, the last time I passed through the Milwaukee Station one could spot an old "skytop" Observation lounge from the Olympian Hiawatha---yes, pre-AMtrak, but along the observation car line suggested. Anyone passing though Milwaukee should check it out---or see if it is even still there. It did not have a dome, though there weas a super dome elsewhere on the train.

More in line the with the present day, any train should have on it something like the Pacific Parlor car.

Agreed, a FC lounge would be nice, and should be built with the next fleet of Viewliners (wishful thinking).

 

[Coach34135]

Surfliner train, one car for movies, one car for dindin, one car for my kid to play games, and one car for sleepin hehehe......

but if i hadto move people with the train, just gimme the Surfie with 6 cars and one purty F59phi

 

[Viewliner]

1 thing I forgot is the NJT Comet II Club Car #5759.

 

[Amfleet]

Why does NJ Transit have a club car and what's it used for.

 

[Viewliner]

Why does NJ Transit have a club car and what's it used for.

Beats me!!!! :huh:

 

[chefrhodes81]

hello

I think viewliner is right dont make silver service superliner. In my opinion amtrak should phase out all superliners over the next 30 years and be all viewliner equipped except for highspeed trainsets. Did yall know the double decker California cars were built by Amerrail the builders of the viewliner. Probably for less money California could have bought Viewliner coach cars instead of paying for a totally new car to be designed.

just my take

John

 

[EmpireBuilderFan]

In my opinion amtrak should phase out all superliners over the next 30 years and be all viewliner equipped except for highspeed trainsets.

John,

I'm not trying to pick a fight, but I am curious why you say that. For the western routes that have the clearance, the double-decker Superliners are a perfect fit. What I'd like to see are Superliners with the top level having the second row of windows, like the Viewliner sleepers. Of course, right now I'd settle for all equipment to be back on the tracks in revenue service.

 

[Amfleet]

What I'd like to see are Superliners with the top level having the second row of windows

You can't. The hight of one level of a Superliner is about 1 foot less than that in a Viewliner, plus the roof is curved. That said I would keep Superliners out west and Viewliners in the east. B)

 

[Viewliner]

hello
I think viewliner is right dont make silver service superliner. In my opinion amtrak should phase out all superliners over the next 30 years and be all viewliner equipped except for highspeed trainsets. Did yall know the double decker California cars were built by Amerrail the builders of the viewliner. Probably for less money California could have bought Viewliner coach cars instead of paying for a totally new car to be designed.

just my take

John

While the Superliners are nice, the idea works, as you have the flexibility to board at high level and low level platform stations. This way equipment could easily be interchanged between any and all routes, and your system has uniformity. The one thing is they need to be built better, i.e. Budd/Pullman Quality, maybe use Temoinsa or Talgo for the job as their equipment does well.

As a compromise, the western routes, (and Eastern Routes once Baltimore and both NY Tunnels can be built with higher clearances) should get some domes, this way the spectacular views aren't lost, and if anything improved with 360 degree Views.

I think these Superliners should not simply be pulled, but rather no more purchases, and let them live their usefulness.

Or at the very least, improve the single level fleet (buy Viewliners!!!) before more Superliners.

To start, we need to buy some more (25-50 additional) Sleepers so that the Eastern Routes have more than enough, and can revive the Silver Palm. Second some Diners (Improved over 8400, i.e. similar in a sense to the Temoinsa Rebuilt Heritages) so we can get a Broadway Limited, and have enough for the Silver Palm. Then move on to Baggage Dorms for the crew, then Coaches, Lounges, Baggage Cars, Deluxe Sleepers, FC Lounges (in that order).

I'd like to hear everyone elses opinions.

 

[AlanB]

What I'd like to see are Superliners with the top level having the second row of windows

You can't. The hight of one level of a Superliner is about 1 foot less than that in a Viewliner, plus the roof is curved. That said I would keep Superliners out west and Viewliners in the east. B)

Actually I suspect that they could very easily put in a second row of windows if they were to ever order new Superliners. First of all the window doesn't need to be quite as large as the one on the upper row of the Viewliner. Secondly, don't forget that the window can curve upward into the roof, just like it does on a Sightseer Lounge.

Retrofitting the old cars would be a huge and unnecessary expense, money that could be better spent elsewhere. However if Amtrak ever gets the money for new Superliners, I for one would love to see the new round include that upper window. That’s one if the reasons that just like Viewliner, I like the Viewliner sleeper. When I’m traveling alone in a standard room, I always sleep on the shelf since I can still look out the window at night. Yet I still have my chairs setup below, so I’m not dependent upon the attendant to make up my room. I can raise and lower my own bed as needed.

In the Superliner, I end up sleeping down below simply because I can’t see anything. Now granted I do know how to make up and take down that lower bed, but it’s a lot more work than just sliding the Viewliner bed up or down.

I do agree with Viewliner however that if they ever get any money, Amtrak must first acquire more Viewliner/single level equipment first before going after new Superliners. Thanks to the overwhelming Republican turnout this past Tuesday, I suspect that any new equipment will remain a dream for years to come now. As it stand now, we will be lucky if we can get Congress to cough up enough money just to keep Amtrak functioning.

 

[Viewliner]

Maybe in 2004, I think with Gunn, we have a better chance than in previous years.

But what is your opinion on going Single Level in the future (no Superliners)?

 

[tp49]

Did yall know the double decker California cars were built by Amerrail the builders of the viewliner. Probably for less money California could have bought Viewliner coach cars instead of paying for a totally new car to be designed.

Actually I only noticed that last week on my corridor train. I think the other reason CalTrans when with the double deckers is because they wanted the cars to be close to the same height as the F59's they use, man those things are tall

I was also thinking today that I sure could go for a ride on some LIRR M-1 or M-3's right about now...probably nostalga. I would love to get on the M-7's when I get back to NY.

 

[chefrhodes81]

hello

First for Empirebuilderfan dome viewliner lounge cars could substitute for superliners.

I am for having all one type of fleet for saving money Less parts to stock, easier to train technicans etc. and it would be easier to utilize rolling stock. Sourhwest airlines only flies 737 and they are one of the few airlines making money. I always am thinking about the economic side of trains as well as being a railfan.

When clearances allow viewliner dome cars could be used. I think this would satisfy the sightseers (myself included). Hopefully one for coach and one for first class.

The reason I am for single level vs. double decker is that to be able to go all superliner alot of clearance problems would have to be eliminated at great cost something Amtrak can't and will probably never be able to afford.

Also viewliners are rated for 125 mph and can take curves faster because of their lower center of gravity. Superliners are only rated for 100mph. I think the "higher" speed capabilities of the viewliner is something that will be necesary in the future on 700 mile plus routes(long distance).

please give me feedback about my thinking

john

 

[EmpireBuilderFan]

As much as I like the Superliners, I definitely have to agree with this statement:

Also viewliners are rated for 125 mph and can take curves faster because of their lower center of gravity.  Superliners are only rated for 100mph.  I think the "higher" speed capabilities of the viewliner is something that will be necesary in the future on 700 mile plus routes(long distance).

I'd love to see the Empire Builder (and other western LD trains) be able to go 125+ across the open plains states. Also, I'd be more than happy to give up the Sightseer Lounges for dome lounges. What would everyone think about something like the full-length domes that used to run on the streamliners?

I can see the argument about having one kind of equipment to maintain. Amtrak does have quite a few different kinds of equipment to maintain (Amfleet, Superliner, Viewliner, Talgo, etc.). I agree with Viewliner that Amtrak should talk to Talgo about the next set of long distance equipment (once it gets enough money to actually consider buying more equipment) based off of the Viewliner equipment. It would be nice to see single-level, long distance Amtrak trains that have matching equipment.

As an aside, instead of domes for the Eastern trains, how about bringing back the the observation car at the end of the consist?

 

[AlanB]

I was also thinking today that I sure could go for a ride on some LIRR M-1 or M-3's right about now...probably nostalga. I would love to get on the M-7's when I get back to NY.

TP49,

Better hurry if you want a ride on a M1 car, the first set of M7's went into service last week. The LIRR expects to add at least 1 new set per month over the next 2-3 years. Once they are all online, I believe that all M1's will be retired.

While I haven't yet caught a ride on the M7, I have seen it on several occasions running into Hunter's Point for testing. I've also seen a few news shots and they look very impressive.

 

[AlanB]

Viewliner,

I'm torn as to which way Amtrak should go. I definitely think that the Viewliner sleeper is far superior to the Superliner sleeper. On the other hand I like the Superliner diner's and Sightseer lounges. Now I suppose that the correct dome and/or observation car could replace the Sightseer lounge for me, especially if it was the Hickory Creek or something of that ilk.

On the other hand the extra seating room that a Superliner diner provides, since the kitchen is downstairs, is something that any single level diner will never equal. Of course I suppose that if enough single level diners were available so that you could put two per train then that might work. Mind you though that would require doubling the dining crew, which is a considerable expense.

I do agree with Chef Rhodes that the higher speed of the Viewliner's is desirable. This of course assumes that we can get the freight RR's to upgrade their tracks so that trains can run that fast. There is also a good deal of logic to the point that having one type of car to maintain would be cheaper and make maintenance easier. Miami Joe has mentioned several times needing to scramble to find and/or make parts for cars, because the car is too old or dissimilar to any others in the fleet. Having a uniform fleet would solve this problem.

On the other hand with the reduced passenger capacity of the single level cars, you would be increasing the length of many of the west of Chicago trains.

 

[gswager]

I would like to keep with Superliner for few reasons:

With Superliner, more passengers per car which means more $$$ for revenue or lower the fare.

If putting same amount of passengers from Superliner to Viewliner, you'll have to increase the number of cars. Some stations might be required to have double stop due to its short platform.

Superliner provides excellent "bird view" from second level.

I have question. Is the platform for Viewliner is higher than Superliner?

 

[AlanB]

I have question. Is the platform for Viewliner is higher than Superliner?

GS,

Actually one of the charms of a Viewliner is the fact that it can handle either a high level platform, like the commuter RR's here in NY use, or a low level platform like the Superliner's require. My guess is that a typical low level platform is about 6 inches high, whereas a high level is probably about 3 feet off the ground.

While a retrofit of existing Superliner's would be too expensive, it would be possible to engineer new Superliner's to handle both types of platforms. We currently have double deck commuter cars here in NY that use high level platforms. Adding the ability to use a low level platform to that design wouldn't be too hard.

 

[Viewliner]

I Like That Idea, why not a dome observation? B)