Which is used more up to Boston?

[Acela150]

I just got thinking what unit is used more on trains that go to Boston the Banana or the Toaster?

Thanks,

Stephen

 

[AlanB]

The toasters, simply because there are more of them.

Ps. For those who don't know, the banana is the HHP-8 electric motor and the toaster is the AEM-7 electric engine.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

The toasters, simply because there are more of them.
Ps. For those who don't know, the banana is the HHP-8 electric motor and the toaster is the AEM-7 electric engine.

the banana is also called the rhino

 

[sechs]

Maybe someone could explain how the HHP-8 got those nicknames.

It's pretty obvious for the AEM-7....

 

[wayman]

The toasters, simply because there are more of them.
Ps. For those who don't know, the banana is the HHP-8 electric motor and the toaster is the AEM-7 electric engine.

When you say "electric motor" and "electric engine", do you mean to imply that they are somehow different operationally? Or are you just saying exactly the same thing with two different wordings?

 

[GG-1]

When you say "electric motor" and "electric engine", do you mean to imply that they are somehow different operationally? Or are you just saying exactly the same thing with two different wordings?

Aloha

The Driver's call them motor's and are called "Motor Men", the average lay people call them electric engines ... clear as ??

 

[Crescent ATN & TCL]

I always assumed that the locos were mixed together on the NEC and there was no rhyme nor reason as to where they were used. I assume they bring them into the terminals at WAS, NYP, BOS and Harrisburg and then assign them as needed to whatever train needs them based on the order they are serviced and moved to the ready track.

 

[AlanB]

I always assumed that the locos were mixed together on the NEC and there was no rhyme nor reason as to where they were used. I assume they bring them into the terminals at WAS, NYP, BOS and Harrisburg and then assign them as needed to whatever train needs them based on the order they are serviced and moved to the ready track.

And you assumed correctly. That is precisely what happens generally. On occasions they might be doing something that would require a specific type of motor (like back when Express Trak was in business), but otherwise assignments are generally just handed out based upon need.

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

 

[wayman]

I always assumed that the locos were mixed together on the NEC and there was no rhyme nor reason as to where they were used. I assume they bring them into the terminals at WAS, NYP, BOS and Harrisburg and then assign them as needed to whatever train needs them based on the order they are serviced and moved to the ready track.

And you assumed correctly. That is precisely what happens generally. On occasions they might be doing something that would require a specific type of motor (like back when Express Trak was in business), but otherwise assignments are generally just handed out based upon need.

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

Bananas at Harrisburg? If distribution of toasters and bananas was truly random, then the odds any given Keystone would have a banana are roughly one in five. But I've never had a banana on the Keystone in over fifty rides, and moreover I've never seen a banana on the Keystone on any of the perhaps hundred Keystones I've seen roll by while I'm driving around Ardmore, which seems statistically anomalous enough that I suspect bananas are never used on the Keystone.

 

[PRR 60]

...Bananas at Harrisburg? If distribution of toasters and bananas was truly random, then the odds any given Keystone would have a banana are roughly one in five. But I've never had a banana on the Keystone in over fifty rides, and moreover I've never seen a banana on the Keystone on any of the perhaps hundred Keystones I've seen roll by while I'm driving around Ardmore, which seems statistically anomalous enough that I suspect bananas are never used on the Keystone.

Is it possible the HHP-8's are not compatible with the old Metroliner cab cars for push-pull operation? Just a thought.

 

[blueman271]

I always assumed that the locos were mixed together on the NEC and there was no rhyme nor reason as to where they were used. I assume they bring them into the terminals at WAS, NYP, BOS and Harrisburg and then assign them as needed to whatever train needs them based on the order they are serviced and moved to the ready track.

And you assumed correctly. That is precisely what happens generally. On occasions they might be doing something that would require a specific type of motor (like back when Express Trak was in business), but otherwise assignments are generally just handed out based upon need.

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

Bananas at Harrisburg? If distribution of toasters and bananas was truly random, then the odds any given Keystone would have a banana are roughly one in five. But I've never had a banana on the Keystone in over fifty rides, and moreover I've never seen a banana on the Keystone on any of the perhaps hundred Keystones I've seen roll by while I'm driving around Ardmore, which seems statistically anomalous enough that I suspect bananas are never used on the Keystone.

Last Sat. I was in NWK waiting for the train down to NPN when i saw a Keystone heading south/west with a banana pushing it. I also saw a Keystone going north/east when we were pulling into the Newark Airport Station and a toaster was pushing it. So my question is does Amtrak have a policy on what direction the locomotive pulls and what direction it pushes or is it just a whichever end the yard couples it up to thing?

 

[Rafi]

Is it possible the HHP-8's are not compatible with the old Metroliner cab cars for push-pull operation? Just a thought.

While I can't speak to compatibility with the old Metroliner cab cars, I can tell you that MARC runs their HHP-8's in push-pull on their MARC II and MARC III trains.

Rafi

 

[Acela150]

With the bananas they don't use them on the "main line" simply on the controls of the HHP. When the Capitoliners were made as cab-cars they were made to be compatible with the F40's and P40's/P42's and the AEM-7's. I think the chances of that keystone train with a banana are really slim. I've seen the HHP's with a captioliner on the rear of the train most likely bound for New Haven to be used for the Shuttles with the rest of the train going to Boston.

Stephen

 

[heavesrock]

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

I thought there were 21 HHP-8s?

 

[amtrakwolverine]

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

I thought there were 21 HHP-8s?

21 total but spread out. MARC has some hhp-8s also

 

[AlanB]

I always assumed that the locos were mixed together on the NEC and there was no rhyme nor reason as to where they were used. I assume they bring them into the terminals at WAS, NYP, BOS and Harrisburg and then assign them as needed to whatever train needs them based on the order they are serviced and moved to the ready track.

And you assumed correctly. That is precisely what happens generally. On occasions they might be doing something that would require a specific type of motor (like back when Express Trak was in business), but otherwise assignments are generally just handed out based upon need.

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

Bananas at Harrisburg? If distribution of toasters and bananas was truly random, then the odds any given Keystone would have a banana are roughly one in five. But I've never had a banana on the Keystone in over fifty rides, and moreover I've never seen a banana on the Keystone on any of the perhaps hundred Keystones I've seen roll by while I'm driving around Ardmore, which seems statistically anomalous enough that I suspect bananas are never used on the Keystone.

Last Sat. I was in NWK waiting for the train down to NPN when i saw a Keystone heading south/west with a banana pushing it. I also saw a Keystone going north/east when we were pulling into the Newark Airport Station and a toaster was pushing it. So my question is does Amtrak have a policy on what direction the locomotive pulls and what direction it pushes or is it just a whichever end the yard couples it up to thing?

It varies every other round trip. The reason, in Harrisburg the train is not turned. Yet every train arriving into Sunnyside yard is automatically turned, as one must go around the loop track to reach the yard.

 

[AlanB]

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

I thought there were 21 HHP-8s?

21 total but spread out. MARC has some hhp-8s also

MARC does indeed have some HHP-8's, not quite sure how many. But Amtrak only got 15 in total for their use. You can find the acceptance dates here.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

I thought there were 21 HHP-8s?

21 total but spread out. MARC has some hhp-8s also

MARC does indeed have some HHP-8's, not quite sure how many. But Amtrak only got 15 in total for their use. You can find the acceptance dates here.

well amtrak has 15 so that leaves 6 for MARC. i don't know if it still is or not but one of amtraks hhp-8s (663) has been out with a dead transformer and amtrak and bombardier are in dispute over who should pay for it

 

[Mark]

As I said originally, you see more toasters simply because there are more of them. There are only 15 HHP-8's and 49 AEM-7's, so one obviously will see more toasters since they outnumber the bananas 3 to 1.

I thought there were 21 HHP-8s?

21 total but spread out. MARC has some hhp-8s also

MARC does indeed have some HHP-8's, not quite sure how many. But Amtrak only got 15 in total for their use. You can find the acceptance dates here.

well amtrak has 15 so that leaves 6 for MARC. i don't know if it still is or not but one of amtraks hhp-8s (663) has been out with a dead transformer and amtrak and bombardier are in dispute over who should pay for it

When isn't Amtrak and Bombardier in a dispute over something.

 

[Crescent ATN & TCL]

Do you think Amtrak will buy more HHP's to replace the AEM-7s or just let GE, EMD, Bombardier, Alstom, Siemens, ABB, etc. submit test locomotives?

 

[AlanB]

Do you think Amtrak will buy more HHP's to replace the AEM-7s or just let GE, EMD, Bombardier, Alstom, Siemens, ABB, etc. submit test locomotives?

Well if Amtrak were smart, and the money comes quickly enough, they should just piggyback on NJT's order for ALP46's. No need for lead time, design, or anything else. The locos are already well tested by NJT, and they are currently still rolling off the production line. They'd probably cost less too, than starting with something new.

 

[Crescent ATN & TCL]

Do you think Amtrak will buy more HHP's to replace the AEM-7s or just let GE, EMD, Bombardier, Alstom, Siemens, ABB, etc. submit test locomotives?

Well if Amtrak were smart, and the money comes quickly enough, they should just piggyback on NJT's order for ALP46's. No need for lead time, design, or anything else. The locos are already well tested by NJT, and they are currently still rolling off the production line. They'd probably cost less too, than starting with something new.

Are the ALP46s stats the same as AEM-7s? i.e. top speed, horsepower, tractive effort, power systems

 

[Ryan]

Wikipedia says ~8500 HP and a max speed of 125 (to drag 14 bilevels), so it looks like they should be sufficient replacements.

I've read nothing but complaints about the reliability of the HHP-8, so I wouldn't expect to see another order.

 

[AlanB]

Wikipedia says ~8500 HP and a max speed of 125 (to drag 14 bilevels), so it looks like they should be sufficient replacements.
I've read nothing but complaints about the reliability of the HHP-8, so I wouldn't expect to see another order.

I believe that NJT found out that the engine can't drag 14 multi-level cars and still meet the schedule, but Jishnu would know for sure. But otherwise NJT is quite happy with the ALP series and the locomotive performs quite well for them. And one needs to consider the fact that NJT's main maintenance facility is the Meadowlands Maintenance Complex or MMC for short. Because of the that nickname and the apparent ability to fix things properly, there are many that refer to it as the Micky Mouse Club.

 

[Ryan]

I should have been more specific, I was talking about the ALP-46A, that (again I'm relying on Wikipedia) won't be delivered until 2010. Presumably, this would be the power that Amtrak would be after, not the older ALP-46 (7100 HP vs 8500 HP).

Of course, all this is outside of my personal knowledge and wikipedia may well be completely wrong (and if it is, would someone kindly update it?)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ALP-46