Sanford, FL passenger stop eliminated

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A

Amtrak OBS Gone Freight

OBS Chief
Joined
May 20, 2005
Messages
576
Hey all, the "Orlando Sentinel" has published a report regarding the regular passenger station in SFD. Apparently rumors of no longer stopping at SFD are true. The station has been in very bad shape for quite a while now, and I just recently noticed on my last visit there it has been closed off completely. So after August when the schedules are supposed to change, it looks as if the "Star" and the "Meteor" will no longer make stops there! What a shame..... :( OBS...

At least "Auto Train" is still going strong!
 
The SFD station building certainly has been a disgraceful disaster for a long time. I wonder what they will do about the fact that very frequently 98 and 92 stop there for mechanical, electrical, and a/c repairs? Seems like at least 25% of the time we stopped there for anything from a few minutes to nearly 45 minutes for repair work. Maybe they could just build a covered walkway from SFA over to that track and make SFA the actual station for it, since it's staffed and in good shape. Use two or three golf carts if necessary for bags and pax. Sitting at SFD on the Silver series trains you are very close to the SFA facilities and equipment, so I think it's close enough to work. SFD still has nearly 11,000 pax annually, which works out to about 30 pax per day. That's about the 15th heaviest pax volume of all the Florida stations, which I believe number around 29. SFD has over three times the pax count of Tallahassee (the State Capital), albeit TLH is only served 3x/wk each way from Sunset Limited. With SFD gone, the nearest stations would be Deland and WInter Park, both a good half hour away from SFD by car. SFD sees, on average, 5 trains per day, with 91, 92, 97, 98 all daily and either 01 or 02 six days per week. That's a lot of pax service to toss in the ash-can. I say use SFA and build a covered walkway. Then you've got a staffed station for it. The facilities and personnel are already there (at SFA), and it's close enough to be practicable. They would probably have to rearrange some things at SFA, but as a bonus they would have the entire SFD area as additional storage and so forth. Also, Silver Service and Sunset pax would be able to tour the Auto-Train facilities and you would probably get some cross-pollenization (future business for Auto-Train) from that.

For you Amtrak employees on the board, like OBS, maybe take some pix showing how close the two stations are and send them upstairs with a suggestion, maybe a rough drawing. It's quite possible that decision-makers on that issue don't realize just how adjacent those two facilities actually are. And how 11,000 pax use SFD every year, and it's worth some effort to save that business. This probably qualifies as thinking outside the box, but why not????.........
 
National Limited said:
Are there pictures of this station on the web?  I'm curious to see what it looks like.
Click to expand...
I cannot seem to get this website to come up, as I do not recall the exact website address. Paste this, then go to the Atlanta station picture, then click on the bottom to go to the home page, where you can look up any station. There are plenty of Sanford pictures from 2003.

http://sidesearch.lycos.com/?query=%22scot...2Fatlanta%2Ehtm
 
I have a few thoughts on this announcement. First of all as with any stop really it's a shame that Sanford is losing Silver Service and the Sunset, if only someone could step in to improve the station or as some suggested better utilize SFA and adjust its capacity (if needed) to handle that pax load. I've heard there's at least some hope with the proposed (experimental?) commuter service between Orlando and Lakeland (IIRC, correct me if I'm wrong).

Obviously if a Silver Service train needs repairs it'll still be able to stop at the SFD site and get what ever maintence it needs done. But I think the real question here is what happens to the Sunset Limited? Often when its ridiculously late it terminates/turns at SFD and WPK and ORL get bustituted. Does this mean that:

a- It will use SFD's inactive platform for bustitution transfers

b- It will use SFA's platform for transfers

c- It won't bustitute and will continue to ORL (and then DH back)

d- something else?
 
LMFAO :lol: Forget it guys, they've been looking for an excuse to get rid of that station, and this is that reason. I don't think too many tears will be shed over the loss. Unstaffed stations are a pain, you have to cut tickets, passengers never know what's happening, etc. These people are in a major metropolitan area, they can stand to drive to DLD or WPK. If we were talking about a station like Jessup, middle of nowhere, closest alternative is JAX or Greyhound then we have a discussion.

As for the Sunset they always have pulled into Auto Train yard on 3 Rail and transferred everyone to the buses there.

The Commuter rail project is slated to run to Kissimmee AFAIK, if you go to LAK you might as well go all the way to TPA.
 
My bad, the articles say DeLand (which is a lot more sensible) to Orlando. Thanks for clearing up the other questions we (at least I) had. Too bad Sanford just could've maintained staffing in the first place and not have lost it, otherwise none of this would really have been an issue, but hey you get what you pay for and instead this is SFD's fate.
 
The commuter rail project will start with service from debary to orlando. eventually service is planned to expand to deland, and as far south as kissimme. This is all depandant on if the project is even initiated.
 
How far is SFA from SFD? Would it be in any way practical to have a passenger platform on the line for Silver Service/Sunset trains, and have passengers use the SFA facility for waiting/ticketing?
 
SFA and SFD stations are very close to each other. It would be very practical and possible to put a new platform in north of the current one. Then with current auto train staff(station side) the station could offer services similar to other staffed stations.

There is actually already a plan to build a Sanford Intermodal Station, but that is along way off. It would include a platform for both services.http://www.house.gov/mica/projtransautotrain.htm
 
Guys, I hate to be a spoiled sport, but, this is getting rediculous. There is absolutely no need to keep this stop in Sanford. It's a huge incovienence for passengers, yada, yada, yada. If you were to go hop on an average Silver Service train, there's maybe 1-2 people boarding the train at Sanford, we're not talking about huge numbers here (same for the Sunset). It's absolutely absurd to even consider making these train back into the Auto Train facility for 1 or 2 people per train. This stop is the Okeechobee of Central Florida, useless. It would require a good 7-10 minutes for the train to shove into the station, make the stop, and pull back out, not to mention the inconvienence to the Auto Train crews while they're trying to switch. You'd also be required to have Mechanical on duty when the train got in, since it's within yard limits. Right now Mechanical isn't around for 92 and maybe not even 98 if they are late. Also, most of the people that are boarding the train in Sanford are coming from nearby communities like Lake Mary or Orange City, where it's maybe an extra 5-10 minutes to DLD or WPK. In case you haven't noticed Sanford is very economically depressed, very few people there can afford to take vacations, and when they do travel it's probably not for good reasons, and they're taking the bus anyway. Very few people are going to be saying that without this stop they're not taking the train, chances are DLD and WPK will go up due to people changing locations. There's no need to waste capital, time, and effort for 1-2 people per train (if that) that can go to Staffed Locations in DLD and WPK. Let AT do their job and Silver Service do theirs.
 
Between 10,000 and 11,000 pax used that station each of the last two years. That does not include any Auto-Train pax, those are all SFD pax. That's a whole lot more than one or two per day. It's nearly 30 pax per day using SFD. That's more than roughly half the Florida stations see daily, although several of those are now bus service on the old S line or are between Jax and PNS just 3x per week on Sunset.
 
Nobody's talking about backing the Silvers into SFA, bat. The idea was a covered walkway from the existing track stop area over to the AutoTrain facility so ticketing and baggage and waiting room facilities at AutoTrain could be used, maybe with just a couple golf carts on the walkway to get them to and from. You've got a great facility, personnel, etc., at SFA, why not use them? And in the bargain, you would probably impress some of the Silver service pax with Autotrain and get some biz from them down the road. And the walkway would assist the mechanical guys coming over from SFA to work on the Silvers that stop in SFD for mechanical/Air/electrical repairs enroute, which happens a LOT.
 
A LOT of repairs, on what planet? In all my years I think I've stopped maybe twice at SFD for Mechanical. The station's dead, there's nothing short of putting up the money ourselves that's going to change that.
 
I can recall at least four or five times on 92 or 98 when we have stopped at SFD for folks from SFA to come work on air conditioning, or something mechanical, or something in the diner. Those stops have taken up to half an hour. At least twice it required 3-step protection (I've generally got the scanner running). And that's on this planet, on trains I've been a passenger on. I can't help it if the trains you've been on haven't stopped there for repairs, all I can comment on is the ones I've been on. Yes, the SFD station is dead, it's a disaster, it's a disgrace, nobody is disputing that, but the folks at SFA seem to have it on the ball when it comes to repair and maintenance, something which I recall you yourself have commented favorably on, if I'm not mistaken.
 
I'm not saying that Sanford Mechanical has lost their touch, they're still some of the best in the country. All I'm saying is, it seems like the fleet has been getting healthier over the years, requiring fewer stops for Mechanical. They'll still be able to stop at the old station if necessary for repairs, the platform's not going anywhere. But, the crew putting up Three Step or Blue Flag protection is standard operating procedure per CSX and NORAC operating rules whenever an employee is under or between equipment.
 
Bat51, I hate to burst your bubble, here. Your are correct in just about everything, however, WE pick up and drop off more passengers at that SFD stop than just one or two per train! The other night, I picked up eight people on #98! Coming back south, I picked ten people heading to TPA and south FL. Yeah, I have those occasions where I pick up one or two in one direction, but most of the time the station is a little busier than that. Locating a platform on the mainline adjacent to the AT facility would make sense as some of these other posters have indicated. Will that happen? No, your correct! Not likely anytime soon. Will they go through the trouble of backing the "Silver" trains into the AT platform? No, your correct again! Too many moves to accomplish that! They hate what all it takes to go to TPA now as it is! Also in regard to mechanical, don't let that "you think the fleet is a little more healthy" idea fool you. At least every other trip I have made in the last five months (including the one I just got back from) we have had to stop at SFA or SFD for some "mechanical" reason! The other night (my last trip) the "Meteor" left MIA with no lounge/cafe car in the consist. P097 dropped theirs for us at SFA, and we had to pick it up. And all three sleepers had AC problems which mechanical had to look at. Thank God we had to pick that lounge up! They would not have been there had that not been the case! The passengers were pissed off enough already, and to add insult to injury, the crew died on the law! And wouldn't ya know it, no one called the relief crew to be in place somewhere or meet us there till it was too late! We were over eight hours late into NYP! Thank goodness mechanical was there to get our stuff working! OBS...
 
OBS - Did y'all have to back in to SFA that night to clear the main because of going on the law and no relief crew having arrived in time? I think I heard all that going on the scanner. And thanks for backing up my recollection of a lot of mechanical and A/C and so forth being done to Silver Service trains by the repair & maint crews at SFA. On THIS planet. And I think a walkway over to SFA would indeed make a lot of sense for Amtrak to do so they could continue to service those 10,500 (or more) pax per year that uses SFD.
 
AmtrakWPK said:
OBS - Did y'all have to back in to SFA that night to clear the main because of going on the law and no relief crew having arrived in time? I think I heard all that going on the scanner. And thanks for backing up my recollection of a lot of mechanical and A/C and so forth being done to Silver Service trains by the repair & maint crews at SFA. On THIS planet. And I think a walkway over to SFA would indeed make a lot of sense for Amtrak to do so they could continue to service those 10,500 (or more) pax per year that uses SFD.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I agree with that Idea as realistic...improving the platform at SFD, condemning the station and build a covered walkway over to the station at SFA for PAXs to use, not actually backing into SFA, just using the platform at SFD for the stop. Again, will it happen, no, but it makes a lot of sense. OBS, I know what you mean about the SFD stop, I've had times where my sleeper had a lousy AC that SFA needed to repair so my guess is intentional or not, Silver Service will still be making frequent stops at Sanford.
 
I found the source of inflation to the 10,710 number. Anytime the Sunset terminates in Sanford, the Conductor would show anyone going to WPK or ORL as off at SFD since they left the train at that location. The numbers for boardings are compiled (I believe) from the Delay Report. This obviously would inflate the numbers at SFD to something WAY above what actually happens at that location.
 
I remember one day at Sanford we loaded about 30 elderly passengers making a trip between Sanford and Winter Park. All but 2 required the lift. We had to take turns on the crank. And of course, the same for WPK.
 

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