Hi-Level Assignments

[railiner]

More Hi Level trivia.....the lounge car also contained a 'news stand' on the upper level, offering various sundries etc.

 

[railiner]

Hi-Level cars and Superliners, unlike the Great Domes and other dome cars, had access from one car to the next on the upper level. They could thus not be used with "conventinoal" equipment, unless some sort of "transition" vehicles were inserted between them. The Great Domes, although being full-length domes, were accessed at the same level as conventional equipment, and the lower floor was actually at a lower level than the main level of conventional cars. (Actually, the lower floor of Superliners is similarly below the floor level of conventional equipment, but this isn't noticeable since Superliners aren't used in trains with conventional equipment (other than baggage cars and the occasional "private varnish").)
I don't know how the 2-level commuter-train cars were accessed in the '50s (or whenever they were first used). Some used by Caltrain today are the "lozenge" cars, with three levels (the third level being "between" the other two levels at the end, permitting access to other "lozenge" cars or even conventional equipment).

I guess you have never seen a gallery car? The entrance was on the lower level in the center of the car guarded by sliding doors. You then ascended a few steps up to the center aisle. Then you would leave the vestiblule in either direction via another sliding door into either half of the cars interior. You would then either continue down the aisle to a lower level seat, or use a spiral stairway (total of four per car), to gain access to the galleries on either side. The upper level only had room for single seats on each side.

The galleries were of open design to allow conductors to collect tickets from the main aisle on lower level. Some of these cars had great seating capacity. I believe some on the C&NW had as many as 169 seats in non-cab control cars.

 

[cpamtfan]

Hi-Level cars and Superliners, unlike the Great Domes and other dome cars, had access from one car to the next on the upper level. They could thus not be used with "conventinoal" equipment, unless some sort of "transition" vehicles were inserted between them. The Great Domes, although being full-length domes, were accessed at the same level as conventional equipment, and the lower floor was actually at a lower level than the main level of conventional cars. (Actually, the lower floor of Superliners is similarly below the floor level of conventional equipment, but this isn't noticeable since Superliners aren't used in trains with conventional equipment (other than baggage cars and the occasional "private varnish").)
I don't know how the 2-level commuter-train cars were accessed in the '50s (or whenever they were first used). Some used by Caltrain today are the "lozenge" cars, with three levels (the third level being "between" the other two levels at the end, permitting access to other "lozenge" cars or even conventional equipment).

I guess you have never seen a gallery car? The entrance was on the lower level in the center of the car guarded by sliding doors. You then ascended a few steps up to the center aisle. Then you would leave the vestiblule in either direction via another sliding door into either half of the cars interior. You would then either continue down the aisle to a lower level seat, or use a spiral stairway (total of four per car), to gain access to the galleries on either side. The upper level only had room for single seats on each side.

The galleries were of open design to allow conductors to collect tickets from the main aisle on lower level. Some of these cars had great seating capacity. I believe some on the C&NW had as many as 169 seats in non-cab control cars.

I bet these cars have horrible unloading time when full.

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

Hi-Level cars and Superliners, unlike the Great Domes and other dome cars, had access from one car to the next on the upper level. They could thus not be used with "conventinoal" equipment, unless some sort of "transition" vehicles were inserted between them. The Great Domes, although being full-length domes, were accessed at the same level as conventional equipment, and the lower floor was actually at a lower level than the main level of conventional cars. (Actually, the lower floor of Superliners is similarly below the floor level of conventional equipment, but this isn't noticeable since Superliners aren't used in trains with conventional equipment (other than baggage cars and the occasional "private varnish").)
I don't know how the 2-level commuter-train cars were accessed in the '50s (or whenever they were first used). Some used by Caltrain today are the "lozenge" cars, with three levels (the third level being "between" the other two levels at the end, permitting access to other "lozenge" cars or even conventional equipment).

I guess you have never seen a gallery car? The entrance was on the lower level in the center of the car guarded by sliding doors. You then ascended a few steps up to the center aisle. Then you would leave the vestiblule in either direction via another sliding door into either half of the cars interior. You would then either continue down the aisle to a lower level seat, or use a spiral stairway (total of four per car), to gain access to the galleries on either side. The upper level only had room for single seats on each side.

The galleries were of open design to allow conductors to collect tickets from the main aisle on lower level. Some of these cars had great seating capacity. I believe some on the C&NW had as many as 169 seats in non-cab control cars.

I bet these cars have horrible unloading time when full.

Having ridden the various Chicagoland offering of Gallery Coaches, they actually load and unload quite quickly. For one thing, the vestibule is large. And commuters are well trained creatures, knowing exactly to the foot where to stand on the platform waiting for the train to arrive and knowing when to start their way to the center of the car as their station approaches. As a result, when the doors open, things happen FAST and the train is quickly on its way.

 

[Bob Dylan]

And the thundering herd floods CUS increasing the confusion and overcrowding! :lol: Awaitng Amtrak pax wonder again why the Great Hall cant be used for coach pax,the Metro Lounge expanded where the current waiting room is and better useage of the covered entrance/exitways cant be figured out by those in charge!Chicago,we have a problem,lets not fix it! :lol: (in all honesty its probably not any worse than NYP/LAX/Toronto during rush hours but the Amtrak pax do get second fiddle here!) And the train seals perform on cue!!

 

[wrjensen]

The MARC Bi-levels (built by Kawasaki) and LIRR have the the 3 level with the connection at the same level as the single level cars. They also have the doors on the ends to work with the high platforms. Most of the METRA and Bombardier cars (TRE and GO) have the doors on the lower level.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

I bet these cars have horrible unloading time when full.

You would think so, wouldn't you? But I've seen them empty of passengers pretty quickly. The doors into the vestibule are pretty large, and the basic design of the car makes disembarking onto low-level platforms essentially level boarding. There are only a few steps into the vestibules, and they are pretty wide. The upper levels are a little slower, but from what I've seen, upper level passengers head for the vestibule much earlier than their stops.

When I first heard of them, I thought they were no end of a bad joke in bad design. But having seen them in operation, I'd say they are pretty effective. I'd even say they are a better solution for commuter operations than a standard bi-level, if you are using conductor-collection for fare control.

Although, I'd say that a POP or fare-gate system is really preferable for commuter rail. I like the idea of the conductor, "tickets please", in his uniform and all that. But unlike some rail fans I know, I can differentiate my nostalgia for the past with the more important concept of efficient modern transit.

As for what a commuter station using fare gates should look like, I'd say it should sorta look like the Newark Airport shuttle stations, but inside out. You have a glass enclosure around the entire platform. You have four or five banks of fare gates arranged in locations around the platform. The walls consist of doors with panic bars that can be opened from the inside but not the outside. Trespassing is trespassing, and you place motion activated cameras such that going around the walls via the tracks would photograph the person circumventing the gates.

Make the fine something huge and post signs explaining just how they are going to be fined a minimum of $5000, 20 days in jail, or both if they dare to board a train without swiping their fare card.

Actually, you can just use a credit-card or debit card for the fare card, while offering a fare card, perhaps with a discount.

 

[JAChooChoo]

The MARC Bi-levels (built by Kawasaki) and LIRR have the the 3 level ...............]

Mini rant here bi=2, the MARC, LI, etc are TRI-level with seating on all three.

 

[railiner]

The METRA, former Illinois Central line has the only electric MU gallery cars. I believe that this route was an early user of magnetic farecards to enter/leave station platforms.

These cars were designed to load at high level platforms, unlike locomotive hauled gallery cars.

 

[MikefromCrete]

The METRA, former Illinois Central line has the only electric MU gallery cars. I believe that this route was an early user of magnetic farecards to enter/leave station platforms.These cars were designed to load at high level platforms, unlike locomotive hauled gallery cars.

The use of the fare gates on Metra Electric was discontinued about three years ago after a near revolt by Electric District passengers. The passengers complained that they had to produce their tickets three times during a trip, to get through the gates, on the train during a 'ticket audit" by the trainmen and again when going through the gates when leaving the station. Riders on Metra's other lines needed only show their tickets on board the trains.

The gates had been a pain in the neck for years. After a huge outcry that eventually reached local politicians, including then state Sen. Barrack Obama, the Metra board finally gave in.

The board also promised new Highliner cars with washrooms, washrooms in the outlaying stations and general better housekeeping at stations. Thirty new washroom-equipped cars have been added to the fleet, but Metra has been unable to replace the original Highliners, mainly to to a lack of capital funding from the state. A new capital program has been approved an another 130 or next generation Highliners may appear sometime before the Olympics.

Now that Metra is accepting credit cars on on-line ticket purchases, credit card sales will eventually accept credit cars at ticket offices and I heard some talk that credit-card accepting ticket vending machines may also be making appearances at the busier Metra Electric stations. Outside of Randolph, Van Buren and 59th Street stations, all Metra Electric sales are by vending machine, a legacy of the Illinois Central's gate system that wiped out local ticket clerks.

The gates are gone forever. I doubt if any Metra board member or official would ever have the nerve to bring them back.

 

[railiner]

Its been a while (too long) since I've been to Chicagoland. I wasn't aware of the discontinuance of the gates. I believe BART still uses them, but then again BART is more like a big subway line in its operation.

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

When growing up in Chicago, I was always impressed how fast the Chicago and Northwestern conductors could get tickets examined and punched and sold in the case of pax boarding at an agent-less station. Recent METRA trips showed the same quick and polite efficiency. Of course a lot of this is from the little metal clips you put your ticket or display pass in, enabling the conductor to quickly see what needs to be done after each stop.

 

[railiner]

I know what you mean by efficient ticket collection. For example, watching a LIRR conductor go through a crowded train, collecting tickets, cutting cash fares, and etc., between frequent stops, is like watching an artist at work. Similarly an Amtrak conductor working train 67 from NYP to WAS late night when ticket offices are closed, selling cash fares, without a complaint and without losing a stride is something to appreciate as compared to say a conductor working the Zephyr at night, with stops hours apart, who finds selling a single cash fare to be a big inconvenience....

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

One of my most memorable C&NW trips was in the early 80s when attending the Consumer Electronics Show, last train out on the Northwest line to Arlington Heights. It was a cavalcade of drunks, most of them passed out and the conductor knew them all and made sure their wives or whatever had been called to let them know they were on their way home. He'd make sure each was safely poured off at the right stop. Talk about pulling extra duty! One of the best floor shows you can have on wheels