Current EB OTP
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anir dendroica
OBS Chief
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All EBs have been losing 1.5-4 hours between Minot and Havre. That whole area has had lots of rain, so my guess is that slow orders + freight are the culprits, just as they are on the KO detour. A single-track mainline operating near capacity is easily pushed past capacity if the trains slow down. The Devils Lake line seems pretty good at the moment with the exception of the lake itself. #7(16) lost only 35 minutes between Fargo and Minot.
Mark
Mark
My wife and took Empire Builder from Malta, MT to Chicago on 18 May (and return trip on EB 28 May) during high waters in eastern Montana and all through North Dakota. East bound EB was only 8 minutes late in Malta. Montana isn't the issue. North Dakota simply has too many issues of freight traffic which collects between Williston and Stanley; high water, rough rails, and slow orders (mandatory slow speed) across almost half the state. The Surrey Cutoff begins at the Gaston rail yards in Surrey, ND so Amtrak begins competing with westbound freight traffic here. Amtrak doesn't take the Surrey Cutoff as of late. We lost 90 minutes at Stanley waiting for 6 freight trains to pass. Rough rails - and I mean ROUGH RAILS - begin 5 miles west of Grand Forks and don't smooth until just east of Rugby. Amtrak's average speed on our trip from Malta to Willison, ND was 65 mph by my hand-held GPS. From Willison to Grand Forks, 43 mph: again by my GPS. Add high waters at Devils Lake, ND and - well - North Dakota will for the foreseeable future, cost you 3 hours time, minimum. EB through North Dakota is just a hard-luck line.
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anir dendroica
OBS Chief
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- 507
Trains aren't losing much time between Williston and Minot, but they are frequently losing an hour between stations around Wolf Point, Glasgow, and Malta. By the looks of it North Dakota has improved somewhat while eastern Montana is now the worst area.
Mark
Yesterday, #7 was "only" 51 minutes late, and 27 was "only" and hour and 17 minutes late. Today, not so lucky. 7 is 8 hours late and 27 is 7 hours down. And it does look like Montana is the sticking point. I'm wondering if there still isn't a backlog of freights that has to clear out. I'm scheduled to be on 7 to Seattle from Spokane early Tuesday; looks like I might get a few more hours' sleep Tuesday and get to see all that gorgeous (not!) scenery from Spokane to Wenatchee in daylight!
M
musikdude
Guest
If the train is very late, for example, arriving at say 10pm, will they also be having a dinner service for the sleeping car passengers (and it is still free, right) ?
anir dendroica
OBS Chief
- Joined
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From a reliable source on the Trainorders list:
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,2494916
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,2494916
M
michael Moffitt
Guest
Sadly I see the EB is now estimated to arrive in CHI more than 10 hours late today and the next couple days don't look much better, given how late the westbound trains are arriving and departing in and out of SEA. I guess the weather is the main culprit, but the run in ND thru Devil's Lake almost guarantees the trains will be late (often by several hours), causing people to miss their connections. Bummer.
anir dendroica
OBS Chief
- Joined
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- 507
I'm on the train PDX-MSP June 25. Can't say I'm looking forward to running 8 hours late, but I'm just hoping it keeps running.
Mark
Mark
I have a connection from the EB to the CS Thursday. Hope I don't get stuck in PDX overnight.
I'm catching the Builder from Spokane and going to Seattle tomorrow morning. Currently the Builder is about 4 1/2 hours late, and will most likely lose more time enroute. As I'm not making any connections tomorrow, for me, anyway, I actually prefer the Builder being a few hours late into Spokane. That way I can board it during daylight hours and I will get to see all that great scenery between Spokane and Wenatchee!! Yay!! I also can get a bit of a nap in before making the hour-long drive to Spokane's Amtrak station. It also looks like the weather, at least in the vicinity of Minot, is going to dry out later this week. So maybe while it won't be great, it also won't be any worse.
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Just got an automated phone call from Amtrak, stating that due to late operations, alternate transportation was going to be provided over "part or all of my route". Uh-oh!!!! Sounded like the dreaded bustitution!!!! :blink: :blink: :blink: . I was wondering now if the EB was going to be so late into Seattle that they were now going to do as they did a few days ago and turn it in Spokane and bus everyone to Seattle. So I got on the horn with James, a very knowledgeable and helpful Amtrak agent, to get the scoop. As it turns out, I have a choice: take a bus scheduled to leave at 2:15 AM, the regularly scheduled time, or wait for a several hours late train. Let's see: I could make the drive to Spokane and board a friggin' bus at 2:15 AM, and get to Seattle on time. Or, I could get a decent night's rest, drive to Spokane, get on an hours-late train, when I have no connection to make other than with my hotel bed and a Victoria Clipper ship on Wednesday. Get to Seattle on time by bus/get to Seattle hours late by train when I have no particular connection to make............Guess what????The hours late train wins!!!! No contest!!! Not in this situation anyway!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
EB_OBS
Conductor
More service disruptions are coming. More flooding is about to inundate Minot again. BNSF is expecting water as much as 6 feet over the rail by Thursday morning.
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I return to Spokane Friday from Portland. Looks like I may be bustituted back to Spokane whether I like it or not, if there isn't a stub train running. I knew there was a reason I hated this cold, wet, crappy spring!!!! :angry:
tnrkitect
Train Attendant
*sigh* so I take it the chances of this having subsided by Monday are slim to none?
EB_OBS
Conductor
Currently the water is expected to crest so high that estimates are that it may not subside for up to two weeks.
J
jt83
Guest
Just got an automated call from Amtrak. I'm scheduled to leave Chicago on Thurs - to Seattle. They tell me it's been cancelled. This is the second time I've been cancelled as I was first scheduled to leave on the 2nd. 
TraneMan
Conductor
Oh man.. Poor EB is not getting a break here.. I sure hope is dries up for July for our trip!
tnrkitect
Train Attendant
Vito in Amtrak Customer Service said that his system is showing the EB canceled through at least July 9th. :excl:
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And indeed I got a call from a very helpful customer service agent this evening saying that I will be bustituted from Portland to Spokane on the 24th. Ah well. My luck over the years has been extraordinarily good with Amtrak. I was due to have a glitch like this. But my main concern is with the folks in Minot. It could be the worst flooding in 125 years there, and my having to take a bus is of no concern compared to them. My heart and prayers go out to them.
I received both the automated call and a live call via voice mail. Here is a compound question.
The live call said I would be bustituted from SPK to PDX where I connect with the CS. 27, if on time, arrives just after 10:00 am in PDX. My experience is the buses can be 2-3 hours faster. Correct? That would make for a long connection time in PDX.
I am wondering whether I should try to take the SEA bustitute instead and connect with train 11 there? Less waiting time. More train time on 11.
Update: Just spoke with Amtrak. Even though the Seattle bus would arguably arrive in time for 11's departure, they say they cannot make that change. Their policy is to assume the bus would arrive at the scheduled arrival time as the train (which in this case would be too late for 11's departure).Here is the 6/21 Amtrak website advisory:
Flooding Disrupts Amtrak Service at Minot, N.D.
Amtrak service in part of Minnesota, all of North Dakota and in eastern Montana is affected by the closure of BNSF Railway Co. tracks in and around Minot, N.D., due to what is predicted to be the worst flooding in more than 120 years. Passengers with questions about travel plans on this route should call Amtrak at 800-USA-RAIL for additional information.
Empire Builder (Trains 7/27 & 8/28)
Effective in both directions with the originations of June 21, Amtrak Empire Builder service will be temporarily suspended between St. Paul, Minn., and Havre, Mont., with no alternate transportation available between those points until further notice.
For those passengers traveling from Seattle and Portland, a combination of trains and chartered motorcoaches will provide service to Spokane, Wash., with the Empire Builder trains continuing east into Idaho and serving all Montana stops for Glacier National Park (including Whitefish, East and West Glacier and Essex), continuing east to terminate at Havre each afternoon. The trains will originate there to operate back west to Seattle/Portland.
For those passengers traveling west from Chicago, the Empire Builder trains will serve all their Wisconsin stops (including Wisconsin Dells), continuing west to terminate at St. Paul each evening. Each morning, the trains will originate there to operate back east to Chicago.
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anir dendroica
OBS Chief
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2009
- Messages
- 507
At least this time the disruption is unavoidable - no possibility of detour routes or taking things two days at a time. BNSF is expecting the track through Minot to close mid-day June 23 and remain out of service for at least two weeks. If that is the case, the EB should be resuming sometime around July 8 assuming no more major rain events. Looking at the Amtrak website, reservations are currently "sold out" through July 5.
I haven't been called with an official cancellation yet - when I get the call I'll see if I can change the reservation to the end of July.
Mark
I haven't been called with an official cancellation yet - when I get the call I'll see if I can change the reservation to the end of July.
Mark
I was emailed this but Amtrak denied bus service when I called to ask about it.
Thanks
Teri
Northern Plains floods force passenger, freight delays
Published: June 21, 2011
MINOT, N.D. — The Souris River is threatening Canadian Pacific and BNSF Railway rails for the second time this summer as it reaches toward record levels. Amtrak has suspended its Empire Builder between St. Paul, Minn., and Havre, Mont., while Canadian Pacific has begun detouring freight around an outage near Roche Percee, Sask.
Amtrak says it’s suspending the Builder due to “the closure of BNSF Railway Co. tracks in and around Minot.” However, BNSF hasn’t informed customers that its main line has closed, and a BNSF spokeswoman couldn’t immediately be reached for comment. Amtrak is offering bus service between St. Paul and Havre, so passengers can travel through between Chicago and the West Coast.
CP says the Roche Percee washout, which occurred late Sunday, will close its Moose Jaw, Sask.-St. Paul route for 7-10 days. Additionally, CP says if the Souris reaches the levels currently forecasted, the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers will build a dike across its rails at Minot. The railroad has begun rerouting shipments through Thief River Falls, Minn., and is arranging for detours over Canadian National.
Thanks
Teri
Northern Plains floods force passenger, freight delays
Published: June 21, 2011
MINOT, N.D. — The Souris River is threatening Canadian Pacific and BNSF Railway rails for the second time this summer as it reaches toward record levels. Amtrak has suspended its Empire Builder between St. Paul, Minn., and Havre, Mont., while Canadian Pacific has begun detouring freight around an outage near Roche Percee, Sask.
Amtrak says it’s suspending the Builder due to “the closure of BNSF Railway Co. tracks in and around Minot.” However, BNSF hasn’t informed customers that its main line has closed, and a BNSF spokeswoman couldn’t immediately be reached for comment. Amtrak is offering bus service between St. Paul and Havre, so passengers can travel through between Chicago and the West Coast.
CP says the Roche Percee washout, which occurred late Sunday, will close its Moose Jaw, Sask.-St. Paul route for 7-10 days. Additionally, CP says if the Souris reaches the levels currently forecasted, the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers will build a dike across its rails at Minot. The railroad has begun rerouting shipments through Thief River Falls, Minn., and is arranging for detours over Canadian National.
NY Penn
OBS Chief
Amtrak specifically says on its website that there is no alternate bus service.
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