Carole Pankau is Anti-Rail

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Tim_Metra

Train Attendant
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May 2, 2009
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Chicago Western Suburbs
I had a crazy experience this morning Carole Pankau was at the Metra Station in Lombard IL collecting signatures to be place on the ballot. The only problem is that she ALWAYS votes against passenger rail! Why do Republicans do this kind of stuff???
 
I had a crazy experience this morning Carole Pankau was at the Metra Station in Lombard IL collecting signatures to be place on the ballot. The only problem is that she ALWAYS votes against passenger rail! Why do Republicans do this kind of stuff???
Hey now... don't lump all of us Republicans into that category! :) Some of us understand the importance of local, regional and national rail transit.
 
I had a crazy experience this morning Carole Pankau was at the Metra Station in Lombard IL collecting signatures to be place on the ballot. The only problem is that she ALWAYS votes against passenger rail! Why do Republicans do this kind of stuff???
Hey now... don't lump all of us Republicans into that category! :) Some of us understand the importance of local, regional and national rail transit.
There are certainly many sorts of Republicans, who have a huge variety of views on many issues -- it's a big-tent party just like the Democrats. And unsurprisingly, many of the Republicans on Amtrak Unlimited are "pro-rail Republicans" :) Just a hunch, we're unlikely to see Carole Pankau start posting here!

But I think there's a general perception that Republican elected officials tend to hue to the party line very closely on many issues, including funding for passenger rail, transit, and infrastructure. Meanwhile, there's a general perception that Democrat elected officials are more likely to disagree with each other and stray from the party line -- they're more likely to vote their own mind in Congress. Sometimes that individuality is a very good thing; sometimes it isn't; sometimes party-line voting is a good thing; sometimes it isn't; but that's another issue. Here, I'm just talking about the general perception that there's a tendency of the Republicans in Congress to not speak out against their party's line on specific issues -- especially "small" issues like passenger rail -- while there's a tendency of the Democrats in Congress to be willing to express views contrary to the party line (and to sometimes do so loudly...).

As to Tim Metra's question of "why?", I don't know. I think the reason elected officials tend to vote this way, or tend to be perceived in this way, is that the Republican Party values loyalty-to-party more strongly than the Democratic Party when deciding which candidates to endorse and fund. But as to why the party hierarchies may choose these strategies, I can't say.
 
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Perhaps you can grill, I mean ask, Sen. Carole Pankau, why he/she is against it. That'll give you a reasonable answer. "Assuming" is a very dangerous game.
 
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That'll give you a reasonable answer.
I don't know this public official, but many times a reasonable answer is unlikely. Politicians are not in the business of being reasonable IMHO. Of course this is a generalization, but too many answers I have heard to reasonable questions have been anything but reasonable.
 
But I think there's a general perception that Republican elected officials tend to hue to the party line very closely on many issues, including funding for passenger rail, transit, and infrastructure.
Once again, I seem to buck the trend.... I am a Republican Elected Official, at least on the local level. I also was one of the leaders in the effort to pass a ballot measure for Light Rail in Kansas City (It passed in my suburb, but failed in Kansas City)

My point is.... you can't judge a book by its cover, even when it comes to politicians. Granted, Pankau seems to be a hypocrite when judged by the actions described by the OP.
 
But I think there's a general perception that Republican elected officials tend to hue to the party line very closely on many issues, including funding for passenger rail, transit, and infrastructure.
Once again, I seem to buck the trend.... I am a Republican Elected Official, at least on the local level. I also was one of the leaders in the effort to pass a ballot measure for Light Rail in Kansas City (It passed in my suburb, but failed in Kansas City)
You're not the only Republican Elected Official that bucks the trend, if indeed there is one. There is only one locomotive in Amtrak's entire fleet that has been named after someone, or something for that matter. That's P42 #182, which was named in honor of at that time Republican Governor Tommy Thompson, one of Amtrak's biggest and best cheerleaders for a number of years.

And I'll also remind everyone that it was a, at that time, Republican controlled Congress that rejected President Bush's zero dollar budget for Amtrak. Additionally, two of the biggest cuts in Amtrak service happened during a year in which the Dem's controlled the White House.
 
Don't forget Kay Bailey Hutchinson. Republican though she may be, she's not very conservative. But she IS pro rail!
 
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And I'll also remind everyone that it was a, at that time, Republican controlled Congress that rejected President Bush's zero dollar budget for Amtrak. Additionally, two of the biggest cuts in Amtrak service happened during a year in which the Dem's controlled the White House.
The cuts of '79 (e.g., North Coast Hiawatha) occurred not only with a Democrat (Jimmy Carter) in the White House, but also with Democrats in control of Congress (though their majority had slipped some in the '78 elections).

The cuts of the late '90s (e.g., Pioneer, Desert Wind) occurred with a Democrat (Bill Clinton) in the White House, though Republicans controlled Congress (or at least the House).
 
Hey now... don't lump all of us Republicans into that category! :) Some of us understand the importance of local, regional and national rail transit.
I don't know that I read it right, but the way I read it was along the lines that Republicans seem to do more low things in trying to get elected then democrats.

Locally, a few elections ago, our state senate representative was up for re-election. The republican oponent kept advertising and sending around information that our current representative, who is generally considered to fairly honest for a New Jersey politican, was friends with a town mayor now in jail for corruption- and that friendship was... 20 years ago. I've not seen things that low from democratic candidates. At least not around here.

At one time in my life, I worked with a group of grifters and sometimes on my own even. Pulling C games was something I was good at and it made me some decent money. I stopped ages ago. Why? Despite the fact that the variation I ran always operated on the concept of the mark hanging himself on his own disgusting and dishonest greed, I felt bad about, essentially, stealing. 20 years from now, does what I did before I was even an adult really count? I mean it does in being elected, but does it mean I'm a dishonest person at age 40, having grown up? No. In fact, I'd say that one of the marks it left on me is helping making me the blunt and brutally honest person I am- and people dislike.

In addition, I have had friends that I have dropped over the years because they became someone I didn't like. Dishonest, or sadistic, or stupid, or wasted away down the old drain on drugs, or they stayed in the racket and ridiculed me for leaving. But am I going to turn in someone I once considered a friend? Just out of some worn-out sense of loyalty, no. I won't help them commit a crime, but I won't tattle on them, either.

So in essence, a former friendship with someone who, decades later, did something dishonest is so irrelevent to an election campaign, its not even remotely honorable to mention it. Especially the way they tried hard to down play the age of the event.

I see democrats occasionally going after inappropriate actions on the part of oponents, but they are generally new and relevent. I mean, hell, Bush II got elected, partially, on a solid smear campaign of John McCain. Who, excluding political stance, the pride of a rooster, and a volcanic temper, is essentially untouchable.

And yes, I'm sure there are quite a few Democratic schmucks out there that do sick and disgusting things in their attempts to get elected, and Republicans who try to stick to fair things. I'm just talking generalities.
 
OK; I get that not all Republicans are anti-rail. How about all the Republicans on this forum get more active in your party! Because in my few years being interested in this subject it seems that Anti-Rail = Republican. Remeber that every time you fill up your car's gas tank you help fund Terrorism. It would be interesting to find what percentage of crude oil profits go to create I.E.D.s !
 
How about all the Republicans on this forum get more active in your party!
Well, this particular forum member is a conservative Republican who is very active in Tennessee politics.

I enjoy talking to my colleagues about passenger rail and I find that most of them are very much in favor of it. It's Amtrak that they don't particularly like.
 
How about all the Republicans on this forum get more active in your party!
Well, this particular forum member is a conservative Republican who is very active in Tennessee politics.

I enjoy talking to my colleagues about passenger rail and I find that most of them are very much in favor of it. It's Amtrak that they don't particularly like.

Reminds me of an old bumper sticker,

"I like trains. It's just the railroad I can't stand."
 
How about all the Republicans on this forum get more active in your party!
Well, this particular forum member is a conservative Republican who is very active in Tennessee politics.

I enjoy talking to my colleagues about passenger rail and I find that most of them are very much in favor of it. It's Amtrak that they don't particularly like.
I'm curious, what do they like (if not Amtrak)?

The only other passenger rail (non-tourist) I'm aware of in Tennessee is the Music City Star, which has one 32-mile line heading east from Nashville. (Wikipedia says there are six more lines planned, but I can't find information elsewhere to back that up or say where.) Ridership of the Star appears to be great, so I hope they do expand their operations!

And what do they not like about Amtrak? Is it just that it doesn't serve Tennessee very well? Has there been any consideration to a state-funded route connecting Memphis-Jackson-Nashville-Knoxville-Bristol? It seems like a ready-made state corridor route, following the model many states have successfully implemented.
 
OK; I get that not all Republicans are anti-rail. How about all the Republicans on this forum get more active in your party! Because in my few years being interested in this subject it seems that Anti-Rail = Republican. Remeber that every time you fill up your car's gas tank you help fund Terrorism. It would be interesting to find what percentage of crude oil profits go to create I.E.D.s !
If you don't want oil money going to terrorists, then we need to get it from those who aren't terrorists—namely, domestic sources. It's not reasonable to assume we're going to quit using oil altogether, or even reduce it significantly.

Electricity is not going to replace oil. As many of you have pointed out in other threads, electric trains are not going to replace diesels anytime soon on the vast majority of American railroads. In addition, in some parts of the country, electricity is generated from diesel or oil-powered generators.

But how many political leaders, Republican or Democrat, have offered up any solutions that will realistically eliminate or drastically reduce our dependence on foreign oil? BTW, anyone suggesting the development of unreliable sources, such as solar or wind, or largely unavailable sources, such as geothermal, is not offering a realistic solution.
 
The only other passenger rail (non-tourist) I'm aware of in Tennessee is the Music City Star, which has one 32-mile line heading east from Nashville. (Wikipedia says there are six more lines planned, but I can't find information elsewhere to back that up or say where.) Ridership of the Star appears to be great, so I hope they do expand their operations!
I was going to college in Nashville when the Music City Star was in the early planning stages. The plan was to open the eastern leg, prove how successful it would be, then use those results as justification for several additional lines. I don't recall off the top of my head exactly where the other lines would serve, but there were 5 or 6 additional lines in the original plans.

Despite what it appears to us as great ridership numbers, this seems to be a case of failing to manage the expectations of the public. The local media in Nashville seems to enjoy pointing out (or it did when I still regularly read the Nashville papers) that the Star hasn't met ridership estimates and what the paper saw as mismanagement at the RTA.
 
OK; I get that not all Republicans are anti-rail. How about all the Republicans on this forum get more active in your party! Because in my few years being interested in this subject it seems that Anti-Rail = Republican. Remeber that every time you fill up your car's gas tank you help fund Terrorism. It would be interesting to find what percentage of crude oil profits go to create I.E.D.s !
If you don't want oil money going to terrorists, then we need to get it from those who aren't terrorists—namely, domestic sources. It's not reasonable to assume we're going to quit using oil altogether, or even reduce it significantly.

Electricity is not going to replace oil. As many of you have pointed out in other threads, electric trains are not going to replace diesels anytime soon on the vast majority of American railroads. In addition, in some parts of the country, electricity is generated from diesel or oil-powered generators.

But how many political leaders, Republican or Democrat, have offered up any solutions that will realistically eliminate or drastically reduce our dependence on foreign oil? BTW, anyone suggesting the development of unreliable sources, such as solar or wind, or largely unavailable sources, such as geothermal, is not offering a realistic solution.
I just looked up to see where we get our oil from, you can see it here.

It is possible that at least one country on this list may fund terrorism, but you will notice that we do not purchase from Iran, which is the main source of IED's sent to Iraq & Afghanistan, and most of the rockets that hit Israel.

We really should use our own oil supplies rather than be dependant on anyone else.

But for some reason, we would rather buy from others. It does not make sense to me. As long as we use our resources responsibly, there shouldn't be a problem.

I don't think we will ever eliminate all our oil use.
 
I just looked up to see where we get our oil from, you can see it here. It is possible that at least one country on this list may fund terrorism, but you will notice that we do not purchase from Iran, which is the main source of IED's sent to Iraq & Afghanistan, and most of the rockets that hit Israel.

We really should use our own oil supplies rather than be dependant on anyone else.

But for some reason, we would rather buy from others. It does not make sense to me. As long as we use our resources responsibly, there shouldn't be a problem.

I don't think we will ever eliminate all our oil use.
Its like a lot of other things domestically, it costs more to source it here then to source it elsewhere. And people don't like paying so much for their oil.

As for Iran, they are not as guilty as everyone thinks they are. They are especially not a major source of arms.
 
I just looked up to see where we get our oil from, you can see it here. It is possible that at least one country on this list may fund terrorism, but you will notice that we do not purchase from Iran, which is the main source of IED's sent to Iraq & Afghanistan, and most of the rockets that hit Israel.

We really should use our own oil supplies rather than be dependant on anyone else.

But for some reason, we would rather buy from others. It does not make sense to me. As long as we use our resources responsibly, there shouldn't be a problem.

I don't think we will ever eliminate all our oil use.
We produce 7.46 million barrels a day. We consume 19.77 million barrels a day. We can't avoid importing oil. And, according to the NY Times, private donations from oil-producing states (Saudi Arabia, UAE) are a major source of Taliban funding.
 
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I just looked up to see where we get our oil from, you can see it here. It is possible that at least one country on this list may fund terrorism, but you will notice that we do not purchase from Iran, which is the main source of IED's sent to Iraq & Afghanistan, and most of the rockets that hit Israel.

We really should use our own oil supplies rather than be dependant on anyone else.

But for some reason, we would rather buy from others. It does not make sense to me. As long as we use our resources responsibly, there shouldn't be a problem.

I don't think we will ever eliminate all our oil use.
We produce 7.46 million barrels a day. We consume 19.77 million barrels a day. We can't avoid importing oil. And, according to the NY Times, private donations from oil-producing states (Saudi Arabia, UAE) are a major source of Taliban funding.
We really need to produce more of our own-we have plenty of places to get it!

It seems to me that it would be smarter for us to use our own, then we would not have to jump through their hoops to get it.

You mentioned 'private donations' funding the Taliban-how can we curtail that? Since the countries you mentioned have been made extremely wealthy- and not just from us-if all countries stopped buying their oil right now, it would probably have no effect.

I'm not saying just continue-we need to be self sufficient!
 
I'm curious, what do they like (if not Amtrak)?
The only other passenger rail (non-tourist) I'm aware of in Tennessee is the Music City Star, which has one 32-mile line heading east from Nashville. (Wikipedia says there are six more lines planned, but I can't find information elsewhere to back that up or say where.) Ridership of the Star appears to be great, so I hope they do expand their operations!

And what do they not like about Amtrak? Is it just that it doesn't serve Tennessee very well? Has there been any consideration to a state-funded route connecting Memphis-Jackson-Nashville-Knoxville-Bristol? It seems like a ready-made state corridor route, following the model many states have successfully implemented.
I'll give you my best summary based on numerous conversations.

People in our area who know anything about Amtrak tend to resent the fact that they eliminated service to our capital city, but our tax dollars insure that other cities like Jacksonville and New Orleans have service. I conjecture that people in Louisville, Columbus and Akron feel the same way. You can blame government officials all you want for that one, namely Carter, but Amtrak is the front line entity that gets the bad name.

Amtrak's labor relations are another turnoff to Republicans and some Democrats, but that's a whole issue in and of itself.

Another opinion I've come across is from Amtrak's negative publicity due to accidents, stalled trains, chronically late trains, etc. You also have people who drove out of their way to Memphis or Atlanta to board an Amtrak train only to find unclean restrooms and rude personnel. That doesn't help either.

I do my part to help get the facts out about Amtrak and to keep the idea of expanded passenger rail service in people's minds, but sometimes Amtrak makes it difficult. They enticed Tennesseans by doing a test run of the Kentucky Cardinal all the way down to Nashville and they got good publicity from it, but then they turned around and eliminated the entire route.

If anybody's interested, I'll give you a whole spill on why the Kentucky Cardinal fiasco did terrible harm to Amtrak's reputation from start to finish. I fought a long, hard battle on that issue and got nowhere.
 
I'm curious, what do they like (if not Amtrak)?
The only other passenger rail (non-tourist) I'm aware of in Tennessee is the Music City Star, which has one 32-mile line heading east from Nashville. (Wikipedia says there are six more lines planned, but I can't find information elsewhere to back that up or say where.) Ridership of the Star appears to be great, so I hope they do expand their operations!

And what do they not like about Amtrak? Is it just that it doesn't serve Tennessee very well? Has there been any consideration to a state-funded route connecting Memphis-Jackson-Nashville-Knoxville-Bristol? It seems like a ready-made state corridor route, following the model many states have successfully implemented.
I'll give you my best summary based on numerous conversations.

People in our area who know anything about Amtrak tend to resent the fact that they eliminated service to our capital city, but our tax dollars insure that other cities like Jacksonville and New Orleans have service. I conjecture that people in Louisville, Columbus and Akron feel the same way. You can blame government officials all you want for that one, namely Carter, but Amtrak is the front line entity that gets the bad name.

Amtrak's labor relations are another turnoff to Republicans and some Democrats, but that's a whole issue in and of itself.

Another opinion I've come across is from Amtrak's negative publicity due to accidents, stalled trains, chronically late trains, etc. You also have people who drove out of their way to Memphis or Atlanta to board an Amtrak train only to find unclean restrooms and rude personnel. That doesn't help either.

I do my part to help get the facts out about Amtrak and to keep the idea of expanded passenger rail service in people's minds, but sometimes Amtrak makes it difficult. They enticed Tennesseans by doing a test run of the Kentucky Cardinal all the way down to Nashville and they got good publicity from it, but then they turned around and eliminated the entire route.

If anybody's interested, I'll give you a whole spill on why the Kentucky Cardinal fiasco did terrible harm to Amtrak's reputation from start to finish. I fought a long, hard battle on that issue and got nowhere.
I have a very different Amtrak experience in Chicago. Amtrak is in a wonderfully clean downtown station with good connections to our local regional rail (METRA).
 
And what do they not like about Amtrak? Is it just that it doesn't serve Tennessee very well? Has there been any consideration to a state-funded route connecting Memphis-Jackson-Nashville-Knoxville-Bristol? It seems like a ready-made state corridor route, following the model many states have successfully implemented.
Lack of tracks. When there were tracks, the trains were relatively slowk, due primarily to topography. It was not for lack of trying, at least on the Memphis Jackson Nashville route. The NC&StL fielded a new day train with considerable fanfare in the late 1940's. within less than five years it was coaches - usually one coach only, and died in 1957 or thereabouts. Nashville Knoxville via the Tennessee Central went even earlier. The route was so slow, that you did it about as fast by going through Chattanooga.

Now, the through tracks are simply GONE. Memphis Jackson TN was taken up in the mid 1960's. the Tennessee Central went bankrupt in the late 1960's, was split up and partly abandoned. You can still do Nashville to Knoxville via Chattanooga, but there is unlikely to be any market for a service that takes over 6 hours between points that can be driven in under 3. Yes, Knoxville Bristol is still there, but is a slow and crooked line.

A resurrected "Tennessean" would be possible, but it got the name as much because it followed the river than for anything else, as it did not serve the middle of the state. Not likely to be much ridership for a train that averaged less than 40 mph, either.
 
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