Brightline Trains Florida discussion

[cirdan]

I like the design and branding. I hope it turns into a success.

 

[Anderson]

The bright yellow makes me wince a little bit and some of the styling is a bit more "futuristic" or "post-modern" than I might prefer...but it's all quite well done and even in the aspects I like least, I'll readily concede that they seem to have avoided the worst excesses of that sort of design.

(I'll concede that I am not a fan of the lots-of-glass school of design...but that's also just me)

 

[cirdan]

(I'll concede that I am not a fan of the lots-of-glass school of design...but that's also just me)

Neither am I, but they don't do Beaux Arts skyscrapers any more these days, and when they do try the result usually looks tacky.

And I've definitely seen far uglier stuff than what AAF is proposing. So I'll be happy to go with it.

 

[jis]

This is very exciting for Florida! I am looking forward to driving to OIA to catch the train to South Florida and maybe someday Brightline will come to Jacksonville.

I am looking forward to the addition of a stop in Brevard County. As soon as that happens I will become a regular user of it to get to both Miami and Orlando. No more drives to Orlando Airport to catch flights! Though it is possible that the lack of train schedules later in the evening might force me to drive anyway.

I love both the name and the colors! I think an Orlando to West Palm Beach trip is in my future in a couple of years.

I do like the livery and the copious use of colors other than dull blue and dull red as in the Phase IV of Amtrak.

It looks like the FEC Chargers will look somewhat different from the run of the mill Chargers that the midwest and western states will get. looks like Siemens is working hard to make the AAF trains look like genuine integrated consists rather than just a rag tag circus of cars and locomotives slapped together.

 

[jis]

For this of you that have a Facebook account, you may find this page interesting as they post more info there:

https://www.facebook.com/GoBrightline/

And here is a little video ad:

https://www.youtube.com/embed/oDo0IBZY2ME

 

[jphjaxfl]

If the first Brightline route from OIA to Miami is successful and I believe it will be, I have no doubt that other routes and additional stops will be forthcoming. I think that eventually even the NIMBYs from Cocoa to West Palm will change their opinion.

 

[Caesar La Rock]

Can't wait to see what the passenger cars will look like. Can't wait for this to operate.

 

[jis]

If the first Brightline route from OIA to Miami is successful and I believe it will be, I have no doubt that other routes and additional stops will be forthcoming. I think that eventually even the NIMBYs from Cocoa to West Palm will change their opinion.

What NIMBYs from Cocoa? I think Cocoa and Melbourne were the two major supporting communities in Brevard County Commissioners meeting, even though they are not immediately getting a station. Some of that support does involve a quid pro quo of being given the first new station beyond the original project it would seem. Indeed Brevard County is already working with AAF to agree upon the location of a stop in North Brevard County. Most likely it will be somewhere between Cocoa and Melbourne, perhaps in Rockledge or some such.

So yeah, the NIMBY is mostly in Indian River, St. Lucie and Martin Counties where they are actually using Taxpayer money to legally try to oppose, and so far failing miserably, pissing away millions of dollars that could have been gainfully used elsewhere. There are some elements in South Brevard. For example the South Brevard County Commissioner is against it but the Mayor of Palm Bay, the largest incorporated community in South Brevard is for it. North Brevard has been for it for at least 18 months now. They have done some hard nosed negotiation with AAF to get grade crossing improvements funded etc., but that IMHO is a reasonable discussion to be had.

Frankly, Cocoa and Cape Canaveral want a spur built to Port Canaveral some day to capture the Orlando to Port Canaveral traffic and such.

 

[Brian_tampa]

I really like the name and color scheme(s) that they have chosen. I think the Brightline name was known for awhile (at least in online forums and at the TC Palm) ever since one of the opponents to AAF discovered it last year not long after AAF applied for a trademark.

I agree with jis above that the NIMBYS are a problem mostly in Indian River, St Lucie and Martin Counties. Brevard wants a station and is willing to work with AAF to get one, unlike the 3 counties just to their south.

As far as future expansion, AAF has hinted recently that it would be considered as soon as the original route is operating. I know that AAF/FECI have been watching developments in Tampa (transit plans and a lot of downtown real estate development projects in the next 5-10yrs) as well as along the I-4 corridor (in regards to FDOT future plans) for some time now. Jacksonville is also on their radar. So it would not surprise me to see either route chosen for their next expansion leg.

It was interesting that AAF and the boaters in Ft Lauderdale have come to an agreement just recently over the New River drawbridge. Also, the sale of bonds has been reported to taking place this week sometime. Reuters had an online article about the bonds last Friday. So a lot seems to be coming into place quickly now. I do need to get to the Orlando airport soon to check out construction. I was last there in July and they were moving a lot of earth and starting some foundation work on roads and canals/ponds.

 

[jis]

You may or may not agree with all of it but I found this documentary to be quite uplifting. It was released today by its creator Dimitrius Villa in conjunction with the AAF/Brightline announcements. It is about the All Aboard Florida with a historical perspective and a broader modern context. Among others Gene Skorpowski participates in it. Give it a shot. you might enjoy it. It is about 28 minutes long.

 

[Palmetto]

Good show. Thanks for linking it!

 

[jphjaxfl]

Excellent video! Thanks for the link.

 

[Steve4031]

Building a station near the cruise terminal is a possibility too imho. On cruise days when several ships depart port canaveral it's possible that over 10, 000 people board or debarked ships.

 

[chrsjrcj]

Was on LinkedIn and saw that this job opening popped up 12 days ago: https://jobs.usa.siemens-info.com/jobs/144810?sourceType=PREMIUM_POST_SITE&source=LinkedIn(Wrap)

Job Description
Rolling Stock Maintenance Superintendent

The Rolling Stock Maintenance Superintendent has primary responsibility for the safe and profitable execution of the long term maintenance contract for a brand new fleet of high-tech rolling stock. This rolling stock consists of Tier 4 compliant high-horsepower locomotives in a push-pull configuration with elegant coaches intended to deliver a high-end customer experience. These trains will operate up to 125 mph from Orlando to Miami 7 days a week.

 

[Anderson]

Building a station near the cruise terminal is a possibility too imho. On cruise days when several ships depart port canaveral it's possible that over 10, 000 people board or debarked ships.

In Miami? Plausible; I could see AAF runnig something like a DMU shuttle (or a back-and-forth run with one or two sets) between MiamiCentral and the port.

In Canaveral? Not a bloody chance. You'd have to put in a very high bridge over the Indian River and another one over the Banana River. However, I think the old Cocoa FEC station is roughly at US1 and SR528...which would be a pretty good place to stage shuttle buses. I believe FEC has hinted that they're pursuing this option, especially since if their system is fully fleshed-out you'd have four destinations to take cruise pax (Jacksonville, South Florida, Orlando, and Tampa) for flights and/or other parts of a package.

 

[jis]

Or two drawbridges. But that won't happen either. Suffice it to say though, two 50' high fixed span bridges on a passenger railroad is quite feasible and probably way cheaper in this day and age. After all significant parts of the Delhi Metro is built 50' or 60' high elevated structures and they are visually not that horrible either.

And BTW anything to do with passenger service is FECI via AAF and not FECR the railroad. They are both separate subsidiaries of the Fortress Group. Oddly AAF has no direct corporate relationship with FECR other than through specific arms length contracts.

 

[A Voice]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-11-12/junk-deals-derailed-as-high-yield-muni-funds-pull-in-less-cash

From the linked article:

The Florida Development Finance Corp. this week postponed a $1.75 billion unrated bond sale for All Aboard Florida, a passenger railroad backed by Fortress Investment Group LLC, that underwriters have been marketing since August.

 

[Alex M.]

Maybe they should call the Chinese or the Japanese since they are sinking big money in US high speed rail. Since Siemens is a German company, perhaps Germany could be enticed to invest.

 

[jis]

FECI has basically said they will fund it themselves if none of the plans for getting additional debt funding pan out. There is of course the RRIF loan yet to fall back on, leading to another set of political firestorm first.

 

[neroden]

Hmmm. Miami to the cruise ship terminal? this might be a case where extending the silly Metromover would make sense, given how short the trip is.

 

[jis]

Hmmm. Miami to the cruise ship terminal? this might be a case where extending the silly Metromover would make sense, given how short the trip is.

There is an LRT proposal moving along for exactly that sort of thing, to the cruise terminal and also to South Beach.

 

[chrsjrcj]

Just got back from a drive from North Florida back home to West Palm Beach. Full service for this thing cannot come soon enough! Over $10 in tolls on the Turnpike (with SunPass) plus $30 for a tank of a gas...oh and $200 for a new windshield because debris from a truck cracked it. :angry:

Anyway, I took a quick trip to downtown to see the latest happenings since I've been gone and saw that a third track is being added. It's really part of the double track for the passenger trains into the station, but I was surprised to see double tracking at the station happening already, especially considering that freights won't ever be able to use it and passenger service is still more than a year off.

 

[Anderson]

Just got back from a drive from North Florida back home to West Palm Beach. Full service for this thing cannot come soon enough! Over $10 in tolls on the Turnpike (with SunPass) plus $30 for a tank of a gas...oh and $200 for a new windshield because debris from a truck cracked it. :angry:

Anyway, I took a quick trip to downtown to see the latest happenings since I've been gone and saw that a third track is being added. It's really part of the double track for the passenger trains into the station, but I was surprised to see double tracking at the station happening already, especially considering that freights won't ever be able to use it and passenger service is still more than a year off.

Well, do bear in mind that:

(1) Building the track is (relatively) easy;

(2) Most of that year is going to involve building stations, permits, etc.; and

(3) It may well be easier to build the station(s) with the new track in place first, lest something get messed up by a few inches and a lot of money (Hope, AR comes to mind).

 

[jis]

It is supposed to be early 2017 for West Palm Beach service anyway is what I am hearing.

The third track at the stations is to bypass the freights around the station while the station is built. Or so I hear from the AAF folks. We will get a first hand report from AAF on the 19th and then we'll know a bit more.

 

[jis]

Brightline Project moves ahead; Brevard seeks stops

Four Brevard County communities — Cocoa, Melbourne, Palm Bay and Rockledge — have submitted proposals to the Space Coast Transportation Planning Organization, detailing where they believe the ideal site for a passenger train station in their communities would be. Cocoa submitted four sites, and the others one apiece.

The Transportation Planning Organization and its consultant plan to meet with representatives of the four cities, then present their findings to the TPO's 19-member governing board in February. That board then will be asked to recommend a single site to All Aboard Florida for consideration.

Now if only the three counties to our south will stop being gratuitously obstructive and start asking for station(s) instead of sitting grumpily on the sideline complaining about random things.