Transition (Crew) Sleepers

[Blue Marble Travel]

On a Dec. 19 trip on the "Capitol Limited," I was sold an economy room in the transition (crew) sleeper, a first for me. The car appeared to have an attendant, but I'm not actually sure: a pleasant gentleman wearing only some elements of a uniform helped with boarding and alighting, but never introduced himself (at least not to me — I went straight to the lounge upon boarding), and never set up a coffee station (for instance). Ten rooms appear to have been sold, on the upper level of the car.

Does anyone understand how these sleepers are being used? Specifically:

(1) When are rooms offered for sale?

(2) Is the car "staffed?" If so, does the Attendant have any other duties? (If not, this has to be the easiest OBS job ever...)

 

[EB_OBS]

On the Empire Builder only four rooms are sold to passengers. The attendant in the next car serves these rooms. There usually isn't a coffee station set up in the dorm car. In most of them there is a restroom with shower right near where the four rooms are.

I know some other LD trains sell six or even eight rooms in the dorm car. I'm unsure how it's currently working as far as the attendant goes. I know at one time there was only one attendant that had to work both a coach car and the dorm, however this isn't very tenable due to the several cars distance between the two. Either one car or the other is neglected. I had heard that the Chicago crew base at least put an attendant on the CZ whose only car was the dorm car.

 

[OBS]

On the CL, the attendant from the 01 sleeper has the responsibility for the rooms sold in the transition car. There is never (that I know of) a coffee station set up in that car, rather you are invited to utilize the provisions of the 01 car. Upon boarding the train in DC, it is usually one of the Cdr.'s boarding that car since the attendant is stationed at his own (01) car door. They do sell all 8 rooms, however try to utilize these spaces first for those traveling on business passes, ie rather than booking those traveling on business passes into regular sleepers if possible.

 

[Trogdor]

On the Capitol Limited and several other Superliner trains, four rooms in the transition sleeper are sold as revenue rooms. They are in inventory all year round, but Arrow is set up to sell those rooms last, after all other revenue rooms have been sold.

A quick check of Arrow right now shows only four transition sleeper rooms designated as revenue space on any Superliner train (except the Auto Train, which does not have revenue space in the dorm car).

Depending on the train, there may be between one and four rooms set aside for company travel (non-crew). These rooms will not appear in revenue inventory, but will (as noted by OBS) appear in passrider inventory. Employees traveling on company business can book those rooms at any time. Employees traveling on personal travel can take those rooms within 24 hours of departure if they are empty.

It's possible/likely that whoever helped you board was an employee traveling, but not working the train.

 

[printman2000]

I bought my tickets for the Coast Starlight within an hour or two of when they released them and we got put in the transition sleeper. Could be because it was southbound and we had to get off in Sacramento. Anyway, they were definitely not the last rooms sold. They were open from the very start.

 

[EB_OBS]

I bought my tickets for the Coast Starlight within an hour or two of when they released them and we got put in the transition sleeper. Could be because it was southbound and we had to get off in Sacramento. Anyway, they were definitely not the last rooms sold. They were open from the very start.

Are you saying you bought the tickets one year in advance and the room you were given was a room in the dorm?

 

[zephyr17]

I bought my tickets for the Coast Starlight within an hour or two of when they released them and we got put in the transition sleeper. Could be because it was southbound and we had to get off in Sacramento. Anyway, they were definitely not the last rooms sold. They were open from the very start.

Are you saying you bought the tickets one year in advance and the room you were given was a room in the dorm?

Which is why, until they have room selection on the website, I book sleeper trips with a live agent. I am among those folks who don't like the trans-dorm.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

Are you saying you bought the tickets one year in advance and the room you were given was a room in the dorm?

Could it be that for the low/current bucket, the other sleepers were already booked? That would leave either a low/current bucket room in the transdorm, or a higher bucker room in a regular sleeper.

Or are the transdorm rooms always at the highest bucket, making them the last to book?

 

[printman2000]

I bought my tickets for the Coast Starlight within an hour or two of when they released them and we got put in the transition sleeper. Could be because it was southbound and we had to get off in Sacramento. Anyway, they were definitely not the last rooms sold. They were open from the very start.

Are you saying you bought the tickets one year in advance and the room you were given was a room in the dorm?

Well, 11 months in advance because that is the earliest you can get them. And it was at the low bucket.

 

[Montanan]

Seems like I've seen a couple of reports lately where the transition dorm was the only sleeping car in the City of New Orleans consist. Roomettes only on that train now, or was it an anomaly?

 

[manchacrr]

Seems like I've seen a couple of reports lately where the transition dorm was the only sleeping car in the City of New Orleans consist. Roomettes only on that train now, or was it an anomaly?

The City of New Orleans still has its revenue sleeper in addition to the trans-dorm. It has just been moved to the rear of the train.

The consist is as follows for the CONO:

P42

Trans-dorm

Cross Country Cafe

Sightseer Lounge

Bag-Coach

Coach

Coach

Sleeper

 

[Montanan]

Seems like I've seen a couple of reports lately where the transition dorm was the only sleeping car in the City of New Orleans consist. Roomettes only on that train now, or was it an anomaly?

The City of New Orleans still has its revenue sleeper in addition to the trans-dorm. It has just been moved to the rear of the train.

The consist is as follows for the CONO:

P42

Trans-dorm

Cross Country Cafe

Sightseer Lounge

Bag-Coach

Coach

Coach

Sleeper

Good to hear. (Somebody on the CONO Yahoo group recently reported a consist that didn't include the rear sleeper.)

 

[Trogdor]

Could it be that for the low/current bucket, the other sleepers were already booked? That would leave either a low/current bucket room in the transdorm, or a higher bucker room in a regular sleeper.

Or are the transdorm rooms always at the highest bucket, making them the last to book?

No, because fare buckets aren't assigned to rooms.

That said, there are a few other possible reasons why someone might have been put in the transition sleeper despite booking 11 months in advance:

1) A tour group booked nearly the entire train (my understanding, which could be wrong, is that travel agencies that book large groups actually get access to trains a few days before the general public, just so they can reserve large blocks of rooms).

2) Someone else just so happened to book right before you did, and specifically requested a room in the dorm car from SAC-wherever. Arrow is set up to look for ways to maximize space utilization, so of there is a room booked SAC-LAX, and someone wants to book SEA-SAC, the system will put them into the same room.

3) There very well could have been a glitch or some other error that caused the transition car to get a sales preference over the normal sleepers.

However, I'm guessing #1 is the most likely, given that tours do tend to book up entire sleepers many, many months in advance.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

No, because fare buckets aren't assigned to rooms.

Don't they spread out the bookings, so that the sleepers will fill up evenly?

 

[EB_OBS]

I believe that one of the flaws with the bucket system and the trans-dorm is that if these rooms are held out until the end, then people end up paying higher bucket fares for rooms which essentially many passengers consider inferior and they feel neglected by some attendants.

 

[Blue Marble Travel]

Thank you all for the contributions. There seems to be a consensus around the "4 revenue rooms" thing, and I can't say for sure that the other pax in the 9 upstairsrooms weren't pass riders, or whatever... but there are reasons to be suspicious.

(1) I was assigned to room 17, close to the center of the car. Wouldn't the four rooms used logically be those closest to the revenue sleeper? In the event, all 9 rooms were occupied (one is transformed into a sort of office).

(2) The pax in those other 9 rooms did not, for the most part, "smell like" Amtrak employees. Several foreigners, mostly couples, children... Of course, could be that I just noticed those, and that they corresponded to the "revenue rooms." But it is certain that more than 4 cabins were occupied by passengers who did not appear to be associated with the railroad. The Australians opposite me had never been on a train before, for instance.

Still, who knows? I cannot be sure of what I say in all cases.

And I'm grateful for the input.

Note that I was in a high "bucket" room, after I accidentally canceled my res, and had to rebook. So it does not appear to be the case that the "high bucket" passengers are given some sort of preference in the regular car.

 

[Trogdor]

Thank you all for the contributions. There seems to be a consensus around the "4 revenue rooms" thing, and I can't say for sure that the other pax in the 9 upstairsrooms weren't pass riders, or whatever... but there are reasons to be suspicious.

(1) I was assigned to room 17, close to the center of the car. Wouldn't the four rooms used logically be those closest to the revenue sleeper? In the event, all 9 rooms were occupied (one is transformed into a sort of office).

(2) The pax in those other 9 rooms did not, for the most part, "smell like" Amtrak employees. Several foreigners, mostly couples, children... Of course, could be that I just noticed those, and that they corresponded to the "revenue rooms." But it is certain that more than 4 cabins were occupied by passengers who did not appear to be associated with the railroad. The Australians opposite me had never been on a train before, for instance.

Still, who knows? I cannot be sure of what I say in all cases.

And I'm grateful for the input.

Note that I was in a high "bucket" room, after I accidentally canceled my res, and had to rebook. So it does not appear to be the case that the "high bucket" passengers are given some sort of preference in the regular car.

Rooms 17, 18, 19 and 20 are revenue. Only about 12 or so transition sleepers have a room 16 (it is not sold or booked for revenue or employees, because very few cars have that room). The other 30 or so cars have a shower/toilet where room 16 is. Room 15 is an "office" of sorts, though it really doesn't have much use except as storage. One sleeper had that room converted into a single-bed roomette with the idea that it might eventually become an attendant's room.

Rooms 21, 22, 23 and 24 are "BT" rooms, reserved for employee and company pass rider use. Note, also, that pass riders may include spouses/children of employees, and not necessarily employees themselves. Employees also include office staff and other people that "smell like" (not sure what that means?) non-Amtrak employees. Not every employee wears a uniform and BSes with the conductors for half the trip.

It's also possible that one or more of those rooms was used as an emergency substitute for another revenue sleeper room that was bad-ordered in another car.

But nonetheless, I've seen many pass riders in the BT rooms that, unless you actually spoke with them, you'd never know they were employees.

 

[Blue Marble Travel]

Thank you all for the contributions. There seems to be a consensus around the "4 revenue rooms" thing, and I can't say for sure that the other pax in the 9 upstairsrooms weren't pass riders, or whatever... but there are reasons to be suspicious.

(1) I was assigned to room 17, close to the center of the car. Wouldn't the four rooms used logically be those closest to the revenue sleeper? In the event, all 9 rooms were occupied (one is transformed into a sort of office).

(2) The pax in those other 9 rooms did not, for the most part, "smell like" Amtrak employees. Several foreigners, mostly couples, children... Of course, could be that I just noticed those, and that they corresponded to the "revenue rooms." But it is certain that more than 4 cabins were occupied by passengers who did not appear to be associated with the railroad. The Australians opposite me had never been on a train before, for instance.

Still, who knows? I cannot be sure of what I say in all cases.

And I'm grateful for the input.

Note that I was in a high "bucket" room, after I accidentally canceled my res, and had to rebook. So it does not appear to be the case that the "high bucket" passengers are given some sort of preference in the regular car.

Rooms 17, 18, 19 and 20 are revenue. Only about 12 or so transition sleepers have a room 16 (it is not sold or booked for revenue or employees, because very few cars have that room). The other 30 or so cars have a shower/toilet where room 16 is. Room 15 is an "office" of sorts, though it really doesn't have much use except as storage. One sleeper had that room converted into a single-bed roomette with the idea that it might eventually become an attendant's room.

Rooms 21, 22, 23 and 24 are "BT" rooms, reserved for employee and company pass rider use. Note, also, that pass riders may include spouses/children of employees, and not necessarily employees themselves. Employees also include office staff and other people that "smell like" (not sure what that means?) non-Amtrak employees. Not every employee wears a uniform and BSes with the conductors for half the trip.

It's also possible that one or more of those rooms was used as an emergency substitute for another revenue sleeper room that was bad-ordered in another car.

But nonetheless, I've seen many pass riders in the BT rooms that, unless you actually spoke with them, you'd never know they were employees.

OK, thanks for the clarification.

I don't know what "smells like" means, either. Only that an Australian family does not.

 

[printman2000]

No, because fare buckets aren't assigned to rooms.

That said, there are a few other possible reasons why someone might have been put in the transition sleeper despite booking 11 months in advance:

1) A tour group booked nearly the entire train (my understanding, which could be wrong, is that travel agencies that book large groups actually get access to trains a few days before the general public, just so they can reserve large blocks of rooms).

2) Someone else just so happened to book right before you did, and specifically requested a room in the dorm car from SAC-wherever. Arrow is set up to look for ways to maximize space utilization, so of there is a room booked SAC-LAX, and someone wants to book SEA-SAC, the system will put them into the same room.

3) There very well could have been a glitch or some other error that caused the transition car to get a sales preference over the normal sleepers.

However, I'm guessing #1 is the most likely, given that tours do tend to book up entire sleepers many, many months in advance.

I am fairly certain a tour group did not book three entire sleepers. If it is true that transiton sleepers are the last to get assigned, then that is what would have to have happened if it was a tour group.

I am betting they have something in there to put shorter trip passengers in the TS when possible.

 

[Trogdor]

No, because fare buckets aren't assigned to rooms.

That said, there are a few other possible reasons why someone might have been put in the transition sleeper despite booking 11 months in advance:

1) A tour group booked nearly the entire train (my understanding, which could be wrong, is that travel agencies that book large groups actually get access to trains a few days before the general public, just so they can reserve large blocks of rooms).

2) Someone else just so happened to book right before you did, and specifically requested a room in the dorm car from SAC-wherever. Arrow is set up to look for ways to maximize space utilization, so of there is a room booked SAC-LAX, and someone wants to book SEA-SAC, the system will put them into the same room.

3) There very well could have been a glitch or some other error that caused the transition car to get a sales preference over the normal sleepers.

However, I'm guessing #1 is the most likely, given that tours do tend to book up entire sleepers many, many months in advance.

I am fairly certain a tour group did not book three entire sleepers. If it is true that transiton sleepers are the last to get assigned, then that is what would have to have happened if it was a tour group.

I am betting they have something in there to put shorter trip passengers in the TS when possible.

There's nothing in the system to give short-trip passengers preference of certain rooms/cars, except when a room has already been booked for a non-overlapping segment, the system will put someone else in that room to get maximum use of that room.

Also, how can you be "fairly certain" a tour group didn't book three entire sleepers? I've seen tour groups book every sleeper on the train many times.

What date are you traveling?

 

[AlanB]

I am fairly certain a tour group did not book three entire sleepers. If it is true that transiton sleepers are the last to get assigned, then that is what would have to have happened if it was a tour group.

When I went out to the Gathering this past October, I got the last "A" Bedroom on the train and that was booking something like 9 or 10 months out. A tour group had grabbed most of the rest of the rooms on that CZ for that date. I don't recall the precise number of rooms that group had grabbed, but I do know that they had most of the rooms. And any group/travel agent booking things would almost certainly have requested specific rooms and avoided the Trans/Dorm unless there was no choice but to use those rooms to get enough.

 

[printman2000]

There's nothing in the system to give short-trip passengers preference of certain rooms/cars, except when a room has already been booked for a non-overlapping segment, the system will put someone else in that room to get maximum use of that room.

Also, how can you be "fairly certain" a tour group didn't book three entire sleepers? I've seen tour groups book every sleeper on the train many times.

What date are you traveling?

The trip was last July. I paid low bucket price roomette. I would think that if a tour group had booked three sleepers, 39 roomettes, I would have paid a higher price.

Looking over my notes, I got a second roomette as a reward travel and chose to get a room across the hall. The lady told me all the sleepers were available.