OlympianHiawatha
Engineer
I can see a Market fast developing for Box Meals to be sold on the platforms at extended Star stops.
why can't food be better
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Thirdrail7
Engineer
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Perhaps the passengers would go for it...for the right price.
OlympianHiawatha
Engineer
Provided it doesn't get over-studied to death, it will work. Amtrak makes a licensing agreement with 1 or more local firms to bring offerings to the platform and collects a percentage of sales as their vig. Much like a grouping of Food Trucks, they arrive with their offerings ready to go and packaged so they can be quickly shopped, purchased and carried back on board. That can make for a nice wide variety of quality offerings at all price points.
crescent-zephyr
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I'm not sure Gordon Ramsey (or any other celebrity chef) is needed here. The current system (source of food, cooking methods, and staffing) can be used to produce some pretty high quality results. Look at the Pacific Parlour Car for example, this past Fall I had a wonderful entree salad for lunch that was way beyond the quality of normal amtrak salads. Mixed Greens (not iceberg), Apples from Washington State, Blue Cheese, Candied Walnuts, and the usual sliced cucumbers and cherry tomatoes. This was obviously sourced from the same supplier. Likewise for Dinner the Lamb Shank and Pasta with Beechers Cheese Sauce are both very high quality entrees. The Pasta is much better than the other Amtrak Pasta Dishes I've had, and the Lamb Shank is the best dinner entree I've had on any train.
I'm sure these items cost more money. The Parlour Car has limited seatings with a limited menu so they can probably order "just enough" entrees and reduce waste compared to the full service dining car. My point though, is that the problem is not the system.
Mystic River Dragon
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There is one aspect of having a dining car on the long-distance trains that I don't see mentioned here: the enjoyable conversations with a variety of interesting and intelligent people. I have met, for example, an 80-year-old journalist, a book binder (an almost lost art), and a woman who had lived on a houseboat and had been a caretaker for a house on a Florida island. This was much more interesting than sitting in my roomette and only seeing other passengers at the WAS engine change, and, to me, it is the most important aspect of having a dining car. As we become a society where fewer and fewer people actually talk with each other, I think this is something that needs to be preserved. I would be willing to pay for meals as a sleeper car passenger, but I think the dining car and meals need to be there.
In general, I will agree with NE Trainfan about the food. I have always found it acceptable, if not inspiring. However, full confession here: I can barely boil water, think the microwave is one of the best inventions ever, and consider overcooked Brussels sprouts a delicacy, so what do I know?
I am an expert on desserts and breakfast, however (my two favorite things to eat), and I think the dining car breakfast is okay, but not great, and that the new "cheesecake" is dreadful.
In general, I will agree with NE Trainfan about the food. I have always found it acceptable, if not inspiring. However, full confession here: I can barely boil water, think the microwave is one of the best inventions ever, and consider overcooked Brussels sprouts a delicacy, so what do I know?
I am an expert on desserts and breakfast, however (my two favorite things to eat), and I think the dining car breakfast is okay, but not great, and that the new "cheesecake" is dreadful.
Devil's Advocate
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It may work. On the other hand it may also end up like ELP where local sellers are prevented from using the platform which requires through passengers to leave the immediate area and potentially risk missing the train in order to buy anything. Personally I support local sales but I'd be surprised if Amtrak entered into any formal agreements. Not to mention that if this becomes a nationwide issue many trains don't keep schedules closely enough to make it worthwhile for most sellers to bother.
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NETrainfan
Lead Service Attendant
Well, we certainly enjoy good food. My comment was on our experience alone and one can see the trains we've been on in the signature.
It is just our experience that the food has been fairly good on Amtrak- in the dining car- over the years. This is very subjective as are many comments.
When we first ate in an Amtrak dining car the food exceeded our expectations and has continued to. Expectations is the key word.
Our criteria for acceptable food is: clean, well-cooked, nourishing, and that hot meals are hot.
Taste is important and highly individual. We really liked the crab cakes for instance. Some don't.
Good to read that some other Amtrak riders are ok with the food. Sure it can be improved- but at what cost?
It is just our experience that the food has been fairly good on Amtrak- in the dining car- over the years. This is very subjective as are many comments.
When we first ate in an Amtrak dining car the food exceeded our expectations and has continued to. Expectations is the key word.
Our criteria for acceptable food is: clean, well-cooked, nourishing, and that hot meals are hot.
Taste is important and highly individual. We really liked the crab cakes for instance. Some don't.
Good to read that some other Amtrak riders are ok with the food. Sure it can be improved- but at what cost?
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NETrainfan
Lead Service Attendant
Oh- and to the comments about how impossible it is to have "enjoyed" Amtrak's meals over the years- it is often the luck of the draw
when choosing from a menu. If we had experienced meals that were not good- I would have said so.
when choosing from a menu. If we had experienced meals that were not good- I would have said so.
blondninja
Service Attendant
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As much as I love Amtrak, the dining car has long been a joke. I could care less if they cut the cars and lower the prices.
First, service is often abysmal. I stopped tipping because those staff wouldn't survive a week in a real restaurant. Sometimes it's good but more often than not, my experience has been dire.
Food wise, the food sucks. It's basically frozen food. If you like that so be it. The latest new menu, by example has Amy's branded black bean enchiladas. The menu says nothing about having tofu in it. I have a soy allergy. As I started eating it I suspected tofu so I asked the waitress. She says she didn't think so. And walked away. Didn't think so? I asked her to find out as I would get very sick. She asks the cook. Cook, and the should say "chef" in quotes as its about the Same as me calling myself a chef, opening box putting in convection oven, says no.
Guess what? I get sick the next day. A look at Amtrak food facts says it has tofu. But the menu didn't and the crew couldn't even be knowledgable about the five items on their "extensive" menu.
Another time I started getting sick off the angus burger. Look at food facts and look on the menu. 100% pure beef it says. At a layover in Portland I saw the empty box with ingredient label being tossed. Tons of fillers. I complained to Amtrak saying there's no point having a food facts website for people with allergies if it's incorrect. Their reply was that thus change suppliers from time to time.
If they weren't a quasi government organization they'd be sued and there would be BBB complaints and investigations.
The whole idea of walking the train to take reservations is lame. Install iPads or have people order or preorder from their smart phone.
Have menu options on the screen. Let them eat whenever they want selecting open seating times. Expand service like a normal restaurant instead of 3 to 4 hours then closing.
I say good riddance to the whole dining car model.
First, service is often abysmal. I stopped tipping because those staff wouldn't survive a week in a real restaurant. Sometimes it's good but more often than not, my experience has been dire.
Food wise, the food sucks. It's basically frozen food. If you like that so be it. The latest new menu, by example has Amy's branded black bean enchiladas. The menu says nothing about having tofu in it. I have a soy allergy. As I started eating it I suspected tofu so I asked the waitress. She says she didn't think so. And walked away. Didn't think so? I asked her to find out as I would get very sick. She asks the cook. Cook, and the should say "chef" in quotes as its about the Same as me calling myself a chef, opening box putting in convection oven, says no.
Guess what? I get sick the next day. A look at Amtrak food facts says it has tofu. But the menu didn't and the crew couldn't even be knowledgable about the five items on their "extensive" menu.
Another time I started getting sick off the angus burger. Look at food facts and look on the menu. 100% pure beef it says. At a layover in Portland I saw the empty box with ingredient label being tossed. Tons of fillers. I complained to Amtrak saying there's no point having a food facts website for people with allergies if it's incorrect. Their reply was that thus change suppliers from time to time.
If they weren't a quasi government organization they'd be sued and there would be BBB complaints and investigations.
The whole idea of walking the train to take reservations is lame. Install iPads or have people order or preorder from their smart phone.
Have menu options on the screen. Let them eat whenever they want selecting open seating times. Expand service like a normal restaurant instead of 3 to 4 hours then closing.
I say good riddance to the whole dining car model.
I think Amtrak should think seriously about using food as an educational tool by having more diverse local/ethnic foods on the menu. F'rinstance, why not offer lutefisk on the Empire Builder when in the Wisconsin-Minnesota area? I still have vivid memories of Grandmother fixing it when I was a little kid. Those not familiar with this Nordic-Scandinavian delicacy can get some feeling for what it's like from paragraph 101.58(2)j2f of the Wisconsin Employees' Right To Know statute... http://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/101/I/58 ...which states " 2. "Toxic substance" does not include: f. Lutefisk.".
We Michigan residents have no similar protection under the law and must resort to measures such as this (it's also available in tan):
We Michigan residents have no similar protection under the law and must resort to measures such as this (it's also available in tan):
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Ryan
Court Jester
What specifically about Amtrak makes this impossible?
The link below is for the BBB Amtrak page. Looks like there have been plenty of complaints filed. I didn't dig through for food related complaints but thought others might be interested in looking at the site.
http://www.bbb.org/washington-dc-eastern-pa/business-reviews/railroads/amtrak-in-washington-dc-2434/
http://www.bbb.org/washington-dc-eastern-pa/business-reviews/railroads/amtrak-in-washington-dc-2434/
blondninja
Service Attendant
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Both interesting points. I guess I just figured after Amtrak was dismissive to my complaints, I just let it go and am more careful about what I eat there in the future knowing I can't trust what they print as it could change.
You have a legitimate beef about the list of food ingredients provided by Amtrak being inadequate. There have been a number of threads/posts related to its inadequacies.
Radvlad
Train Attendant
Is the food on Amtrak like airline food where it is made off site, chilled and then brought on board to be heated up? Or is it actually cooked on board?
Fish jello that makes the entire train smell like cod and lye.
How...appetizing?
I say keep it for the church basement potlucks and fundraisers.
crescent-zephyr
Engineer
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Kinda in the middle... It's what you get at a lot of chain restaurants like Applebee's. The food is Mostly pre-prepared and then heated on board, usually in a convection oven.
Several items are "grilled" to order. But what that means I'm not sure. For example, is the steak actually raw before it hits the grill? Or has it been pre-cooked partially, and then grilled to desired done-ness? Same for the Salmon and other fish.Crab Cakes im sure come pre made and grilled.
The eggs are scrambled to order, or at least they were last time I rode in a heritage diner and could see in to the kitchen! (Within 2 years).
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How do we do this on trains that 1) don't have wi-fi and 2) travel through many areas where you have little to no cell service?
Also, not everyone has a smartphone. Those that do not may not be familiar with operating an in-room iPad.
I just thought it would give the food snoots something to really gripe about!
Of course, knowing Amtrak, they'd forget to bring enough melted butter on board.I just thought it would give the food snoots something to really gripe about!
h34r:
Wi-fi would need to be installed throughout the train. If that was done, however, the reservations/ordering system could be hosted on-board and not require a call out to the internet to make the reservation. (In fact, should on-board ordering/reservations/etc. be done, this would be the smart way to do so.)
Those that don't know how to use iPads could either have the SCA/coach attendant make the reservation for them, or simply have the option of electronic reservations be only an option (and the dining car attendant still goes through and takes reservations physically as well.) It would actually make a lot of sense to have some sort of tablet ordering option tableside, at least to augment the wait staff in the dining car. I've noticed when I've used the tablets at Applebees there seems to be a lot less wasted time waiting for a server to come and take our order or have us pay at the end. Someone shouldn't be required to use the tablet if they prefer to interact with the wait staff, but I think there'd be enough of a benefit to those that want to use such a system to make it worthwhile to include in whatever new POS system Amtrak gets.
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Devil's Advocate
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Almost everything is prepared off site and then brought on board in a frozen state. The only prepared from scratch Breakfast ingredient are the eggs, which are only allowed in scrambled form or as part of an omelet. There is not a single Lunch option that is cooked to order. The only cooked to order options for Dinner are the steak and the fish. That's it. Everything else is cooked days/weeks/months prior to departure.
I don't doubt that you're highly impressed with Amtrak double-cooked frozen meals that are virtually impossible to undercook since they didn't start the trip as raw ingredients to begin with. Although that type of preparation also ensures that any digestible nourishment has long since been processed beyond nutritional relevance. I'm actually kind of surprised that twenty years of meals have all been hot however. I've certainly received more than a few lukewarm and room temperature meals over the years.
Lutefisk has become so overused as a joke compared to actual consumption that it barely even registers as a genuine delicacy anymore, not unlike Rocky Mountain Oysters. If you can handle Lutefisk then perhaps you'd join me trying an actual delicacy like Durian. Although unfortunately for Amtrak they would probably be forced to remove all cloth and carpeting shortly thereafter.
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andersone
Conductor
I think we need to bring Fred Harvey back from the dead,,,,,,
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neroden
Engineer
As someone who has an allergy to something relatively obscure, so I *have to see the ingredients list*, I absolutely support lawsuits over this, if someone is willing to spend the money (I'm not). Amtrak's refusal to identify ingredients is reprehensible; it's probably an ADA violation; and it's certainly contrary to California law.
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