Ticketholder arrested for trespass at NYP

[AlanB]

It was just another example of how Amtrak employees aren't given any clear direction about what is and isn't ok, and sometimes make up their own policies and self-determine their own authority to enforce them (or that low-level managers create these things and tell their underlings, which gives the underlings more of a sense that they're real policies). And that doesn't seem to be something Amtrak is taking any steps to control, which just leads to a culture of vigilantism and fear rather than common sense. And while instances like mine are totally insignificant, sometimes this manifests itself in more confusing situations like Bob's, and sometimes in really troubling situations like Patrick's (with Agent Pat).

While I'll admit that I'm not certain what, if any, directive or policy Amtrak may have in place regarding photography, it's not as simple as you make it out to be. Since I don't know what Amtrak has in place regarding this, I'm going to turn my example to SDS and the CCC.

Amtrak created an entire, comprehensive document that I understand was even available as a PDF (not sure if the public could see it then or now), and every LSA was given a copy of this document. One very kind LSA gave me an extra copy, so I've seen exactly how things were laid out in easy to understand English, complete with exact hours, tables that show the seating shifts and even give the LSA a place to track whom he/she assigned to what time slots.

When the CCC was first rolled out on the City of New Orleans, several months later there was an article in Amtrak Ink talking about how a group of 5 or 6 managers rode that train for several months both to help orintate the crew to the new way of doing things, as well as to make the transistion easier for the passengers. Despite those months of help and training, there seems to be crews who have decided that they don't have to follow the procedures and policies.

Short of Amtrak increasing its costs dramatically by placing a manger on every train every day, I'm not sure what more Amtrak can do to ensure that employees actually follow the policies and rules laid down. Some do, some think that they are superior to their managers and know better. And I won't deny that sometimes it is indeed the crew that does know better. However that doesn't give them the authority to decide to do it differently. The correct answer is to ensure that management is informed that there is a better way to do something, not just decide that you know best and you're going to do it your way.

Returning to the photo thing, I suspect that there probably is a policy in place. But that doesn't mean that every employee even bothers to read said policy, comprehend said policy, and then remember it six months later. It's just not a simple thing to fix, unfortunately.

 

[Guest_Spokker_*]

Over the years. I have taken video of "whole" trains, parts of trains, stations and train crews without any trouble. In fact, I've had crew members go out of their way to narrate and on one trip, an Amtrak District Supervisor riding our train came up to me fascinated by my interest in videoing the train.

Just because the majority of Amtrak employees act like normal and reasonable human beings regarding photography, doesn't mean that this stuff doesn't happen to regular Joes, and that it will never happen to you.

 

[wayman]

Returning to the photo thing, I suspect that there probably is a policy in place. But that doesn't mean that every employee even bothers to read said policy, comprehend said policy, and then remember it six months later. It's just not a simple thing to fix, unfortunately.

It would be nice if Amtrak simply published--and publicized--its photo policy. As far as I'm aware, the only publicly available information from Amtrak about photography is that they have an annual contest and thus encourage photography to some extent. If there are any restrictions, a simple advertising campaign could help everyone understand the rules. It might well be more effective than an employee training. Put a page on the website about photography guidelines (not just the contest press release), print up some posters for stations advertising the contest (which also lay out any photography ground rules), put an advertisement in Arrive and in the timetable, etc....

 

[tp49]

I'm going to put here the post I made about the initial incident which GG-1 posted about previously. I think it's just as appropriate to post here as well.

Several things in his story don't wash and he's obviously leaving facts out. Reading some of the things on his site leads me to think there was a lot more that went on than he's saying in his story. Two things immediately come to mind first, what track did the train he came in to NYP on arrive? Was the train still there or had it left for the yard? Was he even on a track that his train was on? This goes to the trespass issue. As the facts stand right now I can see some level of legitimacy to the trespass charge.
Second, there's a reason he was detained by the officer (placed in cuffs). Usually in a situation similar to one that transpired it's just a cite and release. However, I'm suspecting he got rather beligerent with the cop. Reason I think this is because of an email on his page whichhe sent to NJT. There's something about his tone in the email that leads me to speculate how he may have acted towards the officer. Then again this too is speculative, since he did not relate what was said to the officer nor what the officer said to him. I also think he may have had some experience being in cuffs before based on his stating that the officer had the cuffs placed on backwards.

I'm leaning towards a lack of credibility on the writer's part but would want to hear the other side before passing any judgment on him.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

Short of Amtrak increasing its costs dramatically by placing a manger on every train every day, I'm not sure what more Amtrak can do to ensure that employees actually follow the policies and rules laid down.

While there may be some pedantic difference in job titles between Lead Service Attendant and manager, and they might even have some very different responsibilities while on the train, it seems to me that both are human beings who are supposed to follow the rules and provide some degree of leadership to the others on the train. If the Lead Service Attendant is a human being who can do things poorly, why would a human being whose title happens to be manager be any better at doing things the right way?

If anything, this might suggest that having a better system for selecting good LSAs would help.

 

[MattW]

Good thing for the rent-a-cop that I wasn't there. I'd have called *gag*department of homeland oppr...security*gag* and reported a terrorist taking a civilian hostage. If that's what the terrorists want to do (take away our rights) then it looks like the terrorist who arrested the guy were terrorists. (as is the gainesville station ****)