Thinking About the Maple Leaf This Summer...

[BillyJo]

My family and I had a great experience on a RT to Chicago last summer on the CL and the Pennsylvanian . This summer, we are thinking about going to Toronto for a long weekend, and are seriously considering taking the train. The primary reason for taking the train is to see the scenery in NY along the Hudson River and points west of Albany.

Price-wise, Amtrak isn't much of a savings over flying, but it is considerably longer. So here are my questions:

I suspect that the ML is set up very similarly to what we saw on the Pennsylvanian last summer. Is this true? IIRC, that had 4 or 5 AMF-2 coaches, plus one of those half BC cars/half cafe cars. I'm thinking that it might be worth it to upgrade to BC, since it will be a long ride, but may not do this. I'm assuming there is no sightseer/lounge car on this route.

Also, do we change trains in Ontario, or does Amtrak take you directly in to Toronto?

Thanks for the tips -

 

[amtrakwolverine]

1. it has 5 amfleet 2 cars 4 coaches one snack/BC car

2. no sightseer car or amlounge.

3. amtrak goes all the way to toronto.

also be prepaired for the boarder crossing. the train sits for 2 hours while the agents go up and down the train interviewing everyone.

 

[ruudkeulers]

also be prepaired for the boarder crossing. the train sits for 2 hours while the agents go up and down the train interviewing everyone.

According to my timetable:

ML 63 arr. Niagara Falls, NY: 4.10 pm

arr. Niagara Falls, ON: 4.30 pm

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

 

[p&sr]

My family and I had a great experience on a RT to Chicago last summer on the CL and the Pennsylvanian . This summer, we are thinking about going to Toronto for a long weekend, and are seriously considering taking the train. The primary reason for taking the train is to see the scenery in NY along the Hudson River and points west of Albany.

Another routing to consider would be the Adirondack Train from NYP, along the Hudson River and Lake Champlain to Montreal, then take a VIA Rail Corridor Train to Toronto the next day.

This would take an extra day, but if you have time it does add an extra city well worth seeing. Also, the Adirondack Train is considered one of the most scenic runs in all of North America, and is highly recommended.

 

[p&sr]

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

"Sometimes" they don't stay on schedule. The Train cannot proceed until the Customs&Immigration People give the OK. They are not in any hurry, and cannot be rushed.

Not like border crossings in Europe, sad to say.

 

[sky12065]

My family and I had a great experience on a RT to Chicago last summer on the CL and the Pennsylvanian . This summer, we are thinking about going to Toronto for a long weekend, and are seriously considering taking the train. The primary reason for taking the train is to see the scenery in NY along the Hudson River and points west of Albany.
Price-wise, Amtrak isn't much of a savings over flying, but it is considerably longer. So here are my questions:

I suspect that the ML is set up very similarly to what we saw on the Pennsylvanian last summer. Is this true? IIRC, that had 4 or 5 AMF-2 coaches, plus one of those half BC cars/half cafe cars. I'm thinking that it might be worth it to upgrade to BC, since it will be a long ride, but may not do this. I'm assuming there is no sightseer/lounge car on this route.

Also, do we change trains in Ontario, or does Amtrak take you directly in to Toronto?

Thanks for the tips -

This is just a reminder that effective June 1, 2009 you will be required to possess either an enhanced drivers license, if NJ is issuing them yet, or a passport when entering Canada.

To everyone, note that the enhanced drivers license will only be valid for entering Canada (or Mexico) by land or sea. It's not usable for flying in!

For more information on Enhanced Drivers Licenses go to: http://www.dhs.gov/xtrvlsec/crossingborders/gc_1197575704846.shtm

 

[ruudkeulers]

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

"Sometimes" they don't stay on schedule. The Train cannot proceed until the Customs&Immigration People give the OK. They are not in any hurry, and cannot be rushed.

Not like border crossings in Europe, sad to say.

Well, I could tell you a thing or two about European crossings (Switserland!!!) that would make you old before your time.

But besides, would you advise us to derail on the US-side of Niagara Falls and take a cab to the other side (we reserved a B&B on the Canadian side)? I mean, what's the use of waiting God-knows-how-long on the train when you can be on the other side in ten minutes by taxi?

 

[p&sr]

This is just a reminder that effective June 1, 2009 you will be required to possess either an enhanced drivers license, if NJ is issuing them yet, or a passport when entering Canada.

From that Website: "Several border states (Arizona, California, Michigan, Texas, Vermont and Washington) are working with the Department to produce these enhanced drivers licenses."

Since New Jersey is not a "border state", they are probably not in any hurry about implementing this!

The new "Passport Card" sounds convenient... looks like a driver's license, valid for land crossings of U.S. borders.

 

[sky12065]

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

"Sometimes" they don't stay on schedule. The Train cannot proceed until the Customs&Immigration People give the OK. They are not in any hurry, and cannot be rushed.

Not like border crossings in Europe, sad to say.

what's the use of waiting God-knows-how-long on the train when you can be on the other side in ten minutes by taxi?

The use is that it's still quite a distance from Niagara Falls to Toronto where one can connect with a VIA train.

 

[p&sr]

But besides, would you advise us to derail on the US-side of Niagara Falls and take a cab to the other side (we reserved a B&B on the Canadian side)? I mean, what's the use of waiting God-knows-how-long on the train when you can be on the other side in ten minutes by taxi?

That might be a very good idea.

Found elsewhere on-line, posted by a resident of Niagara Falls, Canada:

"Both buses and taxis cross the border regularly."

(By the way, we say "detrain" for getting off, since derail means the Train has jumped off the tracks!)

 

[Anthony]

You can also walk across the Rainbow Bridge and cross the border as a pedestrian, if you happen to want to do some sightseeing at the Falls on foot. Not much of a delay, usually.

 

[sky12065]

This is just a reminder that effective June 1, 2009 you will be required to possess either an enhanced drivers license, if NJ is issuing them yet, or a passport when entering Canada.

From that Website: "Several border states (Arizona, California, Michigan, Texas, Vermont and Washington) are working with the Department to produce these enhanced drivers licenses."

Since New Jersey is not a "border state", they are probably not in any hurry about implementing this!

The new "Passport Card" sounds convenient... looks like a driver's license, valid for land crossings of U.S. borders.

This is quite true. I can tell you that NY has been issuing them since sometime in the fall last year. I can also tell you that a lot of NJ residents travel to Canada. With that in mind one would think that NJ would have been on the ball and be prepared by the June 1st deadline for issuing the EDL & ENDID's.

 

[p&sr]

But besides, would you advise us to derail on the US-side of Niagara Falls and take a cab to the other side (we reserved a B&B on the Canadian side)? I mean, what's the use of waiting God-knows-how-long on the train when you can be on the other side in ten minutes by taxi?

Another point to keep in mind is Immigration Requirements for getting back into the USA. As a European Citizen, you would probably be visiting the USA under the "Visa Waiver Program". I believe this allows up to 90 days here, and involves a form which you fill out on the plane, which is then stamped on entry to the USA and kept with your Passport. This form has to be surrendered when you leave the USA to fly back to Europe. Be sure not to give it up when entering Canada. In other words, be sure that the Canadian folks understand you need to return to the USA again the next day (or whatever).

It is even possible to cross the border on foot, using the Rainbow Bridge which is right by the falls, and looks very scenic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainbow_Bridge_(Niagara_Falls)

 

[sky12065]

This is just a reminder that effective June 1, 2009 you will be required to possess either an enhanced drivers license, if NJ is issuing them yet, or a passport when entering Canada.

The new "Passport Card" sounds convenient... looks like a driver's license, valid for land crossings of U.S. borders.

I may be talking semantics here, but technically the EDL (Enhanced Drivers License) or ENDID (Enhanced Non-Driver Identification) are not a "Passport" Card. This is because enhanced documents are not valid outside of our hemisphere whereas passports are.

 

[p&sr]

I may be talking semantics here, but technically the EDL (Enhanced Drivers License) or ENDID (Enhanced Non-Driver Identification) are not a "Passport" Card. This is because enhanced documents are not valid outside of our hemisphere whereas passports are.

Right. The State Department got this one wrong. They probably just liked the catchy name.

http://travel.state.gov/passport/ppt_card/ppt_card_3926.html

 

[JAChooChoo]

also be prepaired for the boarder crossing. the train sits for 2 hours while the agents go up and down the train interviewing everyone.

According to my timetable:

ML 63 arr. Niagara Falls, NY: 4.10 pm

arr. Niagara Falls, ON: 4.30 pm

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

Yes you are. The train is scheduled to dwell at Niagara Falls ON for 1 hour and 15 minutes for Customs.

Eastbound looks like 1 hour 30 minutes in NY for US Customs.

 

[henryj]

also be prepaired for the boarder crossing. the train sits for 2 hours while the agents go up and down the train interviewing everyone.

According to my timetable:

ML 63 arr. Niagara Falls, NY: 4.10 pm

arr. Niagara Falls, ON: 4.30 pm

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

I came over from Chicago last May and caught this train at Buffalo. It was late getting into Buffalo. Then as the man correctly described, the Canadian immigration team went over the train with a fine tooth comb and interview everyone on the train. And they weren't in any hurry. They took at least two people off the train there. Meanwhile, the passengers waiting to board waited in the hot sun until these agents finished before they could board. It did take about two hours. We got into Toronto around 9:30 that night. I rode the Canadian from there to Vancouver so I don't know what they do going back accross. The crossing from Vancouver to Seattle the US agents were on the train only a few minutes. Most of the work is done before you leave Vancouver.

 

[AlanB]

also be prepaired for the boarder crossing. the train sits for 2 hours while the agents go up and down the train interviewing everyone.

According to my timetable:

ML 63 arr. Niagara Falls, NY: 4.10 pm

arr. Niagara Falls, ON: 4.30 pm

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

I came over from Chicago last May and caught this train at Buffalo. It was late getting into Buffalo. Then as the man correctly described, the Canadian immigration team went over the train with a fine tooth comb and interview everyone on the train. And they weren't in any hurry. They took at least two people off the train there. Meanwhile, the passengers waiting to board waited in the hot sun until these agents finished before they could board. It did take about two hours. We got into Toronto around 9:30 that night. I rode the Canadian from there to Vancouver so I don't know what they do going back accross. The crossing from Vancouver to Seattle the US agents were on the train only a few minutes. Most of the work is done before you leave Vancouver.

Correct, going north to Canada, the customes work isn't done until you reach the Canadian Niagara Falls station. The actual crossing from NY Nigara Falls to the Canadian Niagara Falls takes 20 minutes because of the slow track speeds between the two stations and the bridge between the two countries.

Coming south, customs is done at the NY Niagrara Falls station.

It is also important to note that while you don't have to change trains and you are still riding inside Amtrak's equipment, the train ceases to be an Amtrak train at the Ontario Niagara Falls station and becomes a VIA Rail train. This is the only Amtrak train that still does this, the International before its demise also went through such a change.

This means that while in Canada, a VIA Rail engineer operates the train, VIA Rail conductors work onboard, the train gets a VIA Rail train number, and a VIA Rail cafe attendant boards with VIA Rail food stuffs. In fact this is the only time that one can find Coke on an Amtrak train. You'll even get two tickets from the ticket agent or the Quik-Trak machine. The first from NYP to Niagara Falls which the Amtrak conductor will collect, the second from Niagara Falls to Toronto which the VIA Rail conductor will collect.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

also be prepaired for the boarder crossing. the train sits for 2 hours while the agents go up and down the train interviewing everyone.

According to my timetable:

ML 63 arr. Niagara Falls, NY: 4.10 pm

arr. Niagara Falls, ON: 4.30 pm

Seems to me the crossing lasts about 20 minutes or am I missing something?

I came over from Chicago last May and caught this train at Buffalo. It was late getting into Buffalo. Then as the man correctly described, the Canadian immigration team went over the train with a fine tooth comb and interview everyone on the train. And they weren't in any hurry. They took at least two people off the train there. Meanwhile, the passengers waiting to board waited in the hot sun until these agents finished before they could board. It did take about two hours. We got into Toronto around 9:30 that night. I rode the Canadian from there to Vancouver so I don't know what they do going back accross. The crossing from Vancouver to Seattle the US agents were on the train only a few minutes. Most of the work is done before you leave Vancouver.

Correct, going north to Canada, the customes work isn't done until you reach the Canadian Niagara Falls station. The actual crossing from NY Nigara Falls to the Canadian Niagara Falls takes 20 minutes because of the slow track speeds between the two stations and the bridge between the two countries.

Coming south, customs is done at the NY Niagrara Falls station.

It is also important to note that while you don't have to change trains and you are still riding inside Amtrak's equipment, the train ceases to be an Amtrak train at the Ontario Niagara Falls station and becomes a VIA Rail train. This is the only Amtrak train that still does this, the International before its demise also went through such a change.

This means that while in Canada, a VIA Rail engineer operates the train, VIA Rail conductors work onboard, the train gets a VIA Rail train number, and a VIA Rail cafe attendant boards with VIA Rail food stuffs. In fact this is the only time that one can find Coke on an Amtrak train. You'll even get two tickets from the ticket agent or the Quik-Trak machine. The first from NYP to Niagara Falls which the Amtrak conductor will collect, the second from Niagara Falls to Toronto which the VIA Rail conductor will collect.

do the amtrak crew stay on the train and go off duty or do they stay at a canadian hotel and wait for the next train

 

[AlanB]

do the amtrak crew stay on the train and go off duty or do they stay at a canadian hotel and wait for the next train

The Amtrak crew goes off duty, leaves the train, and is shuttled in a van to their hotel. I believe that they are shuttled back across the border too, staying in a NY hotel, not a Canadian hotel.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

do the amtrak crew stay on the train and go off duty or do they stay at a canadian hotel and wait for the next train

The Amtrak crew goes off duty, leaves the train, and is shuttled in a van to their hotel. I believe that they are shuttled back across the border too, staying in a NY hotel, not a Canadian hotel.

i would think they would stay in canada cause the via rail employees don't operate the train into the US.

 

[Ryan]

do the amtrak crew stay on the train and go off duty or do they stay at a canadian hotel and wait for the next train

The Amtrak crew goes off duty, leaves the train, and is shuttled in a van to their hotel. I believe that they are shuttled back across the border too, staying in a NY hotel, not a Canadian hotel.

i would think they would stay in canada cause the via rail employees don't operate the train into the US.

I'm sure that the van that takes them to their hotel in NY is perfectly capable of crossing the border in the other direction as well, so the Amtrak crew can operate the train after the border crossing.

 

[BillyJo]

Thanks for the help, everyone. I was a bit concerned about the possibility of delays at the border, but according to amtrakdelays, this train has excellent OTP in both directions.

I'm not sure if we have the enhanced driver's licences, but we all have passports, so we should be OK.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

do the amtrak crew stay on the train and go off duty or do they stay at a canadian hotel and wait for the next train

The Amtrak crew goes off duty, leaves the train, and is shuttled in a van to their hotel. I believe that they are shuttled back across the border too, staying in a NY hotel, not a Canadian hotel.

i would think they would stay in canada cause the via rail employees don't operate the train into the US.

I'm sure that the van that takes them to their hotel in NY is perfectly capable of crossing the border in the other direction as well, so the Amtrak crew can operate the train after the border crossing.

yeah but why the hassle of going back and forth. the Amtrak crew is in Canada wouldn't be easier to put them up in a Canadian hotel instead of spending money shuttling them back and forth.

 

[Rail Freak]

My family and I had a great experience on a RT to Chicago last summer on the CL and the Pennsylvanian . This summer, we are thinking about going to Toronto for a long weekend, and are seriously considering taking the train. The primary reason for taking the train is to see the scenery in NY along the Hudson River and points west of Albany.

Another routing to consider would be the Adirondack Train from NYP, along the Hudson River and Lake Champlain to Montreal, then take a VIA Rail Corridor Train to Toronto the next day.

This would take an extra day, but if you have time it does add an extra city well worth seeing. Also, the Adirondack Train is considered one of the most scenic runs in all of North America, and is highly recommended.

Really, any particular time of year for the Adirondack Train? B)