There's Business Class then there's Business Class

[Hal]

From my experience, BC gets you, at least, a "free" mini-can of warm soda.

On the NE Regionals, BC got us priority boarding. At WAS, we got to cut to the front of the line that already formed at the gate, along with the handicapped. I mean, they announced something like "now boarding handicapped and business class passengers".

On the Vermonter, BC got us the 2/1 seating in the La-Z-Boy like reclining seats.

NE Regional BC also gives you more legroom, an in most cases, a less crowded car than in regional coach. And even if the BC car is filled, it feels less like being in a sardine can than a full regional coach car. Not to mention the bathrooms. 60 passengers vs 80 passengers does make a difference. I'll often take BC on the northeast regional during a busy travel period.

Not as much difference as you think. There are 62 seats in Regional Business Class and 72 seats in Regional Coach Class.

 

[VentureForth]

As an Uber driver, I picked up a passenger in Savannah off the Palmetto on Saturday night. She said she didn't see any value in BC on the Palmetto anymore. I shared with her how it used to be 2x1 faux leather seating in half the Cafe car. She said that the way the Palmetto consist is now, BC is at the BACK of the train with the baggage car hanging off its rear. And they put the cafe car in the middle of the train, requiring a 4-car walk to get to their 'free' coffee and 1/2 can of soda. She took coach on her return and was much more satisfied.

 

[seat38a]

The 2/1 seating also prevails on, IIRC, the Downeaster, River Runner, and Empire Service/Ethan Allen. And of course, over on Iowa Pacific it comes with a delicious dinner and drinks and seating in the dome car...

That being said, I do think that Amtrak and some states need to sit down, figure out an agreed-upon baseline for either BC or some other similar label ("Custom Class" comes to mind) so you know "If I buy something with X label I am at least getting such-and-such benefits".

Not sure other States or Amtrak will be willing to pony up for the free wine and snack packs that the Surfliner already provides in Business Class or the Continental Breakfast setup in the morning. In terms of Business Class, the Surfliner has everyone beat (Iowa Pacific I consider An Oddball. I question the viability of the current BC service for the price they charge.) then second would have to be Cascades with their $3.00 off of anything in the bistro car coupon system. If your traveling with multiple people, you can combine them together for a nice beer to share or a single coupon is good for a full sized drink and still have enough for a discount on a snack item. Last thing we needs is for the West Coast States to have to downgrade their services to bring consistency to BC.

DSC00775 by B H, on Flickr

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

From my experience, BC gets you, at least, a "free" mini-can of warm soda.

On the NE Regionals, BC got us priority boarding. At WAS, we got to cut to the front of the line that already formed at the gate, along with the handicapped. I mean, they announced something like "now boarding handicapped and business class passengers".

On the Vermonter, BC got us the 2/1 seating in the La-Z-Boy like reclining seats.

NE Regional BC also gives you more legroom, an in most cases, a less crowded car than in regional coach. And even if the BC car is filled, it feels less like being in a sardine can than a full regional coach car. Not to mention the bathrooms. 60 passengers vs 80 passengers does make a difference. I'll often take BC on the northeast regional during a busy travel period.

Not as much difference as you think. There are 62 seats in Regional Business Class and 72 seats in Regional Coach Class.

I think another part of it, would be the comparative chances that the Regional Business Class car will be packed full, vs. the Regional Coach Class cars being packed full. I mean, I have had to stand in Coach, but never had to stand in Business Class.

 

[Hal]

I think another part of it, would be the comparative chances that the Regional Business Class car will be packed full, vs. the Regional Coach Class cars being packed full. I mean, I have had to stand in Coach, but never had to stand in Business Class.

You should not have to stand in coach as the seating is reserved on Regional. Maybe not on that coach but on one of the coaches there should be a seat. As far as the comparative chances of either coach or business class that depends on when you travel. On weekdays during the peak morning and afternoon business class might be the most packed car on the train. More so than the coaches as there is only one business class car. Seen it many times that way and business class ticket holders migrating to the quiet car or other cars that are less crowded. On weekends when the passengers who generally pay for their own tickets are traveling , that is when business class usually will be comparatively less crowded.

Business Class is a great deal for Amtrak, passengers pay extra on Regional for little extra cost. Those small sodas are provided as part of the contract with Pepsi. For passengers sometimes it is worth it but probably most of the time only in the passengers own mind.

 

[BCL]

I think another part of it, would be the comparative chances that the Regional Business Class car will be packed full, vs. the Regional Coach Class cars being packed full. I mean, I have had to stand in Coach, but never had to stand in Business Class.

You should not have to stand in coach as the seating is reserved on Regional. Maybe not on that coach but on one of the coaches there should be a seat. As far as the comparative chances of either coach or business class that depends on when you travel. On weekdays during the peak morning and afternoon business class might be the most packed car on the train. More so than the coaches as there is only one business class car. Seen it many times that way and business class ticket holders migrating to the quiet car or other cars that are less crowded. On weekends when the passengers who generally pay for their own tickets are traveling , that is when business class usually will be comparatively less crowded.

I've done that once and there were a lot of seat hogs. So I suppose it may well be reserved, but it didn't look like the conductors were going to do anything unless it really got to the point where a lot of passengers would be standing.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

I think another part of it, would be the comparative chances that the Regional Business Class car will be packed full, vs. the Regional Coach Class cars being packed full. I mean, I have had to stand in Coach, but never had to stand in Business Class.

You should not have to stand in coach as the seating is reserved on Regional. Maybe not on that coach but on one of the coaches there should be a seat. As far as the comparative chances of either coach or business class that depends on when you travel. On weekdays during the peak morning and afternoon business class might be the most packed car on the train. More so than the coaches as there is only one business class car. Seen it many times that way and business class ticket holders migrating to the quiet car or other cars that are less crowded. On weekends when the passengers who generally pay for their own tickets are traveling , that is when business class usually will be comparatively less crowded.

I've done that once and there were a lot of seat hogs. So I suppose it may well be reserved, but it didn't look like the conductors were going to do anything unless it really got to the point where a lot of passengers would be standing.

The one time I had trouble finding a seat (I didn't want to drag my bags through multiple cars), I decided to stand where I placed my bags (the unoccupied handicap space - where other bags already were placed). A short time after leaving my station, the conductor motioned for me to come up front as he made a seat available. I don't know if it had been a seat hog situation or not, but the conductor didn't want me left standing.

 

[Hal]

I think another part of it, would be the comparative chances that the Regional Business Class car will be packed full, vs. the Regional Coach Class cars being packed full. I mean, I have had to stand in Coach, but never had to stand in Business Class.

You should not have to stand in coach as the seating is reserved on Regional. Maybe not on that coach but on one of the coaches there should be a seat. As far as the comparative chances of either coach or business class that depends on when you travel. On weekdays during the peak morning and afternoon business class might be the most packed car on the train. More so than the coaches as there is only one business class car. Seen it many times that way and business class ticket holders migrating to the quiet car or other cars that are less crowded. On weekends when the passengers who generally pay for their own tickets are traveling , that is when business class usually will be comparatively less crowded.

I've done that once and there were a lot of seat hogs. So I suppose it may well be reserved, but it didn't look like the conductors were going to do anything unless it really got to the point where a lot of passengers would be standing.

The seat hogs ride in both classes. They tend to be worse in Business Class. More entitled types who think that by paying extra they are going to get two seats. Dealing with seat hogs is something some conductors handle better than others. Just as some passengers are shy about asking for the unoccupied seat with the bag sitting on it, some conductors are shy about asking passnegers to move their bags. Passengers will write letters claiming the conductor was rude in asking them to move their bag.

 

[BCL]

I think another part of it, would be the comparative chances that the Regional Business Class car will be packed full, vs. the Regional Coach Class cars being packed full. I mean, I have had to stand in Coach, but never had to stand in Business Class.

You should not have to stand in coach as the seating is reserved on Regional. Maybe not on that coach but on one of the coaches there should be a seat. As far as the comparative chances of either coach or business class that depends on when you travel. On weekdays during the peak morning and afternoon business class might be the most packed car on the train. More so than the coaches as there is only one business class car. Seen it many times that way and business class ticket holders migrating to the quiet car or other cars that are less crowded. On weekends when the passengers who generally pay for their own tickets are traveling , that is when business class usually will be comparatively less crowded.

I've done that once and there were a lot of seat hogs. So I suppose it may well be reserved, but it didn't look like the conductors were going to do anything unless it really got to the point where a lot of passengers would be standing.

The seat hogs ride in both classes. They tend to be worse in Business Class. More entitled types who think that by paying extra they are going to get two seats. Dealing with seat hogs is something some conductors handle better than others. Just as some passengers are shy about asking for the unoccupied seat with the bag sitting on it, some conductors are shy about asking passnegers to move their bags. Passengers will write letters claiming the conductor was rude in asking them to move their bag.

When I was riding NJ Transit to NYP I remember the conductors absolutely wouldn't allow any seat hogs. There were people standing, and they were busy trying to get as many to sit down as possible. However, one time I saw a conductor ask a woman if she wanted to sit down. There was a clean-cut young man there, but she said "What? I don't know this guy!" She walked away to another car. After she left I was looking at him and he didn't quite seem to understand why she wouldn't sit down there.

 

[Thirdrail7]

Personally, I wish business class would fall by the wayside. However, passengers seem to go for it and it costs Amtrak a soda and a newspaper contract. State supported services seem to like since the equipment allows for.

The case for business class (formerly custom class, which actually had a purpose) in gone in my mind.

 

[Hal]

I think another part of it, would be the comparative chances that the Regional Business Class car will be packed full, vs. the Regional Coach Class cars being packed full. I mean, I have had to stand in Coach, but never had to stand in Business Class.

You should not have to stand in coach as the seating is reserved on Regional. Maybe not on that coach but on one of the coaches there should be a seat. As far as the comparative chances of either coach or business class that depends on when you travel. On weekdays during the peak morning and afternoon business class might be the most packed car on the train. More so than the coaches as there is only one business class car. Seen it many times that way and business class ticket holders migrating to the quiet car or other cars that are less crowded. On weekends when the passengers who generally pay for their own tickets are traveling , that is when business class usually will be comparatively less crowded.

I've done that once and there were a lot of seat hogs. So I suppose it may well be reserved, but it didn't look like the conductors were going to do anything unless it really got to the point where a lot of passengers would be standing.

The one time I had trouble finding a seat (I didn't want to drag my bags through multiple cars), I decided to stand where I placed my bags (the unoccupied handicap space - where other bags already were placed). A short time after leaving my station, the conductor motioned for me to come up front as he made a seat available. I don't know if it had been a seat hog situation or not, but the conductor didn't want me left standing.

Often passengers don't feel like moving their bags so they stand where they are rather than moving to a coach with seats. Other passengers see the standing passengers and think there are no seats anywhere when there are empty seats. A good crew will get on the PA and announce where there are empty seats. Usually on a Regional train that tends to be towards the rear.

 

[MARC Rider]

From my experience, BC gets you, at least, a "free" mini-can of warm soda.

Lately, I've been getting full-sized drinks, but you have to sign a chit for it.

 

[MARC Rider]

From my experience, BC gets you, at least, a "free" mini-can of warm soda.

On the NE Regionals, BC got us priority boarding. At WAS, we got to cut to the front of the line that already formed at the gate, along with the handicapped. I mean, they announced something like "now boarding handicapped and business class passengers".

On the Vermonter, BC got us the 2/1 seating in the La-Z-Boy like reclining seats.

NE Regional BC also gives you more legroom, an in most cases, a less crowded car than in regional coach. And even if the BC car is filled, it feels less like being in a sardine can than a full regional coach car. Not to mention the bathrooms. 60 passengers vs 80 passengers does make a difference. I'll often take BC on the northeast regional during a busy travel period.

Not as much difference as you think. There are 62 seats in Regional Business Class and 72 seats in Regional Coach Class.

Oh, but the Regional coach cars are missing about 6 or so seats for the open area used to secure wheelchairs and the car-end luggage racks. Thus, the seat pitch is considerably less than the regional BC cars.

 

[Hal]

Personally, I wish business class would fall by the wayside. However, passengers seem to go for it and it costs Amtrak a soda and a newspaper contract. State supported services seem to like since the equipment allows for.

The case for business class (formerly custom class, which actually had a purpose) in gone in my mind.

Passengers do get something out of it although not as much as they probably think. Amtrak makes out well. Amtrak can also offer some upgrade seats for Guest Rewards members. Also can be a good place to stash unaccompanied minors. LOL. I don't think it should go by the wayside as there is demand for it.

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[Hal]

From my experience, BC gets you, at least, a "free" mini-can of warm soda.

On the NE Regionals, BC got us priority boarding. At WAS, we got to cut to the front of the line that already formed at the gate, along with the handicapped. I mean, they announced something like "now boarding handicapped and business class passengers".

On the Vermonter, BC got us the 2/1 seating in the La-Z-Boy like reclining seats.

NE Regional BC also gives you more legroom, an in most cases, a less crowded car than in regional coach. And even if the BC car is filled, it feels less like being in a sardine can than a full regional coach car. Not to mention the bathrooms. 60 passengers vs 80 passengers does make a difference. I'll often take BC on the northeast regional during a busy travel period.

Not as much difference as you think. There are 62 seats in Regional Business Class and 72 seats in Regional Coach Class.

Oh, but the Regional coach cars are missing about 6 or so seats for the open area used to secure wheelchairs and the car-end luggage racks. Thus, the seat pitch is considerably less than the regional BC cars.

Seats have been removed from the regional BC class for a wheelchair area and for luggage racks too. There certainly is some more leg room in Business Class, enough that there can be leg rests which don't fit in Regional Coach. Don't know if that is what you mean by seat pitch but there are a few more inches of leg space. There is a a lot of leg space on Regional Coach too. I am not saying there is no difference, only that it is smaller than you state as far as passenger occupancy. The coaches were built with 84 seats but with adding the wheelchair space and ADA restrooms that has been reduced to 72. So the seat difference is now 10 lower occupancy in Business Class than in Coach. Not 20 as you state. There are other differences, also now two four seaters with a table included in the 62 business class seats and there are curtains on the windows. So there are some physical amenities.

 

[PVD]

The 2+1 seat B/C on the Empire Service sells very well, People like the peace and quiet. Some of the reason that NER passengers liked B/C was that it tended to be calmer than coach (no kids, louder young folks) but the quiet car has made that a less compelling selling point. If it doesn't hurt revenue, and people like it, why not. A little bit more consistency in the offering, or at least a better job of explaining how it differs across services would be helpful.

 

[VentureForth]

Everyone likes the 2x1 BC. I liked it on the Palmetto until they sent it to the Empire service! LOL

 

[Thirdrail7]

Everyone likes the 2x1 BC. I liked it on the Palmetto until they sent it to the Empire service! LOL

it caused too much havoc when the Palmetto and the Pennsylvanian turned for each other. There was no protection if a car was shopped. There are numerous NEC Business class cars floating around (sometimes even being used as regular coaches, which annoys me.

I really get bent out of shape when they sub a split club for the full cafe car on a train with a full business class car. The coach passengers have nicer seats than the "premium" passengers. Things like that make me rail against business class.

 

[PVD]

Those are the kind of things that drive everyone crazy. If they were rare occurences, it would be understandable, but they seem to happen more than occasionally..

 

[Hal]

Everyone likes the 2x1 BC. I liked it on the Palmetto until they sent it to the Empire service! LOL

it caused too much havoc when the Palmetto and the Pennsylvanian turned for each other. There was no protection if a car was shopped. There are numerous NEC Business class cars floating around (sometimes even being used as regular coaches, which annoys me.

I really get bent out of shape when they sub a split club for the full cafe car on a train with a full business class car. The coach passengers have nicer seats than the "premium" passengers. Things like that make me rail against business class.

It is annoying when they use a business class car as a coach car because the passengers boarding on the platform see the business class markings and it causes confusion. Coach passengers think they can't sit there or business class passengers think it is their car. It can slow down the boarding.

As far as using the split car on a train with a full business class car, it causes some havoc because that means less tables which are popular. But I don't see any reason to be bothered by coach passengers sitting in those nicer seats. It is what it is.

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[PVD]

I can see why someone who pays extra money for their trip would resent a lower fare class passemnger getting the better "ride". When an airline subs a plane with an international first, and b/c, for a domestic version, the higher tier and b/c passengers move up, not the economy.

 

[Thirdrail7]

I can see why someone who pays extra money for their trip would resent a lower fare class passemnger getting the better "ride". When an airline subs a plane with an international first, and b/c, for a domestic version, the higher tier and b/c passengers move up, not the economy.

Exactly and lot of people notice.

 

[Hal]

I can see why someone who pays extra money for their trip would resent a lower fare class passemnger getting the better "ride". When an airline subs a plane with an international first, and b/c, for a domestic version, the higher tier and b/c passengers move up, not the economy.

Never heard any Business Class passenger complain. And since that car will be in the middle on the occasions they use it with people passing thru it not sure I would call it a better ride.

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[seat38a]

I can see why someone who pays extra money for their trip would resent a lower fare class passemnger getting the better "ride". When an airline subs a plane with an international first, and b/c, for a domestic version, the higher tier and b/c passengers move up, not the economy.

Exactly and lot of people notice.

I have seen this before as well. It did not bother me too much since the BC car being used as coach was jam packed full while the "Real" BC was empty. During busy times, extra BC cars are added to the Surfliner and sold as BC, but if they have not had a chance to decouple the extra car, I've seen it sold as coach until a visit to the yard. Also, I have also seen during busy times, they will couple any spare cars be it cafe or BC car and sell it coach. It sucks, but it is a much better use of resources I believe.

 

[Hal]

I can see why someone who pays extra money for their trip would resent a lower fare class passemnger getting the better "ride". When an airline subs a plane with an international first, and b/c, for a domestic version, the higher tier and b/c passengers move up, not the economy.

Exactly and lot of people notice.

I do not think it is a big deal as far as passengers are concerned. And there are only a few seats anyway. Not having tables and often not a transfer plate is more of a concern.

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