Is rail travel really more expensive?

[dlagrua]

I regularly hear that rail travel costs more than airline travel but I would say that it depends on the situation. In some cases the train is far less and in others the train fare is far more. You have to really want to take a train but lets look at one example. Next years trip from CLP to nOL as in most CLP to NOL will cost us $919 R/T (for two) in a bedroom ( at low bucket).

We can purchase airline tickets ( WAS-NOL) for $319 RT per person. Thats $688 for the trip adding in the luggage fee. Airport parking will add another $60 and the flight time is about 1:30.

In contrast on the Crecent we have a bedroom + meals and we don't pay for luggage & parking but the Amtrak trip in a sleeper with the highest service available. In a roomette the train fare was about $719.00 so the price is getting close to air travel and in coach the fare is $504 total R/T for two which is less than the air fare.

Conclusion train coach fare on this trip is less and is probably less on most overnight runs. Roomette travel is slightly more and the bedroom is the highest. However, if we do a comparison on a cross country trip it is a totally diffent situation.

In summation you've got to really want to take the train and we do.

 

[mucomix]

In general I think a roomette for the wife and my self price out fairly comparable to driving on many of are longer trips. Mid-Range trips get dicier. CHI works good for us as a short trip ~ 8hr. Other wise we about need to go to one coast or the other unless we just want a train ride.

 

[dlagrua]

I believe that the AutoTrain is also very competitive over drving and depending on accomodations can be more or less than flying + car rental.

The drive is 900 miles, add fuel cost, lodging, food and wear and tear and the train is a very competitve deal, especially if you are driving a newer car. We had a post on this a while back

The NE corridor run is also very competitive with air fares (most of the time its priced less)and is actually faster than flying in many cases.

The rule of thumb that I have come up with is that train trips within 1000 miles are competitve while airfares blow them away at longer distances. However, many people still take the train because they feel more comfortable on the rails. I don't believe that we would enjoy a cross country train trip unless we broke up the journey, but two days and one night on a train has been enjoyable.

 

[rrdude]

While I travel quite a lot for business, and ofter get slammed by my boss for choosing rail, below is an email I got today:

"Also I'm seeing two Amex charges for what looks like rail travel to/from conference in January ($323.50 + 323.50). If the train total is going to be $650 I need you to cancel those and take a flight which can be had for $170 - $280 round trip from BWI."<br clear="all">

ANY place that SWA flies to, rail, even coach, is a hard "sell". I travel my rail because I hate the "airport experience", and I like trains........

 

[AlanB]

$280 X 2 = $560, offer to pay him the $90 difference.

 

[Pastor Dave]

I travel Amtrak both on "business" and "pleasure" trips. When I'm travelling on church $$ I always volunteer to pay the difference between train and airline fare (I let the treasurer do the research to find out what the plane fare would be). On pleasure trips the train is part of the experience and I don't mind paying extra cost. The train itself is part of the vacation, not just a way to get to a vacation destination.

 

[Ryan]

for $170 - $280 round trip from BWI.

$280 X 2 = $560, offer to pay him the $90 difference.

In this case the train is over twice as much.

Still, I wonder what the point of the thread is - of course train travel can be cheaper than air (or driving), depending on the endpoints of the trip and how far in advance you book.

 

[dlagrua]

There are so many variables in a true comparison with air or car travel that you really must do it on a case by case basis. Things like the dreaded luggage fees, parking fees, and travel distance will all figure in. If you are traveling via rail in a sleeper, do you compare the cost to a first class air fare or coach? Then how do you figure cost of meals? You will need to eat anywhere that you are so I would say that they count. Then how does the room cost figure in? You have more comfortable seating but in a 2 hour flight from NYC to Florda do you really need it?

In view of all of the varibales I always compare airline coach to rail coach fare and first class to rail sleeper fares. We plan ahead so we typically get the low or close to low bucket fares. From this perspective it can be said that rail is very competitive for trips 1000-1500 miles and rather noncompetitive for those 2000-2580 mile cross country trips.

Now the real shame of this all is that people who want to try rail travel for the first time obtain their pricing a month or two out (as they would do with an airline) and discover that the high bucket fares come up and this scares them away. Typically with air travel the high bucket pricing comes on much later than with rail travel. This scenerio is especially true if you want to book a sleeper. IMO, this is a large problem for Amtrak to attract for new customers as some of the high bucket sleeper prices can be very expensive. It gives the perception that rail travel is only for the elite.

 

[Hanno]

I believe that the AutoTrain is also very competitive over drving and depending on accomodations can be more or less than flying + car rental.

The drive is 900 miles, add fuel cost, lodging, food and wear and tear and the train is a very competitve deal, especially if you are driving a newer car. We had a post on this a while back

The NE corridor run is also very competitive with air fares (most of the time its priced less)and is actually faster than flying in many cases.

The rule of thumb that I have come up with is that train trips within 1000 miles are competitve while airfares blow them away at longer distances. However, many people still take the train because they feel more comfortable on the rails. I don't believe that we would enjoy a cross country train trip unless we broke up the journey, but two days and one night on a train has been enjoyable.

My son and his wife recently did the math on a trip to FL from BAL and taking the AutoTrain will actually save them money even with a bedroom. Orginally they were planning to fly. The plus is being able to take everything they need for their toddler in their car. They now have AutoTrain tickets.

 

[dlagrua]

My son and his wife recently did the math on a trip to FL from BAL and taking the AutoTrain will actually save them money even with a bedroom. Orginally they were planning to fly. The plus is being able to take everything they need for their toddler in their car. They now have AutoTrain tickets.

The AutoTrain should easily be the better buy over driving but over flying in coach I don't believe so. The trip from Sanford to Florida in a bedroom costs my wife and myself about $1200 round trip. Airfare is only about $250 R/T per person x 2 = $500 then add in the incidentals like luggage and parking and you probably come out at around $700. Then you must add the rental car cost will run you about $200 for the week so you are at $900 vs $1200, not a great difference but a significant difference unless you must have a rental car for an extended period. I did not add the cost of the toddlers ticket in so that may also have a bearing.

 

[Guest]

I can say for me, an airline ticket is about $150 per person each way, once one adds in all the fees including luggage. Now, they do offer $100 tickets, but there are only like 4 seats per flight that actually sell for that (just enough to support their advertising claim).

So, for two people, round trip, it is $600.

Taking an overnight LD train, in a roomette, comes out to $750 for two people, round trip.

So, yes, taking a train costs me $150 more per trip. However, for my $150 each, I get fed, and I don't have all the stress which includes dealing with the overzealous airport security.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

In my experience rail is almost always more expensive. The only way rail can beat airfare is if you ride coach, or split a bedroom among multiple people and even then I can often get my airfare within spitting distance of a rail ticket.

 

[ladyjay78]

It all depends. For me, I travel from NYP to TOP. I have paid anywhere from $190 to $460 for RT airfare to KC. Currently it's running @ $360 for coach.

To that I add (each way) a minimum:

$ 40 for taxi to airport

$ 50 for checked luggage

$ 25 for meals/water

That puts me at @ $590 roundtrip for a coach seat, craziness at the airport, security hassles, and typically a 9 hour travel time door-to-door excluding delays. Last four times I flew, I never sat on the tarmac less than an hour and once it was 4 hours.

Plus, KC is 90 miles from my final destination. My folks are getting too old to come pick me up so if I flew, I would need to rent a car for the week. That would be another $300.

My round trip LSL/SWC with roomettes all the way comes to $880 so financially it's a wash and I'm traveling first class not coach. I have a MUCH nicer trip, the meals are included, no cab fare needed, and I have a full day+ each way to relax instead of stressing out about the flight. Only real issue is time and I am able to take the extra 2 days to travel.

Unless it is an emergency, I am sticking with Amtrak.

 

[dlagrua]

If I may add another variable, it also depends on where you are going. There are train Stations in the NW and SW where airports are 100's of miles away. In this case the train is the more convenient choice and depending on your destination perhaps the more economical choice.

As Mr Guest had indicated even if the train is a bit more (in a sleeper); the trip may be slower but without a doubt more relaxing and enjoyable experience. It is often told to us by our friends and family that rail travel is an "old fashioned" way to travel LD and that is true to some extent. While air travel has steadily deteriorated to the dehumanizing condition that it now is in, the trains still offer a level of comfort that seems to have been lost in todays world. That is why all of us here travel by train.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

There are train Stations in the NW and SW where airports are 100's of miles away. In this case the train is the more convenient choice and depending on your destination perhaps the more economical choice.

I can get to most cities in the NW or SW much faster by plane or car than Amtrak can get me there. This isn't a knock against Amtrak so much as just recognizing that the trains heading out west are inherently slower than most other methods of travel and some of them only run and/or connect on certain days of the week. The service at the station and on board is no better than the airlines I've flown and you're stuck with these people for much longer than you are on a flight. As a result of the extended duration the faults and idiosyncrasies of the staff can become far more annoying during the course of your trip. All in all I'd say Amtrak has a long way to go before I can make the sort of claims about it that you routinely do. The two main reasons I use Amtrak are nostalgia and lower emissions. There is no way I'd be riding Amtrak if I wasn't an environmentally-minded railfan who considered it important to actually live by my values instead of just talking about them.

 

[PerRock]

One thing I've noticed when people compare airlines fares to Amtrak is that the compare First Class Amtrak Fares (Sleeper) to Economy Class Airfare. If you are going to compare the two compare in the same price bracket. Such as First Class Amtrak (Sleeper) to First Class on an Airplane.

peter

 

[PRR 60]

One thing I've noticed when people compare airlines fares to Amtrak is that the compare First Class Amtrak Fares (Sleeper) to Economy Class Airfare. If you are going to compare the two compare in the same price bracket. Such as First Class Amtrak (Sleeper) to First Class on an Airplane.

peter

A four hour plane ride is fine in coach (Chicago to San Francisco, for example). A 50 hour train ride is not so fine in coach. For many, a comfort requirement for overnight train travel is sleeper. A similar situation is true with air. Those who are OK with coach for short-hauls and even trans-cons, often want business class sleeper seats for long hauls. Having to spend the night on board a train or plane makes a big difference in the accommodations and comfort required.

 

[Mark Luterra]

For my standard "home-for-Christmas" trip:

Amtrak Albany, OR to Minneapolis, MN: $177 each way, $384 total

Subtract 15% Student Advantage: $301.

Cheapest round-trip coach flight: ~$400 with layovers

Non-stop round-trip flight: $600.

This year I actually considered flying, but a month ago I couldn't find ANY holiday-season tickets for under $600 round-trip, with the exception of a few routes that would have me spending the night in an airport.

Amtrak advantages:

Three free checked bags (Christmas gifts, special wines, etc., etc.)

No annoying security restrictions (no guns = fine with me, no liquids = silly)

Legroom

Meeting interesting folks in the lounge, playing cards/board games

Scenery

Station within 15 miles of my house (avoids $50 each way for shuttle or convincing a friend to drive to Portland)

Unscheduled time (can read books, relax without feeling like I should be doing something)

Amtrak disadvantages:

Difficulty sleeping (Having traveled long-distance by train in Sweden, I'm a big supporter of "couchette" cars - i.e. coach-class with flat sleeping surfaces)

Slower (can be a problem, but usually isn't for me)

Delays (which also plague flights in the winter)

I'm also a railfan who enjoys seeing the operations of the freight railroads and listening on my scanner, which adds more reasons to go the train route.

For me:

<500 miles: train if a route exists, otherwise drive

500-2000 miles: train if I have time and if it is cheaper, otherwise fly

2000+ miles: fly

Mark Luterra

 

[smarter-n-u]

$280 X 2 = $560, offer to pay him the $90 difference.

Uh! It's 280 round trip not each way.

 

[me_little_me]

We can purchase airline tickets ( WAS-NOL) for $319 RT per person. Thats $688 for the trip adding in the luggage fee. Airport parking will add another $60 and the flight time is about 1:30.

In contrast on the Crecent we have a bedroom + meals and we don't pay for luggage & parking but the Amtrak trip in a sleeper with the highest service available. In a roomette the train fare was about $719.00 so the price is getting close to air travel and in coach the fare is $504 total R/T for two which is less than the air fare.

Even better is Atlanta to NOL. Cost us less than $300 round trip with a roomette for two people total. Three meals each in each direction. Private room. No need to worry about the Atlanta airport nightmares. No way would I get two round trip airline tix for $150 each with no Saturday night stay-over and no 21 day advance purchase. No body scans. No Sardine Experience.

But the real benefit of the train is that it is part of the vacation vs. flying which is the penalty you pay for being stupid enough to travel.

 

[had8ley]

I believe that the AutoTrain is also very competitive over drving and depending on accomodations can be more or less than flying + car rental.

The drive is 900 miles, add fuel cost, lodging, food and wear and tear and the train is a very competitve deal, especially if you are driving a newer car. We had a post on this a while back

The NE corridor run is also very competitive with air fares (most of the time its priced less)and is actually faster than flying in many cases.

The rule of thumb that I have come up with is that train trips within 1000 miles are competitve while airfares blow them away at longer distances. However, many people still take the train because they feel more comfortable on the rails. I don't believe that we would enjoy a cross country train trip unless we broke up the journey, but two days and one night on a train has been enjoyable.

I'd rather stay up all night looking at the stars from either a sleeper or coach than face the maniac road ragers on I-95 !!! :excl:

 

[Pastor Dave]

I believe that the AutoTrain is also very competitive over drving and depending on accomodations can be more or less than flying + car rental.

The drive is 900 miles, add fuel cost, lodging, food and wear and tear and the train is a very competitve deal, especially if you are driving a newer car. We had a post on this a while back

The NE corridor run is also very competitive with air fares (most of the time its priced less)and is actually faster than flying in many cases.

The rule of thumb that I have come up with is that train trips within 1000 miles are competitve while airfares blow them away at longer distances. However, many people still take the train because they feel more comfortable on the rails. I don't believe that we would enjoy a cross country train trip unless we broke up the journey, but two days and one night on a train has been enjoyable.

I'd rather stay up all night looking at the stars from either a sleeper or coach than face the maniac road ragers on I-95 !!! :excl:

I think overall that we've done okay on several AT trips. When you consider the cost of gas, meals, an overnight stay in a motel, and rental car it's not so bad. Plus, I have to agree with had-eight-ley that looking at the evening stars from the train sure beats the hassle of driving! You also don't have to put up with those annoying "South of the Border" billboards for endless miles :lol:

I'll also restate my earlier post: the trip on Amtrak is part of our vacation and not just a way to get to a vacation destination.

 

[Bob Dylan]

I'd rather stay up all night looking at the stars from either a sleeper or coach than face the maniac road ragers on I-95 !!! :excl:

Think what Jay meant to say is he'd rather stay up all night in the Lounge looking at the stars and night sky through the prism of a bottle or glass containing an adult beverage! :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[fredevad]

Last week (11/11), I made impromptu plans to visit my family in Florida during the week of Thanksgiving. I told my wife that "I would fly or take the train, whatever is cheapest at this late notice", of course thinking that trying to fly on a holiday week just over one week in advance that the train would be a for sure thing.

Boy was I wrong. This is what I found:

Amtrak:

MKE - ORL Coach, departing 11/20

ORL - MKE Coach, returning 11/27 (11/26 had a sold out segment at the time)

$612 + on board meals

Respected Airline (not a small operation) using a travel web site search:

MKE - ORL, departing 11/22 (the same day I would have arrived on the train)

ORL - MKE, returning 11/26

$171 (including all taxes, fees, etc.) - Don't need parking.

For the same city pair, holiday week, 1.5 weeks in advance, the airline won by $441. I can't argue with that when it comes to family money, the money that pays the bills.

The comforting thought is that my sister-in-law will be visiting that same week from New York state on the train, and when she booked it was cheaper than flying.

Perhaps after the kids graduate, It'll be easier to spend the extra $441 to travel by train, my preferred mode of transportation.

 

[dlagrua]

Last week (11/11), I made impromptu plans to visit my family in Florida during the week of Thanksgiving. I told my wife that "I would fly or take the train, whatever is cheapest at this late notice", of course thinking that trying to fly on a holiday week just over one week in advance that the train would be a for sure thing.

Boy was I wrong. This is what I found:

Amtrak:

MKE - ORL Coach, departing 11/20

ORL - MKE Coach, returning 11/27 (11/26 had a sold out segment at the time)

$612 + on board meals

Respected Airline (not a small operation) using a travel web site search:

MKE - ORL, departing 11/22 (the same day I would have arrived on the train)

ORL - MKE, returning 11/26

$171 (including all taxes, fees, etc.) - Don't need parking.

For the same city pair, holiday week, 1.5 weeks in advance, the airline won by $441. I can't argue with that when it comes to family money, the money that pays the bills.

The comforting thought is that my sister-in-law will be visiting that same week from New York state on the train, and when she booked it was cheaper than flying.

Perhaps after the kids graduate, It'll be easier to spend the extra $441 to travel by train, my preferred mode of transportation.

Low bucket MKE to ORL is around $150.00 or $300 R/T. A coach fare of $612 is hard to believe but you might have found a train that is almost completely sold out. Amtrak low bucket fares can be reasonable but high bucket pricing can be staggering. It all comes down to my prior comment that fares depend on date of travel, advance booking period, and distance. In some cases the train is less expensive in many cases the plane fare is cheaper but have you seen what is going on with airport security these days. Passengers are all being treated like prisoners with the utmost humiliation and total disrespect being part of the formula. I'll gladly pay double just to avoid that.