How fast does the NE Regional really go?

[BALtoNYPtraveler]

I've read all the literature on what the top speed should be on the NE Regional and the Acela, and I'm not asking for a rehash of that. I'm asking if anyone knows the true figures of what happens in reality.

The reason I ask is that I have a thing on my phone that records speed (someone may tell me that may not be accurate, and that may be true) and I've seen the NE Regional exceed the stated maximum "they say" it's "supposed to" stay within of 125. In fact, today I saw it hit 137.

Is this possible that it's a regular occurrence for that speed to be hit on some stretches? That is never mentioned as a top speed for this train. In fact, that's a smidgen higher than the Acela is supposed to go.

 

[Acela150]

I can tell you that phone speedometers are not very accurate. Once I was on Acela in a 135 MPH zone. We were going "346 MPH" according to my phone. IF any train is overspeed by such a high amount it would be subject to a ACSES Penalty Stop.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I can tell you that phone speedometers are not very accurate. Once I was on Acela in a 135 MPH zone. We were going "346 MPH" according to my phone. IF any train is overspeed by such a high amount it would be subject to a ACSES Penalty Stop.

My mobile phone indicated a top speed of 149MPH and an average speed of 66MPH on my last Acela run. Same phone never went above 79MPH for more than a few seconds on any of the dozens of LD trains I've ridden. I didn't check the SC but maybe someone else can chime in on that. Every GPS device is subject to reduced accuracy when it doesn't see enough satellites to lock onto but I've never experienced absurd or impossible speeds like what you're describing.

 

[Hal]

I can tell you that phone speedometers are not very accurate. Once I was on Acela in a 135 MPH zone. We were going "346 MPH" according to my phone. IF any train is overspeed by such a high amount it would be subject to a ACSES Penalty Stop.

My mobile phone indicated a top speed of 149MPH and an average speed of 66MPH on my last Acela run. Same phone never went above 79MPH for more than a few seconds on any of the dozens of LD trains I've ridden. Haven't checked the SC but I'm guessing it would be pretty similar. In any case my experiences have indicated that modern phone speedometers are surprisingly accurate.

What is your point? The 137 speed calculated on a Northeast Regional can't be accurate unless they were running an Acela trainset. As explained going over the 125 speed on a Regional would cause an over speed penalty application of the brakes. The train would not likely get to 137 as there is a time limit to reduce speed if the 125 is exceeded.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[jis]

Yup. In this specific instance that 137mph reading was wrong irrespective of how accurate DA thinks mobile phone GPSs, are.

 

[BALtoNYPtraveler]

They weren't running an "Acela trainset," if I understand what that means. The Acela left in the same direction at a different time not very long before our train.

Even if accelerometers are inaccurate, a speed like twice the reasonable actual speed seems like a momentary glitch. Do these glitches happen often, even in smaller degrees? I don't know. I guess I didn't really want to debate the accuracy of these meters as much as I thought someone might know the scoop on what the actual highest speeds reached (in, say, New Jersey) are.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

It's true that I did overlook the 137MPH claim before responding to the 346MPH claim. I've never seen any of my own GPS devices off by more than a couple MPH when comparing them to various vehicular speedometers, radar speed signs, passenger rail speed limits, aircraft info displays, etc. So when I read claims of routine inaccuracies resulting in readings that are off by hundreds of miles per hour it sounds rather silly to me. That being said the most logical conclusion to the original claim is that the GPS circuitry and/or software was either inaccurate or was corrupted or recorded incorrectly. Luckily nobody was punished or fired as a result.

 

[dlagrua]

If your phone is GPS equipped, the speed indicated should be fairly accurate. On the Acela my phone has read as high as 125 mph. On the regionals the highest readings that I have seen are 105-108 MPH. On LD trains I have seen 70-80 MPH speeds.

 

[Hal]

They weren't running an "Acela trainset," if I understand what that means. The Acela left in the same direction at a different time not very long before our train.

Even if accelerometers are inaccurate, a speed like twice the reasonable actual speed seems like a momentary glitch. Do these glitches happen often, even in smaller degrees? I don't know. I guess I didn't really want to debate the accuracy of these meters as much as I thought someone might know the scoop on what the actual highest speeds reached (in, say, New Jersey) are.

The highest speed reached by Northeast Regional equipment is 125 MPH. That would be for New Jersey too.

I don't know about the accuracy of phone GPS speed readouts but I know the Regional Equipment won't be going 137 MPH. It is possible that you were on a Regional train that was using an Acela Express trainset. That happens sometimes. So even though an Acela left before you it could have been an Acela trainset used on the Northeast Regional train you were on.The top speed allowed is the speed the equipment is allowed. So a Northeast Regional using an Acela trainset could be going 135. They do allow a small margin of error so the could explain the 137.

 

[Thirdrail7]

They weren't running an "Acela trainset," if I understand what that means. The Acela left in the same direction at a different time not very long before our train.

Even if accelerometers are inaccurate, a speed like twice the reasonable actual speed seems like a momentary glitch. Do these glitches happen often, even in smaller degrees? I don't know. I guess I didn't really want to debate the accuracy of these meters as much as I thought someone might know the scoop on what the actual highest speeds reached (in, say, New Jersey) are.

Let me make this easy for you. Unless you are on a test train in which certain systems are bypassed, the electric locomotives can not exceed 126 mph without an over speed alarm. Once that alarm sounds, you have 6 seconds to take action or the train will go into a penalty brake (full service application). On sections with ACSES, it is even less forgiving since once you are three miles over, you may go into an immediate penalty.

An Acela set is capped at 150 mph. it is a little less forgiving than most equipment. Once you exceed 151, you will receive a penalty application. This is because you'll never have 150mph outside of ACSES territory.

There are plenty of areas where the maximum authorized speed is 125mph.

 

[BALtoNYPtraveler]

I'm going to look over the definition of "Acela trainset" because I have never heard that term. I learned something new today!

I would never want anyone to get in trouble and really, I'm going to chalk up phone apps to being "maybe accurate sometimes." I have definitely seen momentary ridiculous glitches on them. In fact, I don't watch it carefully (my riding companion does) and I do remember seeing it report that we were still going at a clip when we had slowed or stopped. LOL, I don't expect anything GPS based to give anything but an approximation (I've seen the tracker show us leave the tracks, drive down a neighborhood street and through someone's backyard before magically getting back on the tracks again.) Oh, the fun of phone gadgets.

So, forget I threw a number out there. If anyone's phone said any 135 mph train was approaching 400 and no one noticed a problem, I'd say the technology is the problem.

:giggle:

 

[Thirdrail7]

I'm going to look over the definition of "Acela trainset" because I have never heard that term. I learned something new today!

I would never want anyone to get in trouble and really, I'm going to chalk up phone apps to being "maybe accurate sometimes." I have definitely seen momentary ridiculous glitches on them. In fact, I don't watch it carefully (my riding companion does) and I do remember seeing it report that we were still going at a clip when we had slowed or stopped. LOL, I don't expect anything GPS based to give anything but an approximation (I've seen the tracker show us leave the tracks, drive down a neighborhood street and through someone's backyard before magically getting back on the tracks again.) Oh, the fun of phone gadgets.

So, forget I threw a number out there. If anyone's phone said any 135 mph train was approaching 400 and no one noticed a problem, I'd say the technology is the problem.

:giggle:

The Acela is set of equipment since they are semi-permanently attached. They have dedicated configuration(that you may not deviate from and operate above 125mph),do not have standard couplers and are rarely broken apart.

Some MARC trains are authorized to operate up to 125mph as well.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

This is an Acela trainset

This is what seats look like in an Acela trainset (business class)

Sometimes, like over busy holidays, they will use these trainsets for a regional run (instead of Amfleets)

 

[the_traveler]

I was once on a train where my phone showed us moving along at 135 mph going southeast.

2 things were wrong with that picture! First, there were no tracks going southeast at that location. And second (and the biggest thing wrong), we were sitting on the platform at WAS and had not yet departed!

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

If your phone is GPS equipped, the speed indicated should be fairly accurate.

The accuracy of any GPS based device, depends on how many satellites are "visible" to it. When such a device is in motion, that number can greatly vary from one moment to the next.

Now, most phones are not only use GPS, but also use aGPS. In comparison, aGPS is pretty inaccurate (meant to only give a very rough location to e911). And a phone can seamlessly switch from using GPS to using aGPS without the user noticing using a typical map app.

 

[StriderGDM]

I was once on a train where my phone showed us moving along at 135 mph going southeast.

2 things were wrong with that picture! First, there were no tracks going southeast at that location. And second (and the biggest thing wrong), we were sitting on the platform at WAS and had not yet departed!

Continental drift must have really picked up!

 

[me_little_me]

It depends on whether you measure speed from inside the train or as it is passing you. As you approach the speed of light, time slows down. Since Amtrak generally travels close to the speed of light, time hardly moves at all. Or was it that as Amtrak moves at all, you have to turn on the light? Or possibly since Amtrak cars are lightweight, they have to wait for the light.

Well, the answer is something like that.

Q.E.D.

 

[jis]

It depends on whether you measure speed from inside the train or as it is passing you. As you approach the speed of light, time slows down. Since Amtrak generally travels close to the speed of light, time hardly moves at all. Or was it that as Amtrak moves at all, you have to turn on the light? Or possibly since Amtrak cars are lightweight, they have to wait for the light.

Well, the answer is something like that.

Q.E.D.

It all depends on your frame of reference. Additional complexities are added depending on whether you are close to a massive body like the earth or are free floating your Acela in space too.

 

[frequentflyer]

Before Acela,the lowly aem7 and 10 Amfleet cars used to run the metroliner to 120 and 130 on some stretches. So can a NE Regional do it? Yes,it did in the 80 s and 90s. But as been stated, they are safe guards of the electronic type to keep top speeds in check.

There is a March 1985 Trains article on the NEC,fascinating read as they rode in the cab of a Metroliner giving a detail description of he stresses of running a train on time.

 

[Acela150]

the lowly aem7

I would change that... The AEM-7 wasn't a lowly engine... Most of these units had millions of miles on them when they were retired.

 

[frequentflyer]

True about "toasters", I would go further and state the reliability and speed of the AEM-7s gave the NEC its legitimacy as an alternate to the air shuttles. But when the Acela arrived all attention was on it.

 

[jis]

To be fair, it should be stated that it was never legal to operate an AEM-7/Amfleet combo at anything higher than 125mph. The push for something like ACSES began when FRA realized what was going on. Back then there were FRA guys with speed guns popping up here and there to do random checks on speeds and getting alarmed with what they discovered.

Also I don't think anyone knowledgeable has claimed that the AEM-7s are physically incapable of operating above 125mph. It is just that they are not cleared to do so in commercial service.

As for legitimacy as alternate air shuttle, the AEM-7s definitely helped build that up, but the case was finally clinched by the Acelas. Amfleets simply don't have the ambiance to appeal to folks that are used to traveling by air, or so say many of my acquaintances who primarily travel by air.

 

[Mystic River Dragon]

True about "toasters", I would go further and state the reliability and speed of the AEM-7s gave the NEC its legitimacy as an alternate to the air shuttles. But when the Acela arrived all attention was on it.

I agree. "Humble," perhaps, might be a better description than "lowly" for the AEM-7s. There is nothing lowly about a workhorse that does its job consistently, with no fanfare, while the Acelas and the new ACS 64s get all the attention.

 

[Mystic River Dragon]

I was once on a train where my phone showed us moving along at 135 mph going southeast.

2 things were wrong with that picture! First, there were no tracks going southeast at that location. And second (and the biggest thing wrong), we were sitting on the platform at WAS and had not yet departed!

You obviously had a mischievous phone that was trying to escape and go on a trip all by itself!

 

[jis]

True about "toasters", I would go further and state the reliability and speed of the AEM-7s gave the NEC its legitimacy as an alternate to the air shuttles. But when the Acela arrived all attention was on it.

I agree. "Humble," perhaps, might be a better description than "lowly" for the AEM-7s. There is nothing lowly about a workhorse that does its job consistently, with no fanfare, while the Acelas and the new ACS 64s get all the attention.

Trust me. The AEM-7s got exactly the same sort of attention and Ooohs and Aaahs when they were new and back then the E60s and GG-1s were the lowly work horses. Lived through that period mostly adjacent or close to the NEC.