House Bill proposes Privatize Amtrak Dining

[guet]

While all this speculation about how much better the food on Amtrak would be if it is privitized makes for fine pipe dreams, THAT IS NOT WHAT THIS LEGISLATION IS ABOUT.

Wake up and smell the coffee, THIS IS WHAT IT IS ABOUT:

From HER website:

For Immediate Release

Contact: (202) 225-3164

Nov. 3, 2011

Taxpayers stuck with tab for Amtrak food and beverage service

Washington, D.C. - Congresswoman Jean Schmidt introduced legislation today (Nov. 3) to halt runaway deficit spending on food and beverage service aboard Amtrak trains.

“It’s outrageous that Amtrak loses more than $60 million a year on its food and beverage service despite a law that bars the passenger railroad system from doing so,” said Congresswoman Schmidt, a Miami Township Republican. “Taxpayers are fed up.”

Amtrak has been required since Oct. 1, 1982, to break even or make money on its food and beverage service. In the nearly 30 years since then, Amtrak has not once complied with the federal law.

The bill introduced in the House by Congresswoman Schmidt, called the Amtrak Food and Beverage Service Savings Act, would require the Federal Railroad Administration to seek competitive bids. Amtrak would be allowed to compete with outside companies in bidding to provide food and beverages.

Revenue from food and beverages sold aboard Amtrak trains in fiscal year 2010 totaled $131 million, but the cost of providing the service was $192 million. That loss of $61 million means taxpayers provided a subsidy of nearly 32 percent.

“Amtrak passengers pay $4.50 for a hot dog,” Congresswoman Schmidt said. “They would pay an astounding $6.60 for the same hot dog if you took away the subsidy.”

In addition – without factoring in the taxpayer subsidy – cheeseburgers cost $6, chips and pretzels $2, trail mix $3.75, cheese and crackers $4, and soft drinks $2.

Even though taxpayers pick up part of the tab, “these are the kind of prices you might expect to pay at the ballpark, not while commuting to work, traveling to visit family, or trying to see our great country while vacationing,” Congresswoman Schmidt said. “Passengers deserve better, and so do taxpayers. It’s time for Amtrak to start following the law.”

:excl: She ain't got a clue, she just wants to make poilitical hay. :excl:

I'm guessing that she hasn't been to a ballpark recently, or if she has, then she was in a box seat and didn't care what the prices were.

Out at Citi Field, a hot dog costs $6.25; a cheeseburger $9.25; a soda costs a whopping $5.50.

Or a movie, or a convention center snack bar, or a circus, or a dozen other venues. What a know-nothing. But what a non-surprise from Congress!

 

[Nickrapak]

Personally, I don't think this is such a bad idea, especially on corridor service. I'm almost certain that there are several ways to cut costs in the supply chain, from inventory to labor. A company like Sodexo, with years of experience serving both large and small firms, should be able to adequately target those points that could use an increase in efficiency.

I'm not really afraid of service being cut in cafe cars, as there is not really much that can be cut. On the other hand, I think there should be some sort of minimum service requirement for dining cars, in order to avoid extreme cuts to LD food service. My ideal minimum would be 3 meals a day, at least 3 separate dishes per serving, as well as dessert for breakfast and lunch.

 

[jebr]

My ideal minimum would be 3 meals a day, at least 3 separate dishes per serving, as well as dessert for breakfast and lunch.

Dessert for breakfast and lunch? Sheesh, do we need that much sugar?

I'm also confused. How are they counting meals for sleeper passengers? Is the income for the dining car (in the ledger books) $0 or the cost of the meal from the menu? If it's the latter, then there may be a problem with the management. If it's the former, then that cost should be accounted in.

 

[RRUserious]

After years of listening to political campaigns, I'm shocked anyone hear actually believes a word she says. There's no law requiring any truth whatsoever in what a politican says. They truly embody the old saying that you know they are lying when their lips move (or their office puts out a news release, no lip motion, same void of truth) I doubt in the history of civilization that an equation of truth and politics has ever existed. Yet we have serious discussions based on something said by a politician.

 

[jis]

I'm not really afraid of service being cut in cafe cars, as there is not really much that can be cut.

Really? There is always the possibility that the entire service is cut, like happened on the Empire Corridor between NYP and ALB, no?

 

[reefgeek]

It's an interesting problem. Raise the price enough and you discourage people from using the service, is that what you want to accomplish?

I work for a quasi-governmental entity I am not supposed to mention in public forums. We had a pretty nice subsidized cafeteria for years. It was fairly cheap, sandwiches and burgers were only a couple of bucks, it was hard to spend more than $5 on lunch. Some senators decided that we were being treated to lunch at taxpayers' expense (actually it happened in another district) and bang went our cafeteria subsidy. Now it costs as much to eat in the cafeteria as it does to eat in town, and guess what? The cafeteria is mostly empty, except at breakfast, because the food is better in town .

The vendor is ARAMARK, too.

 

[Bob Dylan]

It's an interesting problem. Raise the price enough and you discourage people from using the service, is that what you want to accomplish?

I work for a quasi-governmental entity I am not supposed to mention in public forums. We had a pretty nice subsidized cafeteria for years. It was fairly cheap, sandwiches and burgers were only a couple of bucks, it was hard to spend more than $5 on lunch. Some senators decided that we were being treated to lunch at taxpayers' expense (actually it happened in another district) and bang went our cafeteria subsidy. Now it costs as much to eat in the cafeteria as it does to eat in town, and guess what? The cafeteria is mostly empty, except at breakfast, because the food is better in town .

The vendor is ARAMARK, too.

Wonder if this Idiotic Mandate was reached while this Congress Creature was enjoying his Taxpayer Funded Meal in the Senate or House Resturant! (Damn good Bean Soup in the Senate one, Old Navy and DC hands will understand! :wub: )

These people take the Prize for the Biggest Hypocrites of all Time, they Live like Royality

on our Dime while trying to Micro-Manage Amtrak!! :angry2: Time to Wake Up and Vote 'em All Out!!! :excl: :excl: :excl:

 

[goodnightjohnwayne]

There are many ways of providing food service. Look at the Downeaster service, where prices and food quality are universally acknowledged to be superior and the food service is contracted out. I think it's important to look at new and innovative solutions. I personally think that there's tremendous room for improvement in Amtrak food service. The quality of the food has declined over the years in the union staffed cafe cars. Even though prepackaged food alternatives have increased in quality and selection over the years, the quality of the prepackaged items in the cafe cars is worse in recent years than it was decades ago. Similarly, I have to wonder if food safety hasn't declined, as there are anecdotes about union staffers selling from their own personal inventories, apparently to pocket the money, while food items from the commissary are allowed to outdate and spoil. I've seen good cafe car attendants, but I've also seen people who shouldn't be dealing with the public and probably couldn't pass muster in a fast food restaurant. Overall, levels of service aren't impressive, especially considering the high wages and benefits being paid.

I personally think that we need to look at traditional ways of providing food service. I think that highly motivated self-employed individuals could operate cafe cars with better service, better quality items and a better selection. A small business owner could probably make a profit where the current unionized system makes huge annual loses. I also think we should remember the success of Fred Harvey, not just in land operations, but in operating every Santa Fe dining car. Look to the glory days of passenger railroading, and you'll see that the old private sector railroads were open to innovation, to working with entrepreneurs to improve food service.

 

[goodnightjohnwayne]

Those of us old enough to remember the Automat type cars on the SP, and the Subway Fiasco on the NEC Regional Trains under Amtrak ,would have serious doubts about this micro-management scheme by the usual "run it like a business" self appointed experts in Congress!(I never had the pleasure of ridng on the Super Chief or other Santa Fe Crack Trains had the Harvey Company running the Food Service! )

Sure, Overall, the Food and Service could be more consistent in the Diners if better Training and Hands on Management was provided by Amtrak,but my biggest complaint is actually with the Cafe Cars which sell Convience Store Crap @ High Prices and probably serve the majority of riders since people in Coach outnumber the Sleeper pax by many times!! (A Train Cafe is not Yankee Stadium! )

As others have said, there are serious concerns about having Non-Amtrak Employees working on Trains, and I agree that when for Profit Companies look @ the Books for Food Service on Trains that No-one will want to bid on this idiotic scheme! :excl: :excl: :excl:

Amtrak has tried vending machines in the early 2000s, much in the same way that Southern Pacific and the New York Central did in the 1960s. The real problem is that you can't see alcohol out of vending machines, and the machines still need to be stocked, if not in route, at end points, and it's hard to have a completely unstaffed food service car.

As far as the Subway submarine sandwich experiment in Albany, it failed because union members launched an unsanctioned picket and supposedly intimidated the low-wage Subway employees. Not a proud moment for organized labor. To their credit, members of the other unions had zero respect for the food service union members and crossed the picket. The result was the end of the Subway sandwich experiment and absolutely no food service at all on Albany based trains. No union jobs, no non-union jobs, no food service for the passengers.

 

[AlanB]

There are many ways of providing food service. Look at the Downeaster service, where prices and food quality are universally acknowledged to be superior and the food service is contracted out. I think it's important to look at new and innovative solutions. I personally think that there's tremendous room for improvement in Amtrak food service. The quality of the food has declined over the years in the union staffed cafe cars. Even though prepackaged food alternatives have increased in quality and selection over the years, the quality of the prepackaged items in the cafe cars is worse in recent years than it was decades ago. Similarly, I have to wonder if food safety hasn't declined, as there are anecdotes about union staffers selling from their own personal inventories, apparently to pocket the money, while food items from the commissary are allowed to outdate and spoil. I've seen good cafe car attendants, but I've also seen people who shouldn't be dealing with the public and probably couldn't pass muster in a fast food restaurant. Overall, levels of service aren't impressive, especially considering the high wages and benefits being paid.

I personally think that we need to look at traditional ways of providing food service. I think that highly motivated self-employed individuals could operate cafe cars with better service, better quality items and a better selection. A small business owner could probably make a profit where the current unionized system makes huge annual loses. I also think we should remember the success of Fred Harvey, not just in land operations, but in operating every Santa Fe dining car. Look to the glory days of passenger railroading, and you'll see that the old private sector railroads were open to innovation, to working with entrepreneurs to improve food service.

The Downeaster does offer an interesting example and there is little doubt that some of the product offered is superior to the more traditional cafe foods on Amtrak. But I've seen nothing that indicates that the cafe actually makes money. That is to say, that while the private contractor may be making a profit on his contract, I've seen nothing that says that the NNEPRA (Northern New England Passenger Rail Authority) still is not losing money on the cafe service.

I have no idea how things are structured, whether all food service revenue goes to NNERPA who then pays the contractor. Or if it goes to the contractor, with the NNEPRA making up the difference. But regardless, I suspect that the NNERPA does still take a loss on things.

So while the Downeaster could possibly be considered a success in terms of a better food service, it is unlikely that it's the type of success that the Congress person in question is seeking.

Finally, there are two other issues with the Downeaster model. One, I'm not sure how this would translate to the long distance trains. It's one thing for a run of a couple of hours, the dynamics change when you've got to overnight people. Second, it's my understanding that the cafe employees do not have the standard Amtrak safety training, which could cause an issue in an accident.

 

[Judith Parker-Day]

For ten years I worked on board the AMTRAK Downeaster train as a Cafe Attendant traveling between three states until last July 2011. A few days later there was a truck with crashed into the train and caught on fire. When I first heard of the crash, and after hoping everyone was okay, I thought if that crash happened in the middle of the train and the conductor was with the engineer there would be no way for the Cafe Attendant to communicate with the Conductor or the Engineer. The original AMTRAK Downeaster Cafe Attendants were briefly trained by an AMTRAK Manager who was stationed in Maine; he talked to us about the third rail being electrified, kicking the window out in case of an emergency, and turning the fans off in case of a fire. We were never issued a radio, and although we were under the control of the Conductor communication was dependent on who you worked with.

Privatizing the food service on the AMTRAK trains does not make sense. The AMTRAK Downeaster Cafe Attendants are covered under the RRA and RUIA, and the federally subsidized food service provider has an incentive to run the project at a loss on paper and in addition receives huge tax credits.

My reaction to the collective bargaining win by the Pennsylvania Cafeteria Workers is this:

When I was in junior high school the Lunch Ladies would bake cinnamon rolls and the aroma would loft through the school. Now the corporate food conglomerate machine taking control of the food supply and service for a cafeteria, or food service car does not need to resell the expired food as new fresh food or deliver it to a new food service account of theirs; getting credited again for the same food item that is placed in a new location, and again getting credited for the second expiration of the same product and so increasing their volume of sales and profit. Now they can just put on too much food, let it expire, and the lunch Ladies eat old food for free. Blame it on the Lunch Ladies.

The same corporate food conglomerate can gain control of the payroll of the Lunch Ladies, take the Lunch Ladies retirement as their own, and ship it off out of the country into off shore accounts. All the while creating a frenzy by screaming about entitlements and how we can not afford them. Unfortunately people listen, and somehow believe the corporate food conglomerate while never knowing they themselves are being played for fools.

When the Lunch Ladies reach the age of retirement and have no money, they can put them into nursing homes that the conglomerate food company has the food contract for. the Lunch Ladies can still eat expired food; the soon to be corporate food conglomerate controlled government can again pay the food conglomerate, the food conglomerate’s church can righteously claim it is offering charity, while taking the money back on the corporate food side and shuttling it out of the country to off shore accounts.

By not privatizing the food service, the loss AMTRAK's food service encounters can at least remain in the country.