Empire Builder

[orion]

Has anybody heard anything new about when the construction will start on raising the Devils Lake sub by Churches Ferry? Since it has been such a nice spring, they could have started it weeks ago and have it done by mid to late fall.

 

[TraneMan]

Has anything been stated on the work?

 

[Pat Harper]

I'm interested in this topic also, since hubby and I will be traveling on that route in August & Sept. Please post any updates to the track work. I'm hoping there won't be any delays along the way that will cause us to miss our next train. We'll be taking the EB from Chicago to Portland, then changing to the Cascades in Portland, and there isn't much of a layover between trains.

 

[George Harris]

Other than reusing, does BNSF still use wood ties? I thought that they went totally with concrete and composite, both of which are cheaper than wood.

BNSF installs between 2 million and 3 million new ties into existing tracks per year, with the three milllion number being the quantity in the last few years, 95% of that quantity being wood. For new track the proportion is about 95% concrete, but the total for new track is around 60,000 per year max, with many years being far less than that, so it does not change the all ties for all purposes ratio of wood to concrete by any meaningful amount.

 

[sechs]

Do you have a source for that? I might write a letter to Matt Rose.

 

[anir dendroica]

Back on topic, does anyone know if there is track work scheduled near Devils Lake this summer?

With minimal snowfall this winter the lake is a foot lower than last year and forecast to drop another foot over the summer.

Mark

 

[George Harris]

Other than reusing, does BNSF still use wood ties? I thought that they went totally with concrete and composite, both of which are cheaper than wood.

BNSF installs between 2 million and 3 million new ties into existing tracks per year, with the three milllion number being the quantity in the last few years, 95% of that quantity being wood. For new track the proportion is about 95% concrete, but the total for new track is around 60,000 per year max, with many years being far less than that, so it does not change the all ties for all purposes ratio of wood to concrete by any meaningful amount.

Do you have a source for that? I might write a letter to Matt Rose.

I assume you were asking about my information on wood ties.

The source was Crossties, the magazine published by the Railway Tie Association.

Most recent year for which I have information is 2010:

Ties laid in replacement on BNSF:

Wood: 3,158,823

Concrete: 168,319

Other: 33,547

2009 was very close to the same, Below is for 2009:

Ties laid in replacement on BNSF:

Wood: 3,116,404

Concrete: 154,906

Other: 12,000

I wouldn't bother with a letter to Matt Rose. I am sure that he knows what is happening in this area. I am also certain that whether and where to use concrete ties has been thoroughly analyzed by people that know far more about the subject than anyone here.

 

[Ispolkom]

Back on topic, does anyone know if there is track work scheduled near Devils Lake this summer?

Nothing since last December, when they said work would start in the spring.

 

[sechs]

I assume you were asking about my information on wood ties.
The source was Crossties, the magazine published by the Railway Tie Association.

Most recent year for which I have information is 2010:

Ties laid in replacement on BNSF:

Wood: 3,158,823

Concrete: 168,319

Other: 33,547

2009 was very close to the same, Below is for 2009:

Ties laid in replacement on BNSF:

Wood: 3,116,404

Concrete: 154,906

Other: 12,000

I wouldn't bother with a letter to Matt Rose. I am sure that he knows what is happening in this area. I am also certain that whether and where to use concrete ties has been thoroughly analyzed by people that know far more about the subject than anyone here.

Thanks for the information. However, that doesn't sound like it includes new rails; only replacement ties.
I sincerely doubt that Matt has a great understanding of which ties are used because "experts" make those decisions. That doesn't mean that one couldn't prompt him to find out.

 

[George Harris]

Thanks for the information. However, that doesn't sound like it includes new rails; only replacement ties.

Guess I do not understand your point. You asked about ties, I gave the info on ties.

I would expect the line to get new rail throughout when it is raised. The part where the track is removed and replaced will most likely get all new ties. Whether it gets wood or concret, I would not want to guess.

My point was that to regard wood ties as somehow archaic and obsolete is incorrect. The two types can be very close in cost. In general, if a tie will rot out before it wears out, there is no real reason to use concrete. If the ties will wear out before rotting out, then concrete will likely make more sense, but not necessarily so. Wood ties are much more tolerant of uneven support and impact than concrete.

Rail? Rail life is generally measured in million tons of passing traffic, not by time in track. Numbers abouve 1,000 million tons are possible with good metallurgy rail.

Rail, ties, ballast, other track material, each item has its own set of properties, life, speciifications, etc. There are literally hundreds of differing shapes of rails in track, although in recent years most of it installed in the US + Canada + Mexico has been in only three sections: 141RE, 136RE, and 115RE. There are different sections used in different parts of the world. US sections are also used in other countries.

 

[Exiled in Express]

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/bnsf-plans-86-million-capital-program-in-north-dakota-to-maintain-and-expand-rail-capacity-2012-05-30

As part of its 2012 capital plan, BNSF will be raising the track at Devils Lake that is threatened by rising water. This project is being funded by BNSF, Amtrak and the state of North Dakota.

Looks like a go for 2012. May your delays be scenic and connections made.

 

[fairviewroad]

http://www.marketwat...city-2012-05-30

As part of its 2012 capital plan, BNSF will be raising the track at Devils Lake that is threatened by rising water. This project is being funded by BNSF, Amtrak and the state of North Dakota.

Looks like a go for 2012. May your delays be scenic and connections made.

Well, it doesn't really seem to confirm anything that wasn't already stated earlier. Track work in 2012, but no indication of when or how it would impact the EB.