Confirmation of what some of us suspected...

[zephyr17]

I picked up tickets for a short trip at my local station yesterday, and the agent and I have nice discussion about various things Amtrak. He talked about the e-ticket rollout and said they've been told that the policy of charging 10% to get a cash refund will apply right from reservation and payment once e-tickets are rolled out across the entire system. Which will be before the end of this year.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

That's not so good. Hopefully they'll provide a 24-hour refund window for mistakes like United and some other airlines provide. Some Amtrak tickets can cost upwards of $2,000 each way, so if you had to completely cancel a round trip you might end up losing $400 in the process. In any case, thanks for the confirmation. I've been waiting to hear how it was going to work. Any word on how exchanges will be handled?

 

[Dan O]

I picked up tickets for a short trip at my local station yesterday, and the agent and I have nice discussion about various things Amtrak. He talked about the e-ticket rollout and said they've been told that the policy of charging 10% to get a cash refund will apply right from reservation and payment once e-tickets are rolled out across the entire system. Which will be before the end of this year.

Drat. I don't ride much but it is nice to be able to cancel and get all your dough back. I have never done it and only been on Amtrak a few times but it does or could alter one's thinking a bit.

Thanks for the info.

Dan

 

[yarrow]

i wonder how changes in a paid by credit card reservation(date or ininerary)will work and how changes or cancellation of an agr redemption will work with e-ticketing? wait and see i guess

 

[Ryan]

In the absence of a formal announcement, I'm not sure that the word of a station agent can be considered "confirmation".

 

[zephyr17]

In the absence of a formal announcement, I'm not sure that the word of a station agent can be considered "confirmation".

I certainly can't say for certain, but he told me that was the policy he has been told to apply. He's already gone through training for etickets, he said.

 

[zephyr17]

That's not so good. Hopefully they'll provide a 24-hour refund window for mistakes like United and some other airlines provide. Some Amtrak tickets can cost upwards of $2,000 each way, so if you had to completely cancel a round trip you might end up losing $400 in the process. In any case, thanks for the confirmation. I've been waiting to hear how it was going to work. Any word on how exchanges will be handled?

Not entirely sure, but vouchers now are evouchers with a number that they can find in the system if you lose the physical voucher. Retains its value, so if it is misplaced, it is still there. I know because I got one yesterday (was exchanging tickets and the new tickets did not cost as much as the old, so got a voucher for the difference).

 

[PRR 60]

Every airline has fully-refundable fares. The fares are more, and sometimes a lot more, but they are available, and I have used them. If Amtrak enacts this policy, they will not have any fully refundable fares regardless of the price paid.

If they want to make the lower bucket or two subject to the 10% penalty, that's fine. However, to apply that to every fare, even top-bucket, is simply wrong. There should be some fare that provides the ability to cancel with a full refund. Credit toward future travel is not a refund.

 

[Aaron]

In the absence of a formal announcement, I'm not sure that the word of a station agent can be considered "confirmation".

It's all in writing here: http://www.amtrak.co...d=1241267362242, and it matches with what the station agent said.

 

[Aaron]

Some Amtrak tickets can cost upwards of $2,000 each way, so if you had to completely cancel a round trip you might end up losing $400 in the process.

From the Amtrak policies in my previous link:

"The maximum amount of the refund service charge will be $100 per refund transaction on any single reservation."

 

[Ryan]

In the absence of a formal announcement, I'm not sure that the word of a station agent can be considered "confirmation".

It's all in writing here: http://www.amtrak.co...d=1241267362242, and it matches with what the station agent said.

Thanks - this is the first time I've seen this part:

eTicket and Prepaid TicketseTickets and tickets purchased through other prepaid programs are considered "paid for" and subject to the refund policies of any component rail fare, passenger type discount, and/or promotional discount, even if paper value tickets have not yet been printed.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

Hopefully they'll provide a 24-hour refund window for mistakes like United and some other airlines provide.

If one is simply looking to correct a mistake, then you would not be looking for a cash refund, no? You would just want to be exchanging your "bad" eTickets for the right ones (ie, simply changing reservations not cancelling altogether).

 

[printman2000]

Correct me if I am wrong, but has this not been the official written policy for a long time and just never used?

 

[jis]

Correct me if I am wrong, but has this not been the official written policy for a long time and just never used?

That's correct. Tells you how much you can trust a written policy, doesn't it?

 

[jis]

Hopefully they'll provide a 24-hour refund window for mistakes like United and some other airlines provide.

If one is simply looking to correct a mistake, then you would not be looking for a cash refund, no? You would just want to be exchanging your "bad" eTickets for the right ones (ie, simply changing reservations not cancelling altogether).

United, and I am sure other airlines give you a 24 hour window in which you can cancel an itinerary, no questions asked, with for full refund irrespective of non-refundability of the ticket. So they do allow for mistakes involving cancellation of the trip entirely. For longer holds of the quoted fare you have to buy what they call a FareLock for a nominal fee. The longest FareLock I am aware of on United is 7 days. You can choose either to purchase the fare or not within that period. At the expiry of the period, if not purchased by then, the quoted fare lapses and you have tos tart all over again.

 

[me_little_me]

Thanks - this is the first time I've seen this part:

eTicket and Prepaid TicketseTickets and tickets purchased through other prepaid programs are considered "paid for" and subject to the refund policies of any component rail fare, passenger type discount, and/or promotional discount, even if paper value tickets have not yet been printed.

I don't think it says what you think it does. Credit Card reservations are paid for also. Your account is charged right away and if the trip is far enough in advance, you have already paid the CC bill. Yet, if tickets were not issued, they have been fully refundable. I think the reference is that etickets are not like unpaid reservations.

Now this has nothing to do with whether Amtrak is going to start enforcing the policy that if the ticket is paid for, it is not refundable 100% in cash or CC credit to your CC account. My guess is that they will enforce it but those words, in my mind, don't make that clear.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Hopefully they'll provide a 24-hour refund window for mistakes like United and some other airlines provide.

If one is simply looking to correct a mistake, then you would not be looking for a cash refund, no? You would just want to be exchanging your "bad" eTickets for the right ones (ie, simply changing reservations not cancelling altogether).

United, and I am sure other airlines give you a 24 hour window in which you can cancel an itinerary, no questions asked, with for full refund irrespective of non-refundability of the ticket. So they do allow for mistakes involving cancellation of the trip entirely.

Exactly. Sometimes you see a great fare so you jump on it before the rest of your trip is fully fleshed out. Then the next day you realize the hotel you wanted is sold out or maybe another project at work is going to conflict with the schedule and there's simply no way to make it work during the fare validity period. So you simply cancel the flights entirely and get your money back. I believe this may actually be a DOT rule at this point, although I do not know if it applies to passenger rail as well.

 

[the_traveler]

1342796203[/url]' post='381513']

1342785536[/url]' post='381492']Thanks - this is the first time I've seen this part:

eTicket and Prepaid TicketseTickets and tickets purchased through other prepaid programs are considered "paid for" and subject to the refund policies of any component rail fare, passenger type discount, and/or promotional discount, even if paper value tickets have not yet been printed.

I don't think it says what you think it does. Credit Card reservations are paid for also. Your account is charged right away and if the trip is far enough in advance, you have already paid the CC bill. Yet, if tickets were not issued, they have been fully refundable. I think the reference is that etickets are not like unpaid reservations.

Now this has nothing to do with whether Amtrak is going to start enforcing the policy that if the ticket is paid for, it is not refundable 100% in cash or CC credit to your CC account. My guess is that they will enforce it but those words, in my mind, don't make that clear.

Exactly! I can reserve a trip today for a trip next May, charge it to my credit card and pay the credit card bill next month, so why should I be penalized?

 

[zephyr17]

1342796203[/url]' post='381513']

1342785536[/url]' post='381492']Thanks - this is the first time I've seen this part:

eTicket and Prepaid TicketseTickets and tickets purchased through other prepaid programs are considered "paid for" and subject to the refund policies of any component rail fare, passenger type discount, and/or promotional discount, even if paper value tickets have not yet been printed.

I don't think it says what you think it does. Credit Card reservations are paid for also. Your account is charged right away and if the trip is far enough in advance, you have already paid the CC bill. Yet, if tickets were not issued, they have been fully refundable. I think the reference is that etickets are not like unpaid reservations.

Now this has nothing to do with whether Amtrak is going to start enforcing the policy that if the ticket is paid for, it is not refundable 100% in cash or CC credit to your CC account. My guess is that they will enforce it but those words, in my mind, don't make that clear.

Exactly! I can reserve a trip today for a trip next May, charge it to my credit card and pay the credit card bill next month, so why should I be penalized?

Remember, the 24 hour refund period for the airlines is largely because the airlines don't allow you to hold a reservation without paying for it. Amtrak does, up to 7 days, depending on the route. You have the opportunity to reserve without paying for it at all on Amtrak, and then change your mind. So, in all fairness, because Amtrak allows you to hold unpaid reservations, the 24 hour refund period is not necessary.

 

[rusty spike]

The following is quoted from my "Amtrak Reservation Summary" received in this morning's email:

 

Near the top it says, "Subject To Cancellation Unless Purchased By July 22, 2012"

 

Near the bottom it says, "To change or cancel your reservation, please call 1-800-USA-RAIL (1-800-872-7245). Refund fees

may apply".

 

I don't know what rules Amtrak has to follow as a merchant doing business with credit card companies subject Federal Trade Commission Guidelines, but if you buy a product or service, (and I haven't purchased anything from Amtrak according the first quote), and the return of same does not include a 100% refund, that must be clearly spelled out. Booking a room to hotels.com or any other on-line service specifically tells you what you must do to avoid a cancellation fee and how much that fee is, be it first nights room rate or what. They don't say "refund fees may apply" Either they do apply or don't. I'm under the assumption from this forum, the was always there but not enforeced if reservation was cancelled prior to travel and a cash refund (credit card credit) requested. Why the ambiguity? When does it apply and is it lesser of 10% or $100 or whatever? Amtrak should disclose this up front.

 

I cannot imagine that anyone would want to book a reservation or eticket for next year knowing that it's going to cost them a C-note in the event they change their mind and decide to take a cruise! I think Amtrak should give some wide latitude to "early" bookings. It is simply smart marketing. IMHO, of course. :hi:

 

[the_traveler]

That is true for phone reservations, but if you book online you have to enter your credit card information (ie - pay) at that time! There is no "7- day hold"!

 

[colobok]

What happens if I need to cancel my reservation, but my credit card is lost or closed?

Will Amtrak mail me refund check instead?

 

[zephyr17]

That is true for phone reservations, but if you book online you have to enter your credit card information (ie - pay) at that time! There is no "7- day hold"!

That is true, and a gap on Amtrak's system. When Alaska Airlines still had a 24 hour hold option available, their website had option buttons for "Hold Reservation" and "Purchase Reservation".

However, I think the point still holds. Amtrak will hold reservations, which the airlines won't even if you call them. You just have to call the 800 number.

 

[fairviewroad]

I cannot imagine that anyone would want to book a reservation or eticket for next year knowing that it's going to cost them a C-note in the event they change their mind and decide to take a cruise!

Yet people buy nonrefundable plane tickets all the time, even for trips months and months in advance. Yeah, I do love the current Amtrak policy but this new policy, if true, wouldn't really cause me to change my

travel patterns.

 

[jis]

1342796203[/url]' post='381513']

1342785536[/url]' post='381492']Thanks - this is the first time I've seen this part:

eTicket and Prepaid TicketseTickets and tickets purchased through other prepaid programs are considered "paid for" and subject to the refund policies of any component rail fare, passenger type discount, and/or promotional discount, even if paper value tickets have not yet been printed.

I don't think it says what you think it does. Credit Card reservations are paid for also. Your account is charged right away and if the trip is far enough in advance, you have already paid the CC bill. Yet, if tickets were not issued, they have been fully refundable. I think the reference is that etickets are not like unpaid reservations.

Now this has nothing to do with whether Amtrak is going to start enforcing the policy that if the ticket is paid for, it is not refundable 100% in cash or CC credit to your CC account. My guess is that they will enforce it but those words, in my mind, don't make that clear.

Exactly! I can reserve a trip today for a trip next May, charge it to my credit card and pay the credit card bill next month, so why should I be penalized?

Remember, the 24 hour refund period for the airlines is largely because the airlines don't allow you to hold a reservation without paying for it. Amtrak does, up to 7 days, depending on the route. You have the opportunity to reserve without paying for it at all on Amtrak, and then change your mind. So, in all fairness, because Amtrak allows you to hold unpaid reservations, the 24 hour refund period is not necessary.

That choice to reserve without paying, does not appear to be available on Amtrak's web site, unless I am missing something. Frankly I do not want to have to deal with a human being at the other end of a telephone line if I can help it

Several airlines do allow you to reserve and hold the fare for upto 7 days for a small fee. Moreover you can do all that right on the website without having to sit on hold for 15 minutes after calling the 800 number.