Best time for fall travel?

[crabby_appleton1950]

I was hoping to repeat my round trip (roomette) Albuquerque ~ San Diego in May but was recently diagnosed with a heart condition which I need to get under control.

So now I'm thinking of going sometime between Labor Day and Thanksgiving.

Any suggestions on when it may be less crowded, and cheapest?

thanks

 

[neroden]

General rules of thumb for Amtrak: Very crowded around Thanksgiving. Fairly crowded around Labor Day. Crowded during "back to school" season which doesn't end until mid-September.

Your best bets are October or the first half of November. And it's generally cheaper midweek (Tuesday to Thursday).

I don't know if there's anything specific happening on particular weekends in the corridors from ABQ-LAX-SAN which would cause crowding on those particular routes.

 

[KmH]

Yep. I Agree. October to mid-November.

I have a 6500 mile, 7 day, 14 state loop trip planned for that time frame that starts/ends at Galesburg, IL - Illinois Zephyr, Texas Eagle, Pacific Surfliner, Coast Starlight, Empire Builder, Illinois Zephyr.

 

[niemi24s]

Any suggestions on when it may be less crowded, and cheapest?

No idea about the less crowded part, but as far as the cheapest dates the best way to find out is to use AmSnag: http://biketrain.net/amsnag/amSnag.php Neroden believes the cheapest periods are generally mid-week (Tuesday, Wednesday & Thursday) and that may be so for some trains. However, my study conducted on 8 Nov 2015 of roomette fares on the California Zephyr for the period 18 Nov 2015 thru 15 Feb 2016 revealed the opposite with average fares to be:

• Weekend = $430

• Midweek = $471

But I'm guessing you'd be on the Southwest Chief for your trip and I've not yet done such a study for that train. No reason to believe the SWC would be anything like the CZ So for all I know, the SWC could be generally cheaper during the week per Neroden's advise. Best way to know with any certainty is do an AmSnag search.

[edit] Used AmSnag to conduct a look-see for Roomette fares on the SWC from ABQ to LAX during the 5 Sep 2016 through 24 Nov 2016 period and found averages to be:

• Weekend = $176

• Midweek = $258

Did a somewhat similar study for the Empire Builder about a year ago and will add those results if I can locate them. Don't recall doing any such monkey business for East Coast trains as I seldom ride them. The only general rule I have to offer concerning Amtrak fares is that generalities are generally impossible to formulate - in general! :blink:

[edit²] The following figures are the average total fare for two seniors in a Bedroom (not Roomette, as above) on the Empire Builder between Milwaukee and Seattle. Raw data covered the 1 Mar 2015 through 31 May 2015 period with queries made on 7 various dates during Jan & Feb 2015. Total individual fares gathered was 644, 7 for each day of that 3 month period

• Weekend = $1553

• Midweek = $1634

From this you might think I'd be tempted to say "generally, fares are lower on the weekend", but I know better than that. Too many trains, each with two directions, each with many pairs of possible on & off points besides the end points, etc, etc. There probably is some train somewhere in the system with (generally) lower fares during the week but I've yet to find it. And I've better things to do than go looking for it.

 

[neroden]

Oh, sleeper fares can be all *over* the place, varying wildly from one day to the next. Definitely look at Amsnag. The 'midweek' rule of thumb works better for coach & business class seets.

 

[crabby_appleton1950]

Many thanks to all. Looks like I have some home work to do.

 

[Palmland]

Since you're going to San Diego, I'd suggest the week or two before Thanksgiving. Then it's more likely the weather in Alburquerque will be worse than the always nice San Diego!

 

[crabby_appleton1950]

Since you're going to San Diego, I'd suggest the week or two before Thanksgiving. Then it's more likely the weather in Alburquerque will be worse than the always nice San Diego!

I lived in San Diego 20 years and got so bored with the nice weather I got homesick for my home state of PA.

 

[niemi24s]

The 'midweek' rule of thumb works better for coach & business class seets.

Don't know about business class, but the only significant coach fare data on hand is for the CZ and its average weekend coach fare is only 2% more than midweek. The three sleeper rates mentioned above were 9%, 32% and 5% more during midweek (cheaper on the weekend). There's no significant difference in Coach for the SWC done for this thread because of the 80 days queried, there were only two days with different (higher) fares. Those were on a Monday and a Friday with Roomettes and Bedrooms Sold Out.

Perhaps there are other trains at other times when weekend Coach fares are more than 2% above those during midweek. But as I rarely travel coach, I've little interest in finding out. You may have a general rule - but I don't. I'm not the least bit comfortable in saying anything but "Do an Amsnag inquiry!"

 

[Thirdrail7]

I always liked the mid to late September trains. They may not be as light as the early October trains, but I noticed the USA Rail passengers were usually out in full force during this period. They were fun to travel with and usually made for very pleasant company...if you were up for the chat that is.

 

[neroden]

Perhaps there are other trains at other times when weekend Coach fares are more than 2% above those during midweek.

Empire Corridor, LSL, Keystone Corridor, Downeaster, Illinois corridors, Michigan corridors, Surfliner, Denver-Chicago, Minneapolis-Chicago... I've seen it happen often enough I'm comfortable describing it as a general pattern. I can see why it wouldn't apply to routes that don't have logical "weekend getaway" traffic, though.

 

[tricia]

Another factor: Day length is significantly shorter in November than September.

 

[KmH]

In the middle of September the sun is up for close to 12.5 hours

In the middle of October the sun is up for close to 11 hours.

In the middle of November the sun is up for close to 9.5 hours

If you are westbound you can add a bit of time for each.

If you are eastbound, subtract a bit of time for each.

 

[crabby_appleton1950]

Another factor: Day length is significantly shorter in November than September.

Not really a factor for me as I lived in San Diego for 20+ years, saw all the sights many times, and am going to visit a couple friends.

We'll most likely be 'home' by sundown. I'm now 70, disabled somewhat, with medical problems ~ so my night life is behind me.

We may go out to dinner, preferring the 'early bird specials' and then 'home' watch a DVD or two.

So, it;s a trip more to visit old friends while I can.

 

[niemi24s]

Perhaps there are other trains at other times when weekend Coach fares are more than 2% above those during midweek.

Empire Corridor, LSL, Keystone Corridor, Downeaster, Illinois corridors, Michigan corridors, Surfliner, Denver-Chicago, Minneapolis-Chicago... I've seen it happen often enough I'm comfortable describing it as a general pattern. I can see why it wouldn't apply to routes that don't have logical "weekend getaway" traffic, though.

As I rarely travel coach, I'd never really wondered how its cost might vary throughout the week.- until now. Did 10 AmSnag searches for the "weekend getaway" routes mentioned above (top half of chart) and 10 others for normal long distance routes and after some math, came up with this comparison:



• Coach fares are definitely higher on the weekend for those weekend getaway routes and sort of a toss up for the routes on the bottom half of the chart.

• Roomette fares seem mostly lower on the weekend for either type of route.

What surprised me the most was the seemingly high roomette rates for the Cardinal.

 

[neroden]

Thanks for the work. The Cardinal tends to have sky-high roomette rates, proably because there are so few roomettes on the train. Everyone here has been figuring that adding another Viewliner to the Cardinal will make a lot of money for Amtrak. But running it daily would make even more money.

 

[niemi24s]

You're welcome. As you can probably tell by now, I like to noodle around with numbers.

When the data are used to find the average cost per route mile for a roomette (without the mid-week vs. weekend distinction) the results are:

• 46¢ per route mile for the Cardinal

• 21¢ per route mile for all the others on the bottom half of the chart when combined. They have a range of:

▲ 18¢ per route mile for the California Zephyr to

▲ 28¢ per route mile for the Capitol Limited

The number of meals you get with a roomette might be a better basis of comparison than route miles, but route miles is easier to figure.

.

 

[niemi24s]

I wonder if the high cost of a roomette on the Cardinal could be the result of that posh resort hotel The Greenbrier... http://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Review-g59644-d100352-Reviews-The_Greenbrier-White_Sulphur_Springs_West_Virginia.html ...being located at one of the trains stops, White Sulphur Springs WV. Those with pockets deep enough to stay there probably wouldn't bat an eye at paying double for a roomette. NARP data shows ridership for that stop of 5,165 was ranked 12 of 32 in 2014 and is about twice the towns population, so perhaps most of those riders were Greenbrier patrons?