An Analysis Of SDS

[AlanB]

What exactly is the financial relationship between the sleepers and the dining car? Does the dining car get a fixed cut of the sleeping car accommodation charge?

Yes, but I've no clue just what the cut is.

And more than anything, I wonder what happens when a train runs late (like that never happens )? The dining car has to feed all the sleeping car passengers an additional meal for every 4 hours the train is late. Does the dining car have to eat (another pun?) that cost?

My guess is that the dinner takes that loss on the chin, but I'm not positive.

 

[Tony]

My guess is that the dinner takes that loss on the chin, but I'm not positive.

That is one of the reasons, therefore, that when Amtrak claims they loose money on the dining car, my reaction is "duh!". Amtrak runs it such that the dining car has to eat it (I just love puns) when LD trains run late.

Let's face it, Amtrak trains run late more often than not. And with them running late, sleeper passengers many times get yet another meal. I know for me on 92, that if the train is running its usual lateness, we get an extra free lunch before getting off in Orlando.

IMHO, it is operating/bookkeeping policies like that, and not the number of servers or cooks on board, or using china over plastic, that cost the diner car to loose money.

 

[haolerider]

My guess is that the dinner takes that loss on the chin, but I'm not positive.

That is one of the reasons, therefore, that when Amtrak claims they loose money on the dining car, my reaction is "duh!". Amtrak runs it such that the dining car has to eat it (I just love puns) when LD trains run late.

Let's face it, Amtrak trains run late more often than not. And with them running late, sleeper passengers many times get yet another meal. I know for me on 92, that if the train is running its usual lateness, we get an extra free lunch before getting off in Orlando.

IMHO, it is operating/bookkeeping policies like that, and not the number of servers or cooks on board, or using china over plastic, that cost the diner car to loose money.

There is a set amount of the Sleeper passengers fare that is allocated to the food & beverage department. The extra food that might be served during a late train does not get charged back to the food & beverage department, it is a passenger incovenience allocation that is generally absorbed by the operating division. Labor is the single largest contributor to the loss in the food & beverage department. Food costs are basically the same as a stand alone restaurant, but the wages paid are nothing like the wages paid to a waiter, cook or other food service person in a regular restaurant. Of course, that is based on the fact that the dining car staff is working tremendously long shifts, away from home for days on end and conducting business on a moving piece of equipment.

 

[had8ley]

but the wages paid are nothing like the wages paid to a waiter, cook or other food service person in a regular restaurant. Of course, that is based on the fact that the dining car staff is working tremendously long shifts, away from home for days on end and conducting business on a moving piece of equipment.

Try telling that to an airline stewardess who is on duty from the time the plane fills and until the last pax has deplaned. They have taken 30-50% pay cuts, multiple fringe benefit cuts and perform much the same duties except at 5 miles above ground and are away from home for days at a time. The ironic part of all this is the airline industry is covered by the Railway Labor Act !

 

[EB_OBS]

but the wages paid are nothing like the wages paid to a waiter, cook or other food service person in a regular restaurant. Of course, that is based on the fact that the dining car staff is working tremendously long shifts, away from home for days on end and conducting business on a moving piece of equipment.

Try telling that to an airline stewardess who is on duty from the time the plane fills and until the last pax has deplaned. They have taken 30-50% pay cuts, multiple fringe benefit cuts and perform much the same duties except at 5 miles above ground and are away from home for days at a time. The ironic part of all this is the airline industry is covered by the Railway Labor Act !

I've taken four flights this year involving getting on and off an airplane nine times due to connecting flights. On every single one, there were three or occasionally only two flight attendants. They did the usual FAA required safety instructional stuff at the beginning of the flight, served some beverages once, collected the garbage and sat for the rest of the majority of the flight. All of the legs of my flights were from 3 to 4.5 hours long. I imagine the crew works two or three hops a day but I'm not sure.

That may be an oversimplification but it's not even remotely close to the amount of work done by attendants on a train.

 

[DET63]

Alan, thanks for the numbers. Picking food service and try to "fix" where it's not broken won't certainly help Amtrak. I have more questions:
1) Do bi-level cars make sense? How many passengers Superliners can seat on both levels? A modern single-level car can seat 60-70 passengers in great comfort and provide an economical sleeping for roughly same number. A modern single-level T2 sleeper can sleep 34 people in acceptable comfort (doubles) and about 18 people in great comfort.

2) Aren't bi-level cars more expensive, more tough on tracks, more dangerous if there is an accident?

I think the main drawback to bi-level cars in their loading gauge. In the western (and southern) U.S., Superliners are used because loading gauges are generous, and the same numbers of passengers can be carried on shorter trains. In the northeastern U.S., as well as Europe, clearances (esp. low bridges and tight tunnels) preclude their use. However, in Europe TGV bi-level Duplex trainsets are used for some services, so clearance issues have been resolved (probably because they're used on new LGV lines that were built with a larger loading gauge).

Safety doesn't seem to be a serious issue with 2-level trains.