Amtrak train 194

[BLOND37]

Oh my god what is the deal with this train? I ride it from NYP to PVD. It is CONSTANTLY late...twice it has 1.5 hours late and the past two weeks it has 45 mins late... from what i gather its a problem with CSX but i dont know what that means exactly... on time performance seems to be like 37%... does amtrak know or even care? what is being done?

 

[Amtrak839]

194 is coming to New York all the way from Newport News. From Newport News to D.C. the track is owned by CSX, not Amtrak. CSX is supposed to give priority to Amtrak trains, but that doesn't always happen. Amtrak trains are often forced to follow slow freight trains for miles and miles. I rode train 66 last night, which runs the same route as 194, and we were stuck behind a freight train east of Richmond. We were 45 minutes late once we got around it, but didn't lose anymore time from there on. Other things that cause delays such as broken down trains blocking the track, signal problems, and speed restrictions due to track problems are also more common on CSX track than on the Northeast Corridor. Amtrak knows about situations like this (they deal with many of them), and they try to work with freight railroads like CSX to find solutions. Sometimes they alter schedules to avoid conflicts between freight and passenger trains. There is a limit to what Amtrak can do, and sometimes they are at the mercy of CSX. 194 runs on a relatively tight schedule north of D.C., so it has few opportunities to make up time.

 

[AlanB]

CSX is the freight company that owns the tracks between Richmond and DC. They control the signals on the tracks, and therefore Amtrak doesn't always get priority. Not suggesting that they always delay Amtrak, but it does happen more often than it should.

Think of it like this, if your neighbor owned the street that you lived on and kept turning the traffic light red at the corner everytime you got near it, you'd be late to everything you wanted to do also.

 

[battalion51]

I prefer the motorcade reference. I got stopped by a motorcade (the FSU team buses) this morning, and almost was late to work because of it. Same principle.

 

[BLOND37]

CSX is the freight company that owns the tracks between Richmond and DC. They control the signals on the tracks, and therefore Amtrak doesn't always get priority. Not suggesting that they always delay Amtrak, but it does happen more often than it should.
Think of it like this, if your neighbor owned the street that you lived on and kept turning the traffic light red at the corner everytime you got near it, you'd be late to everything you wanted to do also.

ohh i see... interesting

 

[BLOND37]

194 is coming to New York all the way from Newport News. From Newport News to D.C. the track is owned by CSX, not Amtrak. CSX is supposed to give priority to Amtrak trains, but that doesn't always happen. Amtrak trains are often forced to follow slow freight trains for miles and miles. I rode train 66 last night, which runs the same route as 194, and we were stuck behind a freight train east of Richmond. We were 45 minutes late once we got around it, but didn't lose anymore time from there on. Other things that cause delays such as broken down trains blocking the track, signal problems, and speed restrictions due to track problems are also more common on CSX track than on the Northeast Corridor. Amtrak knows about situations like this (they deal with many of them), and they try to work with freight railroads like CSX to find solutions. Sometimes they alter schedules to avoid conflicts between freight and passenger trains. There is a limit to what Amtrak can do, and sometimes they are at the mercy of CSX. 194 runs on a relatively tight schedule north of D.C., so it has few opportunities to make up time.

why cant amtrak divide 194 into 2 trains, one from NPN to NYP and one from NYP to Boston.. that way when its late getting to NYP as it always is, it will leave on time from NYP.

 

[battalion51]

Amtrak does run a large number of trains that stay only on the corridor. There is a market for the one seat ride from NPN-BOS, so there are a select few trains that perform this service. Sometimes the trains do run late, but that's the nature of the beast. The train isn't divided because most folks don't want to have to change trains, or worry about a missed connection. There are enough frequencies in the Northeast that if one wants to avoid a Newport News train it is doable.

 

[nr272]

CSX is the freight company that owns the tracks between Richmond and DC. They control the signals on the tracks, and therefore Amtrak doesn't always get priority. Not suggesting that they always delay Amtrak, but it does happen more often than it should.
Think of it like this, if your neighbor owned the street that you lived on and kept turning the traffic light red at the corner everytime you got near it, you'd be late to everything you wanted to do also.

Interesting. I wonder what percentage of late trains running somewhere in the NE corridor originated south of DC. Do you know what is the most common cause for late running trains that operate only in the DC-Boston range?

 

[BLOND37]

There are enough frequencies in the Northeast that if one wants to avoid a Newport News train it is doable.

how so?

 

[nr272]

There are enough frequencies in the Northeast that if one wants to avoid a Newport News train it is doable.

how so?

Not all trains in the Northeast corridor originate from Newport News; many are coming from DC and New York.

 

[AlanB]

CSX is the freight company that owns the tracks between Richmond and DC. They control the signals on the tracks, and therefore Amtrak doesn't always get priority. Not suggesting that they always delay Amtrak, but it does happen more often than it should.
Think of it like this, if your neighbor owned the street that you lived on and kept turning the traffic light red at the corner everytime you got near it, you'd be late to everything you wanted to do also.

Interesting. I wonder what percentage of late trains running somewhere in the NE corridor originated south of DC. Do you know what is the most common cause for late running trains that operate only in the DC-Boston range?

I don't see any info that seems to indicate what percentage of late trains on the NEC was caused by trains being delayed south of DC.

As for your other question, here's the rundown for August 2008. Note, all delays are in minutes per 10,000 train miles. Underlined items are category totals, details under the category.

• 325 - total host RR 45.6%
   
  
• 3 - Freight interference 0.5%
  
• 95 - Passenger train interference 13.3 %
  
• 52 - commuter train interference 7.3%
  
• 38 - slow orders 5.3%
  
• 24 - signal delays 3.3%
  
• 6 - route 0.9%
  
• 105 - Maintenance of way 14.8%
  
• 2 - other 0.3%
  
• 49 - Third Party and unused recovery 6.8%
   
  
• 26 - weather 3.6%
  
• 4 - unused recovery time 0.5%
  
• 19 - third party (no idea what this is) 2.7%
  
• 339 - Total Amtrak passenger & equipment 47.6%
   
  
• 66 - passenger related 9.2%
  
• 14 - crew & system 1.9%
  
• 52 - loco failures 7.3%
  
• 17 - car failure 2.3%
  
• 22 - servicing 3.1%
  
• 169 - all other (no clue what that means either) 23.7%
  

 

[BLOND37]

you can check ontime performance for 194 on amtrak's website-- 194 comes from south of DC.

 

[BLOND37]

test

 

[nr272]

CSX is the freight company that owns the tracks between Richmond and DC. They control the signals on the tracks, and therefore Amtrak doesn't always get priority. Not suggesting that they always delay Amtrak, but it does happen more often than it should.
Think of it like this, if your neighbor owned the street that you lived on and kept turning the traffic light red at the corner everytime you got near it, you'd be late to everything you wanted to do also.

Interesting. I wonder what percentage of late trains running somewhere in the NE corridor originated south of DC. Do you know what is the most common cause for late running trains that operate only in the DC-Boston range?

I don't see any info that seems to indicate what percentage of late trains on the NEC was caused by trains being delayed south of DC.

As for your other question, here's the rundown for August 2008. Note, all delays are in minutes per 10,000 train miles. Underlined items are category totals, details under the category.

Thanks.

 

[had8ley]

194 is coming to New York all the way from Newport News. From Newport News to D.C. the track is owned by CSX, not Amtrak. CSX is supposed to give priority to Amtrak trains, but that doesn't always happen. Amtrak trains are often forced to follow slow freight trains for miles and miles. I rode train 66 last night, which runs the same route as 194, and we were stuck behind a freight train east of Richmond. We were 45 minutes late once we got around it, but didn't lose anymore time from there on. Other things that cause delays such as broken down trains blocking the track, signal problems, and speed restrictions due to track problems are also more common on CSX track than on the Northeast Corridor. Amtrak knows about situations like this (they deal with many of them), and they try to work with freight railroads like CSX to find solutions. Sometimes they alter schedules to avoid conflicts between freight and passenger trains. There is a limit to what Amtrak can do, and sometimes they are at the mercy of CSX. 194 runs on a relatively tight schedule north of D.C., so it has few opportunities to make up time.

why cant amtrak divide 194 into 2 trains, one from NPN to NYP and one from NYP to Boston.. that way when its late getting to NYP as it always is, it will leave on time from NYP.

Because the people that want a one seat ride would be standing on the platform waiting for the next train to Boston if they missed the connecting train at NYP. It might leave NYP on time but it would also leave a lot of irate travelers going through from south of NYP :unsure: :unsure:

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

why cant amtrak divide 194 into 2 trains, one from NPN to NYP and one from NYP to Boston.. that way when its late getting to NYP as it always is, it will leave on time from NYP.

One thing Amtrak almost could do is make the northbound NPN-BOS trains discharge only at WAS and points north of WAS, and then run another train from WAS to BOS that departs WAS around the same time that train is scheduled for. However, that would lead to poorer load factors in the coaches on the northern part of the route, it would require additional electric locomotives (which Amtrak doesn't have an excess of, and which they can't easily get a handful more of of the same type as their existing locomotives), and there may not be an excess of track capacity in Metro-North, Shore Line East, and/or perhaps NJT territory for any more trains.

You could also write to your federal legislators asking them to fund track at least from Washington to Richmond and possibly even all the way to NPN that would be owned by Amtrak and perhaps faster than the existing freight track. Passenger rail service that truly works well and has adequate room to grow seems to always require substantial investment in the track, usually through outright ownership, by the passenger railroad. Washington to Richmond is only 108 highway miles; it's pathetic that that trip takes roughly two hours by rail, when the French 25 years ago could have figured out how to get it well under an hour.

And yes, I've done a BOS-Williamsburg round trip, and the one seat ride was definitely a good thing there.

 

[ralfp]

I prefer the motorcade reference. I got stopped by a motorcade (the FSU team buses) this morning, and almost was late to work because of it. Same principle.

Trains are getting a BS privilege that should be revoked? Trains carry people with egos that need pampering? Trains should be one car long and stop at all intersections?

Motorcades are legit for high value targets and for idiot drivers who don't know where they're going. For everyone else motorcades exist to stroke egos.

 

[BLOND37]

So if csx is supposed to give preference to amtrak trains and they don't what can be done? Who do we need to complain to?

 

[haolerider]

So if csx is supposed to give preference to amtrak trains and they don't what can be done? Who do we need to complain to?

This is being addressed by Congress, but you can always call your congressional repersentative and voice your opinion.