Amtrak Southwest Chief New Mexico

[nmrxabqfan101]

I have noticed allot of you have information that is all rumor or speculation? Here is what is going on....Several Studies were done on the Southern route which concluded that if the SWC went to Clovis & Been that would be more money for Amtrak's pocket. Well the studies also recently donebper request of NMDOT and Governor Martinez shows New Mexico would loose money and ridership would be much less. Amtrak has shown that they do not want to be a add and subtract business. I personally met with Joe Boardman in which we discussed the Southern route and what stops Amtrak from running there? First off the amount of trains running through that segment would delay the Chief due to low Track capacity, Making or Building ADA platforms at older stations, Build New Track, upgrade current or older sidings....etc basically allot of red tape and money to go through just to send the SWC on the southern route. I personally saw a copy of NMDOT findings and Ridership Numbers, and Future Holdings. Looks like NMDOT concluded the SWC is better where she is. Amtrak CEO AND BNSF Chairman Matt Rose agreed the Southwest Chief is better served on Raton than to re route her over the southern route, both CEO's are working with DOTs from all states to find a long term plan for continued service and operation of Raton. Now New Mexico's position is they want to find out exact prices of rebuilding the track will cost, and how much operating costs will be once the line is upgraded.NMAC and NMDOT along with other state & city agencies have agreed a solution needs to be found soon. NM Governor Martinez has not fully commented on the recent findings. The current cost if rounded is around 6 million for NM portion of the track. NMDOT Secretary mentioned that if the Chief ever want to the southern route the state will step in. But as of now NM wants a commitment from Amtrak and BNSF That service will continue before any state funds are handed out.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

So Basically

1. Sending the Southwest Chief over the Transcon line is out of the question.

2. Amtrak CEO & BNSF CEO agreed the SWC is better served over Raton than Clovis.

3. Some funding have aquirred through State,Local Cities and Organizations along with a TIGER GRANT to repair some of the line that is in desperate need of repair.

4. Re Route to Pueblo Co is beinging studied.

5. New Talk of Passenger service in CO,NM,AZ,CA and Nevada now make the continued operation of Raton Pass more important as hinted by the FRA.

6. New Mexico has not said or taking any public stance in regards to funding yet.

7. Governor Sussana Martinez and Lt Governor John Sanchez have deemed the SWC is vital to North Central NM and is working to find more options and solutions with all stakeholders involved.

8. NM Delegation has sent requests for emergency funding to be sent to NM for the SWC line.

9.BNSF and Amtrak have committed funds to the rehabilitation of the track in KS and CO.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

Any questions please ask?

 

[VentureForth]

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.

The Transcon is not a low capacity line. It's a high capacity line that is heavily utilized. Unless you mean they would reroute over a portion that isn't the Transcon, I don't understand.

Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

 

[the_traveler]

If NMDOT has concluded that the SWC will stay where it is, does that mean they are going to pay for the upgrades to tracks in NM and KS and the maintenance of those tracks? :huh: They are not used by any other train, so BNSF or any other railroad will not do so, thus NM must.

 

[Bob Dylan]

And pigs can fly!

Sorry to have to tell you that all politicians knoww how to spin,aka lie, with the best of them! New Mexico and Kansas have made it clear they do not want to spend the tens of millions of dollars required to upgrade and maintain the current route of the SWC!

And with the new anti- spending Congress ( except for wars, law enforcement and more tax cuts for the rich) taking office in Jan. in Washington things like earmarks, grants etc. will not be flowing to Amtrak who will be lucky to maintain the current level of Government support!

This topic has been extensively discussed on lots of forums and in the news,and what Boardman said might sound good, but exceot for a few local Politicians in Colorado, there is zero political will to fund this! As the old saying goes, money talks and BS walks!

Look for the switch to the Southern Transcon within a year, book it Danno, unless you know where the required money is coming from to support two Amtrak Trains a day through what is basically unoccupied country!

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.

The Transcon is not a low capacity line. It's a high capacity line that is heavily utilized. Unless you mean they would reroute over a portion that isn't the Transcon, I don't understand.

Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.The Transcon is not a low capacity line. It's a high capacity line that is heavily utilized. Unless you mean they would reroute over a portion that isn't the Transcon, I don't understand.Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

I never said I worked for Amtrak.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

If NMDOT has concluded that the SWC will stay where it is, does that mean they are going to pay for the upgrades to tracks in NM and KS and the maintenance of those tracks? :huh: They are not used by any other train, so BNSF or any other railroad will not do so, thus NM must.

. New Mexico is open to fund this Amtrak service but are looking at all options before any state money is committed. The Legal studies shown that the anti donation clause in the state consitituon allows the state to help out as long as it benefits the state under economic benefit. The studies also shown that the Southwest Chief is better served on Raton than Clovis due to the findings by an outside company who has experience in these matters. A final decision in regards to funding will be made during or after the 2015 legislation which starts in January.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.

The Transcon is not a low capacity line. It's a high capacity line that is heavily utilized. Unless you mean they would reroute over a portion that isn't the Transcon, I don't understand.

Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.The Transcon is not a low capacity line. It's a high capacity line that is heavily utilized. Unless you mean they would reroute over a portion that isn't the Transcon, I don't understand.Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

I never said I worked for Amtrak.

Nobody said you did.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.

The Transcon is not a low capacity line. It's a high capacity line that is heavily utilized. Unless you mean they would reroute over a portion that isn't the Transcon, I don't understand.

Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.The Transcon is not a low capacity line. It's a high capacity line that is heavily utilized. Unless you mean they would reroute over a portion that isn't the Transcon, I don't understand.Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

I never said I worked for Amtrak.

Nobody said you did.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

I work with the coalition that is working with state officials to find solutions to keep the chief running. I am posting on here cause I see all the posts and most of you all are so mis-informed and the ideas you all have and fully believe the SWC will run the southern route are respected but is not the truth.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

I have copies of most of the legal studies done and soon to get public copies on the state of NM findings come 2015. I am willing to share those copies with people so people can know what's going on. I would not be posting here if I didn't know anything about the NM situation.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

GARDEN CITY, Kansas – A $12.5 million federal grant will pay for urgent repairs on the route of Amtrak’s Southwest Chief in western Kansas and eastern Colorado, but funding for upgrades in southern Colorado and New Mexico remains uncertain.

The grant will be combined with $9,300,000 of state, local, and private funds and used to restore several miles of the La Junta subdivision of the Kansas Division of the BNSF railway, over which Amtrak’s Southwest Chief currently travels.

The Southwest Chief is a long-distance Amtrak passenger service that operates daily between Chicago and Los Angeles. According to railway engineers, the condition of the route has been deteriorating and, without intervention, would erode to the point where operation of the passenger train on the route would not be feasible.

The Southwest Chief provides critical passenger transportation for rural communities in Kansas, Colorado, and New Mexico. In 2011, communities in those three states began working to address the infrastructure needs of the route. According to the communities, the TIGER funds represent a key component of the funding program and will be used to preserve passenger service along the route.

“This award is the culmination of work by a multitude of people in Kansas, Colorado and New Mexico who recognize the importance of passenger rail to our communities,” Garden City Manager Matt Allen said. “This would not have been possible without the support of our elected representatives at the State level and at the Federal level. In particular, we would like to thank Senator Moran, Senator Roberts, Rep. Jenkins, KDOT Secretary Mike King, and former Senator Dole for championing this effort on our behalf.”

Improvements on the route will also have a long-term economic benefit to the state.

“In addition to preserving train speeds on the Southwest Chief route this project will also provide benefits to rural freight rail customers,” Secretary King said. “Improvements in train speeds, enhanced operating efficiency, and improvements in equipment utilization will provide economic benefits to Kansas businesses and farmers.”

Allen also expressed his gratitude to those entities that have contributed matching funds to the project. They are: Amtrak; BNSF; the Kansas Department of Transportation; the City of Dodge City, KS; the City of Garden City, KS; the City of Hutchinson, KS; the City of Newton, KS; the City of La Junta, CO; the City of Lamar, CO; the City of Trinidad, CO; Bent County, CO; Las Animas County, CO; Otero County, CO; Prowers County, CO; Pueblo County, CO; the I-25 Coalition; the Colorado Rail Passenger Association; and the American Association of Private Railroad Car Owners.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

The $3.3 million loss to New Mexico mentioned in the article and the letters assumes that the Chicago to Los Angeles train is rerouted off of the line through Lamy and Raton Pass to BNSF’s main freight line that bisects our state from Clovis through Belen and Gallup.

Both BNSF and Amtrak have stated that they prefer to maintain the train on its current route, and the cost of rerouting the train is unknown at this time and may be prohibitive.

Amtrak’s proposal to maintain the line is for Kansas, Colorado and New Mexico is for each to contribute $4 million annually for 10 years, with an additional annual commitment of $4 million each from BNSF and Amtrak. The two letters state the request is for $7 million.

The overall impact of the Southwest Chief to New Mexico is outlined in a study released by the N.M. Department of Transportation on Nov. 6. NMDOT estimates that total output (labor income and gross regional product – a measurement of newly created value through production in a region) at $22.4 million. Direct and indirect (e.g., hospitality industry) employment is 283 people. State and local taxes paid by BNSF for the northern route are $1.7 million.

What is impossible to measure in dollar amounts is the increased mobility the daily train provides to the residents of New Mexico.

The same NMDOT study estimates ridership on the Chief to stations in New Mexico annually at 127,400. In 2013, 75,966 people boarded or departed the Chief in Albuquerque. Amtrak each summer carries approximately 4,500 Boy Scouts to the Philmont Scout Ranch, northeast New Mexico’s largest employer.

Also impossible to measure is the “free advertising” the train provides to 900 potential future tourists who ride through our state on the trains every day.

Losing the train altogether is a distinct possibility if funding cannot be found to maintain the rail infrastructure. If the train leaves the historic and scenic northern route, BNSF will be able to downgrade the line – now unused for freight service – or abandon it altogether.

The loss of the train and the rail line would have a devastating impact on the economy of New Mexico.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Its all fine and good to have reems of studies, reports, legal opinions etc.but you still haven't provided any info where the tens of millions of dollars required annually to maintain the current Raton Pass route will come from,let alone the Mega Millions needed to upgrade the tracks! Amtrak doesn't have it, your Governor is opposed and BNSF hadn't forgotten that the State of New Mexico welched in the deal to purchase the tracks north towards Raton.

Also Kansas is broke, has an extreme right wing government that can't even fund the schools so where's the money coming from this keep the Chief on this Route? Remember there's only Two Trains a day on this Route, Two!

We await your answer and also think its naive to believe what Politicians ( Joe Boardman included) say, the old saying still goes, "Show me the Money!!!"

 

[Ryan]

Can you proofread before posting? Interesting topic, but misplaced question marks, wrong use of synonyms, one run on paragraph, and generally poor grammar makes this really hard to read.

This.

Also, I don't see a whole lot of new information that hasn't already been posted elsewhere. We all know that Boardman wants to stay put. One of his executives personally posted that here on this forum.

With a healthy side dish of this. There's an already existing 27 page thread that's hashed all of this out:http://discuss.amtraktrains.com/index.php?/topic/53558-southwest-chief-re-route/page-27

If you're going to show up and say that we all don't know what we're talking about, you'd be much better served to write in something better than incomprehensible gibberish and to put it in the proper thread.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

Its all fine and good to have reems of studies, reports, legal opinions etc.but you still haven't provided any info where the tens of millions of dollars required annually to maintain the current Raton Pass route will come from,let alone the Mega Millions needed to upgrade the tracks! Amtrak doesn't have it, your Governor is opposed and BNSF hadn't forgotten that the State of New Mexico welched in the deal to purchase the tracks north towards Raton.

Also Kansas is broke, has an extreme right wing government that can't even fund the schools so where's the money coming from this keep the Chief on this Route? Remember there's only Two Trains a day on this Route, Two!

We await your answer and also think its naive to believe what Politicians ( Joe Boardman included) say, the old saying still goes, "Show me the Money!!!"

the money would come from severance tax bonds which the funds come from tax dollars paid by corporations and companies in New Mexico. But nothing is official yet....But we will find out where all this money will come from. Governor Martinez is not saying she won't committ, only that she prefers all options on the federal level be exhausted before the state steps in. I can't speak to much for Kansas but only for New Mexico.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

Other states to the west may be willing to join Colorado in an attempt to expand Amtrak passenger rail service, according to a federal study.

The Federal Railroad Administration last week released the Southwest Multi-State Rail Planning Study. It includes a schematic that links Colorado with routes in Arizona, California, Nevada, New Mexico and Utah.

The report stresses the future importance of rail in connecting midsized cities to larger metropolises and an anticipated rise in Amtrak ridership by 2050.

“I do think that over time, after we pass the turning point on the Southwest Chief, that we will be looking at Front Range rail,” said Sal Pace, chairman of Colorado’s Southwest Chief Commission.

- See more at: http://www.chieftain.com/mobile/msearch/2995318-123/rail-colorado-amtrak-chief#sthash.nw06nifL.dpuf

 

[TVRM610]

The studies also shown that the Southwest Chief is better served on Raton than Clovis due to the findings by an outside company who has experience in these matters. A final decision in regards to funding will be made during or after the 2015 legislation which starts in January.

Well when you put it that way, clearly the Chief MUST stay on the current route.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Sorry I missed the post about severance tax bonds and taxes on corporations in New Mexico!

With a Republican Governor opposed to rail in New Mexico ( you could look it up!) and a right wing legislature lots of luck in getting the lege to pass this! Kansas is even worse, they're the Poster Child for ineffective Government by know nothing T- Party stooges!

As I asked, please show us the money and name the Politicians in New Mexico Kansas ( and Washington for that matter!) that are going to fund this!!

Press releases are easy, appropriations are hard!!!

 

[me_little_me]

Questions:

With all this government money, would BNSF still own the track?

Would Amtrak have to keep paying BNSF to use the track?

Would it be economical for the states to buy that section then rip off BNSF if and when they want to use it again?

If Amtrak went to the Transcon, what would BNSF do with the old route? Abandon it? If so, is it considered worthless or worth very little?

 

[Chey]

Why do I have the feeling that Boardman wants to shut this line down?

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

Why do I have the feeling that Boardman wants to shut this line down?

Boardman & Amtrak met with the communities & citizens the Chief serves and runs through. Boardman is open to any and all ideas on how to keep Raton Pass operational for the Chief. BNSF have said they view Raton pass As a relief valve for the Amarillo line. BNSF's contract states that they will maintain it as needed per agreement and if Amtrak seeks higherspeeds, amtrak has to foot in the bill.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

Questions:

With all this government money, would BNSF still own the track?

Would Amtrak have to keep paying BNSF to use the track?

Would it be economical for the states to buy that section then rip off BNSF if and when they want to use it again?

If Amtrak went to the Transcon, what would BNSF do with the old route? Abandon it? If so, is it considered worthless or worth very little?

1. That question has been asked by the NM Transportation Committee I do not have an answer to your question just yet....I'll keep you posted.

2. Yes, it would be a one of a kind partnership with both companies and the states.

3. The idea has been pitched but I've heard none of the states are interested at this time.

4. BNSF has said they currently have no plans for abandonment of Raton Pass but see it as a relief valve for the Transcon if needed.if NM decides to extend NMRX service to Raton in the near future....any plans for adandonment goes out the window and the talks to re purchase Raton Pass begin.

 

[nmrxabqfan101]

For all you foamers Governor Susana Martinez is NOT AGAINST Amtrak or NMRX, she views Amtrak as a federal agency that should be funded Federally. She never said New Mexico would not help out.....she aid she believes and feels that congress should be addressing the Southwest Chief issue. Boardman was asked how he feels about the governors remarks he agrees with her to a certain degree. Boardmanlooks at this problem as a way to strengthen there relationship with New Mexico and She should he open to any and all ideas pitched during an interview with a local radio station. If Susana Martinez was against Rail she would not have kept NMRX running. She views NMRX as a state tool that can better be used if managed properly. She ordered the recent state studies back in Spring 2014 to find out exactly how much the cost will be if New Mexico helped out. NMDOT Transportation Secretary said "Martinez knows how important this train is and has been working with Amtrak, BNSF, KS, and CO to see what options are available. The SWC commission in Colorado has been working with her office along with DOT's from all states.