Amtrak Proposed New Routes (in 2001)

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This is actually part of why the Front Range screams out so badly: It would link Colorado Springs, Boulder, etc. to the Zephyr at Denver (CHI-DEN is already over 10% of the Zephyr's market, and DEN makes up about 1/3 of the boardings/alightings on the Zephyr's route), and I'd be surprised if you couldn't generate another 30,000-40,000 with decent connectivity. Salt Lake City probably should generate a bit more business, but the timing there is just plain awful, and timing SLC well is just about mutually exclusive with a good timing in Denver and a good timing in Chicago. You just can't make all three work out well.

Another example is MSP on the Builder's route, and Texas suffers from this problem pretty broadly as well. I'm also going to hazard a guess that there are some links that could be managed with the Silver Service, etc. I think I could probably rattle off a half-dozen areas that would strongly benefit from either an Amtrak connection or a commuter line connection to the longer-distance system.
 
New routes / corridor services by 2015:

-Chicago to Quad Cities

-Chicago to Dubuque

-Downeaster extension to Brunswick, ME

-NE Regional extension to Norfolk, VA south of the James River.

-Reroute of the Vermonter to the CT River corridor in central MA with several NHV-SPG shuttles extended north to Greenfield

In the possible category:

-FEC on the east cost of FL with a split Silver Star and a daily Miami to Jacksonville service

-extension of the Vermonter to Montreal

-in the advanced planning/early construction phases, extension of NE Regional service to Roanoke VA but not running yet.

-Coast Daylight in California

-extension of the Ethan Allen to Burlington if funding can be found.

-Chicago to Twin Cities corridor service

Any other possible (realistic) new corridors or service extensions by 2015/2016 that I have not thought of? Of course, we will see upgrades and trip time improvements to CHI-STL, CHI-DET, Cascades, California corridors, NC, Empire corridor, Springfield & Keystone East corridors, NEC by then, but those are all over existing routes.
If by possible is meant routes that are actually getting some serious consideration by the states, there are a few. I would not call all of these likely, but at least with some possibility of moving forward. Just out of the top of my head:

LA-SF High Speed Rail - it is still alive, and at least part of the system will probably be built. The full one: :eek:hboy:

Northern Lights Express MSP-Superior

BOS-Montreal via Springfield/Vermonter route.

LA-Coachella Valley/Indio has seen a bit of movement, but UP resistance has to be overcome.

Heartland Corridor extension (I know NE will be a hard nut, but so far the planning process has been moving forward)

The privately funded Desert Xpress seems to be soldiering on too...

CO - front range corridor

TX - Austin-San Antonio

I know the latter (and maybe the CO service too?) is technically considered a commuter rail, but the length and a few other features makes it somewhat intercity-flawoured...

New York-Scranton-Binghamton - I have no idea if this has seen any movement to get onto the real drawing board, but it is three pretty rail friendly states.

Finally Quad Cities - Iowa City has not been decisively nixed yet, and there's a slim chance it still might go through. If it does and proves successful, an extension to Des Moines is then not unlikely a few years later on.

On top of this the High Speed and stimulus funds did give quite a few grants for various preliminary studies. Whether any of these will gain any traction when finished is anybody's guess. At least it will need a new round of federal spending to get the actual projects going.
 
Planning for the Florida FEC routing is still ongoing and we may actually see this within the next few years. Planning, funding and starting new passenger train routes takes years.
Not the number of years it's already taken. If they started tomorrow it would have taken too long. New Mexico started an 97 mile commuter line with nearly 30 miles of brand new track (almost unheard of these days for a class 1) making 79 mph in less time it has taken Amtrak to get the FEC to negotiate liability.

Crescent Star: Great idea. Would have run almost entirely on KCS trackage. Rumor was KSC was very agreeable to running pax trains. Every have trackage rights all the way into deep Mexico, so I wonder if the Aztec Eagle and Crescent Star were both based on KCS hosting. If Aztec Eagle was to be stand alone, probably ought not have Eagle in the name...
 
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I'm not surprised that the Crescent extension to Dallas was never implemented. At an average speed of 50 mph -- typical for Amtrak LD trains -- it takes 10 hours to run Meridian-Dallas. Assuming the schedule of 19/20 remains the same, the westbound train to Dallas would arrive after midnight, and the eastbound train would have to depart Dallas at about midnight. Those aren't attractive train times, and the equipment would sit for 24 hours in Dallas. Also, Shreveport and Jackson are the only two cities of more than 250,000 along the line.

Simply stated, there are better ways for Amtrak to use its equipment and available operating money than extending the Crescent to Dallas.
 
If by possible is meant routes that are actually getting some serious consideration by the states, there are a few. I would not call all of these likely, but at least with some possibility of moving forward. Just out of the top of my head:

LA-SF High Speed Rail - it is still alive, and at least part of the system will probably be built. The full one: :eek:hboy:

Northern Lights Express MSP-Superior

BOS-Montreal via Springfield/Vermonter route.

LA-Coachella Valley/Indio has seen a bit of movement, but UP resistance has to be overcome.

Heartland Corridor extension (I know NE will be a hard nut, but so far the planning process has been moving forward)

The privately funded Desert Xpress seems to be soldiering on too...
I was looking at Amtrak corridor services that will be and might be started within 4 to 5 years. The crystal ball gets very cloudy for 10 years out. Given the reality of lead time for planning, EIS, lining up the funding, if the plans and support are not far along, the service won't start in 5 years. The CA HSR and DesertXpress proposed systems are true HSR and would very likely operate separately from Amtrak. Besides the CA HSR central valley section will be under construction in 5 years if nothing stops it, but is likely 8-10 years away from any service. DesertXpress is the wild card, since they are a private company and thus can build more quickly, has jumped through the many hoops of federal & state approval, they could actually be running by the end of 2016.

-Northern Lights Express in MN: received federal funding this year for engineering and environmental studies. Don't know how much work is needed and what it will cost to start the service. Strikes me as unlikely within 5 years. If federal funding is available, then within 10 years is a better bet.

-Boston to Montreal: I think this can happen, but if it depends on double track restoration and track upgrades from BOS to Springfield, AND new single level coach cars, hard to see it happening in 5 years.

-LA to Coachella valley/Palm Springs: a $400K study is supposed to start soon for this possible corridor. If UP's demand are reasonable and the main work to be done is to build new stations, could happen in 5 years, but also is likely to have to wait until CA gets all the new bi-level cars delivered.

CO - front range corridor

TX - Austin-San Antonio

I know the latter (and maybe the CO service too?) is technically considered a commuter rail, but the length and a few other features makes it somewhat intercity-flawoured...
There are commuter and longer range commuter corridors that can benefit Amtrak, in much the same way as Amtrak operated state supported corridor services. SunRail in Orlando and central FL will fix up 61 miles of track with restoration of double tracking and renovation of the Amtrak stations on the route. The Silver Star and Meteor could see ridership increases due to SunRail.

New York-Scranton-Binghamton - I have no idea if this has seen any movement to get onto the real drawing board, but it is three pretty rail friendly states.

Finally Quad Cities - Iowa City has not been decisively nixed yet, and there's a slim chance it still might go through. If it does and proves successful, an extension to Des Moines is then not unlikely a few years later on.

On top of this the High Speed and stimulus funds did give quite a few grants for various preliminary studies. Whether any of these will gain any traction when finished is anybody's guess. At least it will need a new round of federal spending to get the actual projects going.
-New York-Scranton-Binghamton: I think NY's and PA's attention are focused elsewhere. NY state on the Empire corridor, PA on the Keystone Corridor. I suspect plans for restoration of service over the Lackawanna cutoff will sit on the back burner until upgrades to the Empire and Keystone corridors are much further along.

-Extension from Quad Cities to Iowa City and then Des Moines: I don't think this is dead at all in the longer run. With the funding in place for Chicago to Quad Cities and to buy the rolling stock, the barriers to extension to Iowa Cities will be much lower. Even if the current Governor & legislature squash the project, once the service starts to Quad Cities and if it is seen as successful, then extending the trains further into Iowa will get increasing political support.

All those grants for feasibility and engineering studies will help lay the foundation for future expansions. I look at the studies as similar to planting seeds. Some won't grow and won't lead to anything. But some will and eventually lead to new corridors getting started.
 
New York-Scranton-Binghamton - I have no idea if this has seen any movement to get onto the real drawing board, but it is three pretty rail friendly states.
-New York-Scranton-Binghamton: I think NY's and PA's attention are focused elsewhere. NY state on the Empire corridor, PA on the Keystone Corridor. I suspect plans for restoration of service over the Lackawanna cutoff will sit on the back burner until upgrades to the Empire and Keystone corridors are much further along.
Amtrak is not doing much of anything on this front and while certain Congressmen occasionally make waves with some news stories, nothing serious is happening at the Federal level on this.

That said, the State of New Jersey has actually started work on restoring the first 7.3 miles of track on the Lackawana Cutoff. What they're working on isn't even half the track needed to reach PA and to my knowledge NJ & PA still have not worked out any operating agreements for who pays what & how much.

But still some progress is underway for the first time in years towards restoring this valuable connection. In fact both rail & ties have been seen headed for the cutoff recently. :)
 
Amtrak is not doing much of anything on this front and while certain Congressmen occasionally make waves with some news stories, nothing serious is happening at the Federal level on this.

That said, the State of New Jersey has actually started work on restoring the first 7.3 miles of track on the Lackawana Cutoff. What they're working on isn't even half the track needed to reach PA and to my knowledge NJ & PA still have not worked out any operating agreements for who pays what & how much.

But still some progress is underway for the first time in years towards restoring this valuable connection. In fact both rail & ties have been seen headed for the cutoff recently. :)
The prospects of restoration of service over the cutoff to Scranton and Binghamton probably qualifies then, as being on the far-back burner and the burner is just barely on.

VA is actively working on Amtrak service to Norfolk, south of the river. I figure once that is done, VA will actively pursue extension of service from Lynchburg to Roanoke and perhaps to Christianburg. Which will mean that all the major population centers of Virgina will have Amtrak service. I should look up the city populations for New England and the Mid-Atlantic states to see which would then be the largest remaining cities in those states that have no Amtrak or passenger rail service at all. Allentown, Scranton-Wilkes Barre, Binghamton NY would be high up on the list.
 
Amtrak is not doing much of anything on this front and while certain Congressmen occasionally make waves with some news stories, nothing serious is happening at the Federal level on this.

That said, the State of New Jersey has actually started work on restoring the first 7.3 miles of track on the Lackawana Cutoff. What they're working on isn't even half the track needed to reach PA and to my knowledge NJ & PA still have not worked out any operating agreements for who pays what & how much.

But still some progress is underway for the first time in years towards restoring this valuable connection. In fact both rail & ties have been seen headed for the cutoff recently. :)
The prospects of restoration of service over the cutoff to Scranton and Binghamton probably qualifies then, as being on the far-back burner and the burner is just barely on.

VA is actively working on Amtrak service to Norfolk, south of the river. I figure once that is done, VA will actively pursue extension of service from Lynchburg to Roanoke and perhaps to Christianburg. Which will mean that all the major population centers of Virgina will have Amtrak service. I should look up the city populations for New England and the Mid-Atlantic states to see which would then be the largest remaining cities in those states that have no Amtrak or passenger rail service at all. Allentown, Scranton-Wilkes Barre, Binghamton NY would be high up on the list.
I'd like to see three lists. One would be "No Amtrak, no Thruway"; one would be "No Amtrak, but with Thruway", and one would be "Amtrak no more than twice daily". #1 is totally ignored markets, #2 is not-quite-ignored markets (or, in the case of Roanoke, markets that Amtrak is slowly moving into), and #3 is markets that are tapped slightly, but that Amtrak is probably going to have trouble getting a large market share in.
 
-The Aztec Eagle never really made sense from what I can tell, and most of these lines were aimed at picking up freight contracts ...
AMTRAK used to run the TE to Laredo, with connecting service into Mexico. I think this service would still do fine, passenger wise, even without connecting train service. There is a constant parade of Mexico-bound buses on I35. A few more coach cars, and this service could work.
I don't think that either the pre-Amtrak MoPac/T&P incarnation or the Amtrak incarnation of the Texas Eagle ever ran to Laredo. It was the Amtrak Inter-American that ran to Laredo. Between 1973 and 1981, it ran variously between Laredo and Fort Worth, St. Louis and Chicago, either tri-weekly or daily. In 1981 cuts it went away and was replaced by a tri-weekly Chicago - San Antonio Eagle which later became the Texas Eagle.
 
If by possible is meant routes that are actually getting some serious consideration by the states, there are a few. I would not call all of these likely, but at least with some possibility of moving forward. Just out of the top of my head:

LA-SF High Speed Rail - it is still alive, and at least part of the system will probably be built. The full one: :eek:hboy:

Northern Lights Express MSP-Superior

BOS-Montreal via Springfield/Vermonter route.

LA-Coachella Valley/Indio has seen a bit of movement, but UP resistance has to be overcome.

Heartland Corridor extension (I know NE will be a hard nut, but so far the planning process has been moving forward)

The privately funded Desert Xpress seems to be soldiering on too...
I was looking at Amtrak corridor services that will be and might be started within 4 to 5 years. The crystal ball gets very cloudy for 10 years out. Given the reality of lead time for planning, EIS, lining up the funding, if the plans and support are not far along, the service won't start in 5 years. The CA HSR and DesertXpress proposed systems are true HSR and would very likely operate separately from Amtrak. Besides the CA HSR central valley section will be under construction in 5 years if nothing stops it, but is likely 8-10 years away from any service. DesertXpress is the wild card, since they are a private company and thus can build more quickly, has jumped through the many hoops of federal & state approval, they could actually be running by the end of 2016.

-Northern Lights Express in MN: received federal funding this year for engineering and environmental studies. Don't know how much work is needed and what it will cost to start the service. Strikes me as unlikely within 5 years. If federal funding is available, then within 10 years is a better bet.

-Boston to Montreal: I think this can happen, but if it depends on double track restoration and track upgrades from BOS to Springfield, AND new single level coach cars, hard to see it happening in 5 years.

-LA to Coachella valley/Palm Springs: a $400K study is supposed to start soon for this possible corridor. If UP's demand are reasonable and the main work to be done is to build new stations, could happen in 5 years, but also is likely to have to wait until CA gets all the new bi-level cars delivered.

CO - front range corridor

TX - Austin-San Antonio

I know the latter (and maybe the CO service too?) is technically considered a commuter rail, but the length and a few other features makes it somewhat intercity-flawoured...
There are commuter and longer range commuter corridors that can benefit Amtrak, in much the same way as Amtrak operated state supported corridor services. SunRail in Orlando and central FL will fix up 61 miles of track with restoration of double tracking and renovation of the Amtrak stations on the route. The Silver Star and Meteor could see ridership increases due to SunRail.

New York-Scranton-Binghamton - I have no idea if this has seen any movement to get onto the real drawing board, but it is three pretty rail friendly states.

Finally Quad Cities - Iowa City has not been decisively nixed yet, and there's a slim chance it still might go through. If it does and proves successful, an extension to Des Moines is then not unlikely a few years later on.

On top of this the High Speed and stimulus funds did give quite a few grants for various preliminary studies. Whether any of these will gain any traction when finished is anybody's guess. At least it will need a new round of federal spending to get the actual projects going.
-New York-Scranton-Binghamton: I think NY's and PA's attention are focused elsewhere. NY state on the Empire corridor, PA on the Keystone Corridor. I suspect plans for restoration of service over the Lackawanna cutoff will sit on the back burner until upgrades to the Empire and Keystone corridors are much further along.

-Extension from Quad Cities to Iowa City and then Des Moines: I don't think this is dead at all in the longer run. With the funding in place for Chicago to Quad Cities and to buy the rolling stock, the barriers to extension to Iowa Cities will be much lower. Even if the current Governor & legislature squash the project, once the service starts to Quad Cities and if it is seen as successful, then extending the trains further into Iowa will get increasing political support.

All those grants for feasibility and engineering studies will help lay the foundation for future expansions. I look at the studies as similar to planting seeds. Some won't grow and won't lead to anything. But some will and eventually lead to new corridors getting started.
True none of these will be up in 5 years. I was simply trying to identify a couple of the ones, that seem to be moving down the pipeline. It is sometimes hard to tell from the discussion in here which are merely somebodys favorite idea, which are feasability studies forever collecting dust in a drawer and which are projects that actually have some traction. So by the list I meant routes that could be well on the way in 5 years time - not up an running.

Thanks for the updates on the various routes. :hi:
 
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-The Aztec Eagle never really made sense from what I can tell, and most of these lines were aimed at picking up freight contracts ...
AMTRAK used to run the TE to Laredo, with connecting service into Mexico. I think this service would still do fine, passenger wise, even without connecting train service. There is a constant parade of Mexico-bound buses on I35. A few more coach cars, and this service could work.
I don't think that either the pre-Amtrak MoPac/T&P incarnation or the Amtrak incarnation of the Texas Eagle ever ran to Laredo. It was the Amtrak Inter-American that ran to Laredo. Between 1973 and 1981, it ran variously between Laredo and Fort Worth, St. Louis and Chicago, either tri-weekly or daily. In 1981 cuts it went away and was replaced by a tri-weekly Chicago - San Antonio Eagle which later became the Texas Eagle.
Slight correction jis! In 1968 I rode the Mopac Eagle from San Antonio to Laredo (Coach/ $8), crossed the Rio Grande (Rio Bravo in Mexico) via Taxi9$3) to the Nuevo Laredo Estacion de Ferrocarril and caught the Aztec Eagle (old MP equippment mixed with N de M stuff)to Mexico City in a Sleeper for the Grand sum of $28 :wub: !!!You are correct that Amtrak never ran the Texas Eagle to Laredo!
 
-The Aztec Eagle never really made sense from what I can tell, and most of these lines were aimed at picking up freight contracts ...
AMTRAK used to run the TE to Laredo, with connecting service into Mexico. I think this service would still do fine, passenger wise, even without connecting train service. There is a constant parade of Mexico-bound buses on I35. A few more coach cars, and this service could work.
I don't think that either the pre-Amtrak MoPac/T&P incarnation or the Amtrak incarnation of the Texas Eagle ever ran to Laredo. It was the Amtrak Inter-American that ran to Laredo. Between 1973 and 1981, it ran variously between Laredo and Fort Worth, St. Louis and Chicago, either tri-weekly or daily. In 1981 cuts it went away and was replaced by a tri-weekly Chicago - San Antonio Eagle which later became the Texas Eagle.
Slight correction jis! In 1968 I rode the Mopac Eagle from San Antonio to Laredo (Coach/ $8), crossed the Rio Grande (Rio Bravo in Mexico) via Taxi/$3 to the Nuevo Laredo Estacion de Ferrocarril and caught the Aztec Eagle (old MP equippment mixed with N de M stuff)to Mexico City in a Sleeper for the Grand sum of $28 :wub: !!!You are correct that Amtrak never ran the Texas Eagle to Laredo! At one time there were sleepers that were cut out and ferried across the River and connected to the Aztec Eagle and Vice-versa but dont know when that stopped???the 50s would be a good guess??? :help: )
 
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I wonder what route the proposed overnight "Twilight Limited" would have used across Ontario from Detroit to Buffalo? From the map it appears to be the exConrail/Penn Central/NYC route but sections of that route were already out of service and subject to abandonment. Or: would it have been a combination of the International and Maple Leaf routes meeting at Aldershot (Hamilton)

 

http://web.archive.org/web/200012051938/http://www.amtrak.com/news/pr/twilight.html
 
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That seems possible...there's also a VIA route from Toronto to Windsor, though I'm not sure where the link from the Maple Leaf route would hit that (if it was somewhere other than Aldershot), since the International went to Port Huron, not Detroit/Dearborn. By the way, what was the route that the Niagara Rainbow used?
 
That seems possible...there's also a VIA route from Toronto to Windsor, though I'm not sure where the link from the Maple Leaf route would hit that (if it was somewhere other than Aldershot), since the International went to Port Huron, not Detroit/Dearborn. By the way, what was the route that the Niagara Rainbow used?
There are a couple of routes from Detroit/Windsor to a jct with the International route just west of London......then onto Aldershot and into the US at Niagara or Buffalo.

 

http://www.proximityissues.ca/Maps/RAC-2004-ON_sub.pdf
 
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