Amtrak gets $185 million for Hudson Yards box tunnel in NYC

[afigg]

There was a press conference on May 30 to announce that Amtrak would be getting $185 million from the Sandy relief funds to build the box tunnel under the Hudson Yards development project to protect a corridor for 2 new tunnels under the Hudson. LaHood, Senator Schumer, Amtrak board chairman were on hand. One local news article with a couple of photos: LaHood Announces Major Investment In Gateway Rail Tunnel Project.

That Senator Schumer was on hand is a good sign for heavyweight political support in the Senate for the Gateway project. Of course, Schumer is not shy about attending press conferences, but it does matter. All in all, a nice going away present from LaHood to Amtrak to get the funds committed to at least get the box tunnel taken care of. Now, only if LaHood could find $500 or $600 million in the DOT couch somewhere or uncommitted funds that are sitting unused in accounts to re-direct to the North Portal bridge project, that would be a really nice last act as Transportation Secretary. I expect Foxx will get confirmed in the next few weeks.

I'll have to look at the FY2014 budget request justification and FY13-FY17 Five year financial plan documents that were posted late last week to the Amtrak website to see if Amtrak was already counting on getting the $185 million in FY13.

 

[afigg]

Amtrak issued a news release on the Hudson Yards box tunnel funding announcement. What I find interesting is the use of the phrase "two desperately-needed, flood-resistant tunnels". Not taking the low key approach to try to get the funding from Congress and get NJ & NY agencies on board.

Text of the news release:

WASHINGTON Tony Coscia, Chairman of the Amtrak Board of Directors, issued the following statement in response to U.S. Senator Charles E. Schumer, U.S. Senator Frank Lautenberg and U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHoods announcement to provide the critical first step to pave the way for two desperately-needed, flood-resistant tunnels under the Hudson River:
The federal funding announced today makes it possible to Amtrak to begin construction this summer on a project to preserve a pathway for two new rail tunnels into New York that are critical for the future mobility and economic growth of the entire Northeast region. This project to build an 800-foot concrete casing through the Hudson Yards commercial development property will protect the only viable right-of-way for connecting the tunnels to the existing tracks and platforms at Penn Station, New York.

The new tunnels are one element of the Amtrak Gateway Program to increase rail infrastructure capacity between Newark, N.J., and Penn Station, New York. By eliminating this bottleneck into New York City, which today is the Northeast Corridor's most congested segment, the Gateway Program will increase resiliency against severe weather events, add redundancy and reliability for Amtrak and New Jersey Transit's shared operations, and provide additional capacity for the future increases in commuter, intercity and high-speed rail service.

 

[Nathanael]

Good news. My only disappointment is that the plans do not make any room for a double-tracked Empire Corridor, which is going to be a severe long-term restriction. (Though I am suspicious that in the long run, Hudson River flooding will mean that the Upper Harlem Line will need to replace the Hudson Line, so perhaps it won't matter.)

 

[AlanB]

Good news. My only disappointment is that the plans do not make any room for a double-tracked Empire Corridor, which is going to be a severe long-term restriction. (Though I am suspicious that in the long run, Hudson River flooding will mean that the Upper Harlem Line will need to replace the Hudson Line, so perhaps it won't matter.)

The Empire connection is single tracked for just ever so slightly over 1 mile and will never see the same volume that the North River tunnels see. The double track section on the NEC is just about 4 miles long in comparison.

So I'm not too worried about the lack of plans for double tracking that final mile of the Empire corridor.

 

[Nathanael]

The Empire connection is single tracked for just ever so slightly over 1 mile and will never see the same volume that the North River tunnels see.

...because the commuter trains go to GCT, whereas all the commuter trains from New Jersey run through the North River Tunnels. Right. Of course. I wasn't thinking about that.

 

[AlanB]

The Empire connection is single tracked for just ever so slightly over 1 mile and will never see the same volume that the North River tunnels see.

...because the commuter trains go to GCT, whereas all the commuter trains from New Jersey run through the North River Tunnels. Right. Of course. I wasn't thinking about that.

Correct!

Although there are dreams of sending at least a few Hudson line trains down to NYP after East Side Access permits the LIRR to send trains to GCT instead of NYP. But even then, the volume will still not approach what NJT currently puts into NYP and will need to move into NYP in the coming years.

 

[Andrew]

The Empire connection is single tracked for just ever so slightly over 1 mile and will never see the same volume that the North River tunnels see.

...because the commuter trains go to GCT, whereas all the commuter trains from New Jersey run through the North River Tunnels. Right. Of course. I wasn't thinking about that.

Correct!

Although there are dreams of sending at least a few Hudson line trains down to NYP after East Side Access permits the LIRR to send trains to GCT instead of NYP. But even then, the volume will still not approach what NJT currently puts into NYP and will need to move into NYP in the coming years.

Will more Hudson Line Trains mean fewer trains to New Jersey? How many Hudson Line Trains will operate during Peak Hours into Penn Station?

 

[AlanB]

The Empire connection is single tracked for just ever so slightly over 1 mile and will never see the same volume that the North River tunnels see.

...because the commuter trains go to GCT, whereas all the commuter trains from New Jersey run through the North River Tunnels. Right. Of course. I wasn't thinking about that.

Correct!

Although there are dreams of sending at least a few Hudson line trains down to NYP after East Side Access permits the LIRR to send trains to GCT instead of NYP. But even then, the volume will still not approach what NJT currently puts into NYP and will need to move into NYP in the coming years.

Will more Hudson Line Trains mean fewer trains to New Jersey? How many Hudson Line Trains will operate during Peak Hours into Penn Station?

No, Hudson line trains if this were to actually happen, would take slots currently used by the LIRR as the LIRR diverts some trains to Grand Central.

 

[jis]

As for double tracking that last bit of the Empire Connection, I believe there is an easement that is protected for a second track to be built connecting into the West Side Yard leads.

Indeed, if MNRR is to meaningfully use any LIRR slots which are all on the north side of the complex without gumming up A interlocking, such a track would be required.

But fortunately if all they are talking of is at most 2tph, that I believe can be absorbed in the tracks currently reachable from the Empire Connection, and would really not be using any LIRR slots directly.

 

[Andrew]

What is the likelihood that SEVERAL years go by between completion of the tunnel boxes and the beginning of construction segments of other sections of the Gateway Projects, such as the trans-hudson section?

 

[AlanB]

As for double tracking that last bit of the Empire Connection, I believe there is an easement that is protected for a second track to be built connecting into the West Side Yard leads.

Too bad that connection wasn't in place for Sandy!

 

[jis]

The likelihood that any tunnel construction other than the box will happen before 2017 or so is slim to none.

(null)

 

[afigg]

What is the likelihood that SEVERAL years go by between completion of the tunnel boxes and the beginning of construction segments of other sections of the Gateway Projects, such as the trans-hudson section?

The box tunnel is projected to be completed in 2015. It is being done as a rush job in terms of the environmental review, design, approval process, and funding compared to most big projects these days. There are years of studies, engineering design, public outreach, and getting the funding & approvals prior to starting construction.
The recently released FY2013 to FY2017 Five Year Financial plan has a start date on construction of 2017 and that is very optimisitics. The five year has the following on timelne and Cost, and the urgency on the Hudson Yards box tunnel:

Timeline and CostAmtrak projects that the first two phases of the Gateway Program could be completed in approximately 12 years, under a best case scenario, at a preliminary cost estimate of approximately $15 billion (in constant 2011 dollars). If funding is available to begin preliminary engineering and environmental review in FY2013, in coordination with the Federal Railroad Administrations NEC FUTURE Tier 1 PEIS, and construction funds are available to permit tunnel construction in the Hudson Yards development site, it is estimated that the Program could be completed in 2025, with the significant construction period beginning in 2017, assuming unconstrained funding. Further refinement of these costs and schedules will be available upon completion of additional planning and preliminary engineering and design work.

Project Phases and Total Cost Estimates:

Phase One Newark, NJ to Penn Station, New York, 2013-2025, ~$12.5 Billion: Construct new two-track mainline and Hudson River tunnels from Swift Interlocking to Penn Station and improve existing NEC mainline and tunnel infrastructure.

Phase Two Penn Station Expansion and Elizabeth-Newark Improvements, 2017-2025,~ $2.5 billion: Expand Penn Station to Block 780 to create the upper-level concourse of Penn South and add a 5th track from Elizabeth to Newark, New Jersey to provide increased capacity to access new Gateway trackage and capacity.

Phase Three Penn South Expansion: Expand Penn South through the addition of the lower-level concourse and tunnel connections to Gateway Tunnels at 12th Avenue.

New Urgency Connecting to Penn Station through the Hudson Yards

The Gateway Program has taken on new urgency in recent months, as engineers have determined the only feasible route to connect the Gateway Tunnel directly to Penn Station will intersect the Hudson Yards development over the Long Island Rail Roads West Side Yards, where Related Companies is breaking ground on a multi-billion dollar, mixed-use commercial and residential development project. Amtrak is working with Related Companies and the Long Island Rail Road, which owns the maintenance yards (which are also impacted by the development project and tunnel) to design and begin construction of an 800-foot structure to secure a right of way for a future Gateway Tunnel through the site, which lies between 11th and 12th Avenues and 31st and 32nd Streets in Manhattan. Amtrak is seeking approximately $185 million in FY2013 to cover the costs of completed design and construction of this project. Design efforts are currently underway and construction will begin in summer 2013, with a planned completion in FY2016.

 

[Andrew]

As part of Penn South Phase 1, is the lower level concourse that same one that is right above the tracks, or is Amtrak referring to one that will be BELOW the current tracks? As far as I know, there are two levels of concourses in Penn Station, and it is unclear from the document what exactly the lower level concourse is being referred to.

 

[railiner]

As for double tracking that last bit of the Empire Connection, I believe there is an easement that is protected for a second track to be built connecting into the West Side Yard leads.
Indeed, if MNRR is to meaningfully use any LIRR slots which are all on the north side of the complex without gumming up A interlocking, such a track would be required.

But fortunately if all they are talking of is at most 2tph, that I believe can be absorbed in the tracks currently reachable from the Empire Connection, and would really not be using any LIRR slots directly.

As for double tracking that last bit of the Empire Connection, I believe there is an easement that is protected for a second track to be built connecting into the West Side Yard leads.

Too bad that connection wasn't in place for Sandy!

I still wonder why they did not build a connection to the Empire Line utilizing the West Side Yard leads, rather than building that elaborate tunnel...surely they could have ran the Empire trains into the higher numbered NYP tracks to avoid too much crossing over....

 

[jis]

The high number platforms belong to LIRR. Trains coming in that way would have had to cross the LIRR flow to get to an Amtrak platform. That would have had adverse impact on capacity of the station.

 

[jis]

As part of Penn South Phase 1, is the lower level concourse that same one that is right above the tracks, or is Amtrak referring to one that will be BELOW the current tracks? As far as I know, there are two levels of concourses in Penn Station, and it is unclear from the document what exactly the lower level concourse is being referred to.

No, the Block 780 or Penn Station South lower level concourse is at least 50 or more feet below the current Penn Station track level, and the track level for the upper level concourse and tracks of Penn Station South. The entire lower level is far enough below the current station that the whole thing can be constructed by boring, without impacting anything on the surface or the upper level concourse of Penn Station South. This last piece of information is from the proverbial horse's mouth in response to a specific question I asked Drew Galloway of Amtrak during his presentation at the TransAction Conference in April.

 

[Andrew]

Are you saying that from the top to bottom, the future integrated Penn South train station will go like this:

--top mezzanine

--lower mezzanine

--expanded commuter rail/NJ Transit tracks and platforms,

THEN

--Lower High Speed Rail Concourse

--High Speed Rail Platforms and Tracks??

Also, what else did Drew Galloway mention about the Gateway Program/engineering?

 

[afigg]

Are you saying that from the top to bottom, the future integrated Penn South train station will go like this:
--top mezzanine

--lower mezzanine

--expanded commuter rail/NJ Transit tracks and platforms,

THEN

--Lower High Speed Rail Concourse

--High Speed Rail Platforms and Tracks??

There is a copy of a March 2013 Amtrak Gateway program viewgraph presentation to the Raritan Valley Rail Coalition at the link. Pages 19 to 21 show the renderings of the concepts for the Penn Station upper and lower level concourses. The upper level concourse in this drawing looks to have one mezzanine level above the 6 stub tracks with wide platforms. The lower level concourse for the 6 HSR through trains would be accessible from the upper level mezzanine, but looks to have another level above the deep tracks of its own. These are still early concept and engineering design drawings, subject to change.

The huge improvement in access to the Penn South upper level concourse is that the current lower level corridors at NYP would be extended under the street directly to the Penn South concourse. From the viewpoint of the NJ Transit commuters (and Amtrak if they use the new tracks), they would just walk south from the boarding/waiting corridors to the escalators leading down to the new platform and tracks. Would simply be a new part of NYP to them. Compare that to the ARC plans for a deep station 1 block north of NYP which would have required a long walk and then deep elevators or long escalator trips to reach. The critical aspect of the design for Penn South and the new Hudson tunnels would be to leave space for the lower level South concourse for the tunnels and platforms and access points to be dug out in the future.

The next critical steps for Amtrak are to; 1) get the funding lined up to build the fixed span North Portal bridge, 2) get the funding for the preliminary engineering, environmental studies (DEIS and FEIS), design, public outreach, close coordination with all the other agencies, and get the formal approvals from all those who have to sign off on a project this big for components of the Gateway project, and then 3) get the funding in place to proceed with construction for the key components Gateway project. Will be difficult.

 

[Andrew]

1. If I am reading this correctly, though, there will still be TWO levels between the new NJ Transit/platforms and the street? (I had called two levels "mezzanines," but it seems that top most level below the street is a concourse".)

2. Since this is a federal project, what is the probability that the fed's will pay for the entire cost?

3. Also, had can Amtrak expedite the environmental/regulatory process, just as they did with the tunnel box?

 

[afigg]

2. Since this is a federal project, what is the probability that the fed's will pay for the entire cost?
3. Also, had can Amtrak expedite the environmental/regulatory process, just as they did with the tunnel box?

2. Zero. Big projects like Gateway get their funding from multiple sources, local, state and federal. Amtrak and the feds will be looking for NJ and the Port Authority to contribute to the Gateway project. Part of the reason for the Gateway Project is to improve capacity for NJ Transit, so NJ will be expected to kick in at least a billion or two.

The Port Authority was to contribute $3 billion, NJ Turnpike Authority $1.25 billion according to the ARC wikipedia entry.I thought NJ was contributing more, but NJ having to pay for cost overruns was the ostensible reason Gov. Chirstie canceled ARC. The PA and NJ funds have been re-allocated, so they would have to allocate new funds for Gateway. The Port Authority is dealing with staggering cost increases to $4 billion for the World Trade Center Transportation Center PATH station and other expensive projects, so PANYNJ may not be in a position to kick in $3 billion or more for Gateway in a few years.

The Penn South part of the project should be able to recoup a large part of its costs by selling the air rights for the entire block after the entire block is acquired and dug out for the new upper concourse and tracks with space carefully preserved for the lower level to be build at a future date. Prime Transit Oriented Development location to say the least.

3. Probably very difficult to expedite the entire project. The box tunnel is a 800' long structure to be built under a railyard and development project that is going to tear up the entire area already. Amtrak may be able to reuse some of the ARC studies and work, but will have to generate new DEIS and FEIS documents, do the engineering design, and get the approvals for the project.

 

[railiner]

The high number platforms belong to LIRR. Trains coming in that way would have had to cross the LIRR flow to get to an Amtrak platform. That would have had adverse impact on capacity of the station.

LIRR 'owns' tracks 17-21. They share tracks 15 and 16. I was thinking that they could have built the Empire Connection to somehow utilize the southmost WSY lead, and then have easy access to tracks 9-16, if possible.....

But anyway, if there is room for another tunnel to be built alongside the current one, that is a sufficient solution, after the fact...

 

[Andrew]

I saw that Amtrak uses previous ARC studies for the Swift Interlocking to Bergen Portal Segment...

As far as I know, the Port Authority is spending $7 billion rebuilding Ground Zero and replacing two bridges. (These three projects should be completed within the next few years). Therefore, suppose in a few years that an improved economy translates into more tax revenue. Would this be a more convincing way for the Port Authority to contribute to the Gateway Project? (Maybe the Port Authority could contribute 4 or 5 billion dollars)...

Also, it seems that Block 780 would have to be razed. How would Seven Penn Plaza get taken down since it is almost 20 stories tall?

Is it likely for Amtrak to bore tunnels from 11th avenue eastwards to the expanded Penn Station (so as to not raze the block)?

Finally, how could a Joint Venture impact the construction schedule?

 

[afigg]

As far as I know, the Port Authority is spending $7 billion rebuilding Ground Zero and replacing two bridges. (These three projects should be completed within the next few years). Therefore, suppose in a few years that an improved economy translates into more tax revenue. Would this be a more convincing way for the Port Authority to contribute to the Gateway Project? (Maybe the Port Authority could contribute 4 or 5 billion dollars)...
Also, it seems that Block 780 would have to be razed. How would Seven Penn Plaza get taken down since it is almost 20 stories tall?

Is it likely for Amtrak to bore tunnels from 11th avenue eastwards to the expanded Penn Station (so as to not raze the block)?

Depends on how much debt load the Port Authority has and how many other big budget projects on their agenda: expansion and upgrades at the big 3 airports, extending PATH to the Newark Airport station, post-Sandy flood mitigation, PATH upgrades, etc.

If the entire block has to be razed, NYC contractors have plenty of experience in tearing down highrises to build even taller high rises in the same spot. Implode the building or build construction crane towers next to the building and tear it down from the top. I do not see how they don't tear down the entire block to build Penn South; have to remove the support pilings and foundations for the buildings to make room for the new concourse, platforms, and tracks. They will probably have to clear out the NE corner of the block on 31th & 8th Ave to the west for the tracks and close 31st St for an extended period to dig out the passageways for the tracks and extended corridors from NYP.

Look at the track diagram map on page 18 of the Gateway viewgraph presentation. The tracks for the Penn South upper level concourse are at the same depth as the current NYP tracks, they will branch off under 31st street. The tunnels for the lower level HSR concourse (marked in blue) would branch off the tunnels emerging from the Hudson river at 12 Ave, go down 30 31 St, over the new No. 7 Line tunnels under 11th Ave, but presumably deep enough to avoid most or all of the utility pipes, lines, building foundations.

Amtrak will have to decouple the Penn South project from the overall Gateway project as a clearly defined separate phase. Penn South may indeed get built, but could be delayed for years in court, haggling over eminent domain and historical significance of the properties on the block. Build the new Hudson tunnels and tracks into NYP carefully preserving space and access to extend the tunnels and tracks to both levels of Penn South in the future.

 

[Andrew]

1. How long would it take to build Penn South? I have looked at the diagram. The orange section--which is the NJ Transit section--clearly has a concourse on top of the tracks. But I still can not see if a mezzanine will be located BETWEEN the new NJ Transit tracks and the concourse (which will be right below street level).

2. Would 31st between 8th and 9th avenue also have to be razed? (After all, tracks will have to be built from Penn South westwards to A Interlocking...