Therapy Animals

[sunchaser]

I'm not sure how Amtrak handles... but the paperwork I have where I work (can't remember where it was from but I'm sure it's somewhat official) says that service dogs are not required to be certified, and it is not legal to ask for certification or documents if told the animal is a "service animal." The only time that a business is allowed to request a "service animal" to leave, is if the animal creates a disturbance. Again.. that's my understanding based on what I've been taught where I work..

Please tell me the proper way to obtain papers to qualify my companion/therapy dog for travel on the train. Thanks

The only information on amtrak.com is listed here. I suggest you contact Amtrak directly at 1-800-USA-RAIL (1-800-872-7245) or TDD/TTY (1-800-523-6590). There is no information listed for companion/therapy animals, but I would still call & ask.

 

[jmbgeg]

What happens when my pet allergies conflict with a therapy animal. Just a question

I was on EB last year and a man had a dog he said alerted him to sesiures

was no problem

A reasonable accomodation granted to a traveler with a disability should not cause you adverse health effects (such as when you have a diagnosed allergy). I would start by discretely bringing the situation to the attention of the Conductor (or a service attendent). I am not sure in a transportation setting whether the protocol would be for them to try to relocate you (my guess is that would be the process) or the passenger with the service animal, but if the Amtrak staff has received the proper training they should be able to resolve the matter in a satisfactory manner.

 

[EB_OBS]

Service animals are individually trained to perform a specific task. I think the revisions that were planned for the ADA last January were put on hold unfortunately. Those revisions would have stated clearly that "farm animals and exotic animals" cannot be trained as service animals as well as that "therapy" AKA "comfort" animals are NOT service animals and thus not protected under the ADA. There were some good points to the revisions & clarifications. If anyone knows for sure whether or not any of the law was changed please post with links.

 

[EB_OBS]

In addition to the misinformation and outright abuse of the service animal section of the ADA, Amtrak does a pretty poor job of training it's personnel, specifically ticket agents on how to better identify those "comfort" animals and prevent them from being brought on the train. Persons with disabilities with legitimate service animals will not be denied transport on Amtrak.

 

[Lamar]

Three weeks ago, a woman brought a small service dog in a carrier on to the Heartland Flyer. She said it was to warn her about seizures. It made sound once when we were almost to OKC, but it was otherwise quiet. One woman on the train had some mumblings about it, but nobody else said anything.

As far as small animals in the cabin on commerical flights, it depends on the airline. My mom lived in Jamaica for two years and adopted a cat during that time. When she flew back home to Houston, she had to pay a fee for the cat and had to certify he had had his vaccinations. The vet gave him a tranquilizer, and he was quiet for the 3 1/2 hour flight. All that to say--you can't just show up with your cat, small dog, etc. on planes--you have to pay for them.

 

[jmbgeg]

Service animals are individually trained to perform a specific task. I think the revisions that were planned for the ADA last January were put on hold unfortunately. Those revisions would have stated clearly that "farm animals and exotic animals" cannot be trained as service animals as well as that "therapy" AKA "comfort" animals are NOT service animals and thus not protected under the ADA. There were some good points to the revisions & clarifications. If anyone knows for sure whether or not any of the law was changed please post with links.

I have a great deal of experience with service animals as a rental housing manager and manager of commercial and public buildings.

I do not often specificaly tell people they are wrong on facts on this board, but in this case I will.

-The regulatory agencies that enforce anti-discrimination laws do not hold that proof of training is a prerequisite to an animal qualifing and service animal, only that a health care provider certify that an individual qualifies per statue as disabled, and describes a particular type of animal as needed in connection with that remedy.

-Animals (sometimes called comfort animals)prescribed by health care providers for those with mental disablities (including and ranging upwards from simple depression)are indeed legally defined as service animals.

Anyone subject to the ADA or Fair Housing Amendments Act that ignnore these principles is at legal jeopardy, as experts in the field have clearly stated at seminars that I have attended.

I am not a lawyer, so this is not legal advice, but an experienced layman's advice.

 

[RRrich]

I LOVE my cat and as I am not at home now (visit to mom) I miss him badly and I think I am more edgy than normal - stroking the cat calms me down.

I have no diagnosed diseases that pertain to this calming effect and my cat has received no therapy or service or comfort training. Unfortunately he could be classified as "just a house cat"

I think that taking him with me on my overnight ride from STL to ALB would be terribly unfair to him, keeping him cooped up in a little Amtrak bedroom or a carrier while in the Metro Lounge. Just not fair to my cat who is my buddy, but he is gonna give me he!! for abandoning him when I get home

 

[jmbgeg]

It's a tough issue. One one side, you have assistance or therapy animals that may be for a non-obvious condition (like epilepsy). On the other hand, you have people that fake a condition in order to get around restrictions on pets.

The DOT's guidance for airlines is here (pdf). Note that airlines are not under ADA but the Air Carrier Access Act. Allowing the airline to ask for documentation of emotional support animals was in response to a few incidents, like a 300 pound pot bellied pig.

Since this is just in reference to the ACAA, I don't know where it leaves Amtrak.

Here is more info:

http://www.pettravel.com/passports_comfort_animals.cfm

 

[Jersey Jeff]

In addition to the misinformation and outright abuse of the service animal section of the ADA, Amtrak does a pretty poor job of training it's personnel, specifically ticket agents on how to better identify those "comfort" animals and prevent them from being brought on the train. Persons with disabilities with legitimate service animals will not be denied transport on Amtrak.

Your quote is quite accurate. I was traveling on the eastbound Pennsylvanian in April and a woman was in the lounge car with a very rambunctious mixed breed dog that she claimed was her "service dog." The dog was jumping up on tables and seats, happily licking passers by and, well, behaving like a typical pet dog rather than a calm, trained service dog.

The conductor in the car just rolled his eyes and said that he just took the passenger's word for it when she boarded the train but at this point in the trip, he didn't want to make a scene and throw her off the train.

 

[supergrandmother]

I know this is very "uncouth" to ask but what does one do about the dog's need to well....do his business??? I mean you can't tell a dog to hold it because we'll have a "smoke break" in a couple of hours. :unsure: hboy:

 

[amamba]

I know this is very "uncouth" to ask but what does one do about the dog's need to well....do his business??? I mean you can't tell a dog to hold it because we'll have a "smoke break" in a couple of hours. :unsure: hboy:

Most adult dogs can hold it for 8-10 hours - like when their owners are at work. Now if we are talking about a puppy, that is a different story, but puppies generally aren't service animals.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

I know this is very "uncouth" to ask but what does one do about the dog's need to well....do his business??? I mean you can't tell a dog to hold it because we'll have a "smoke break" in a couple of hours. :unsure: hboy:

I was in coach with a seeing eye dog, and the dog was able to "hold it" for the entire trip. I was willing to offer to do a quick walk at a station, for that passenger, if needed.

BTW, the dog even had its own seat check.

I will just add that one of the cruise lines, runs a special cruise each year where they go out of their way to accommodate the blind. On one of the upper, open, decks they even install a grass area for the dogs (and change out the grass several times a day), and hang a wind chime over it so that their masters can find the area easily.

 

[Shanghai]

Our former dog (Bichon) made eight trips from Amsterdam to Newark, NJ without incident.

We would take her out just before going through immigration prior to departure and would

take her out after clearing customs upon arrival. She was able to hold for 8+ hours.

We took her in the cabin (Business Class) of the airplane. We would not feed or provide

water for 4 hours prior to flight time and I would let her lick ice from my hand while in

flight. I tried giving her a sedative one time and nothing after that. We were successful

each time.

We were asked to carry the dog through security with us and her bag went through the X-Ray

machine like a carry-on. No problem.

I do not think pets should be permitted on overnight trains, except service animals, as there

are not proper facilities on the train or at the stations.

 

[jmbgeg]

In addition to the misinformation and outright abuse of the service animal section of the ADA, Amtrak does a pretty poor job of training it's personnel, specifically ticket agents on how to better identify those "comfort" animals and prevent them from being brought on the train. Persons with disabilities with legitimate service animals will not be denied transport on Amtrak.

Your quote is quite accurate. I was traveling on the eastbound Pennsylvanian in April and a woman was in the lounge car with a very rambunctious mixed breed dog that she claimed was her "service dog." The dog was jumping up on tables and seats, happily licking passers by and, well, behaving like a typical pet dog rather than a calm, trained service dog.

The conductor in the car just rolled his eyes and said that he just took the passenger's word for it when she boarded the train but at this point in the trip, he didn't want to make a scene and throw her off the train.

The right to be accompanied by a service animal does not include disrupting other passengers. A service animal cannot bite, intimidate through aggresive conduct, defecate in public areas or undertake other disruptive conduct unabated. Jumpiing on seats, tables and licking passengers would all not be allowed. It is not surprising that service attendendents are reluctant to approach the service animal owners and counsel them on the disruptive conduct, but that is their right and responsibility to do so professionally.

 

[DKpartyguy]

A few years ago I was working as a travel agent here in NY. I had a couple of clients, one of which was in a wheelchair and used what she said a service dog. She and her daughter wanted to take Amtrak from NYC to Florida.

They wanted to take the dog on the train with them.

When I contacted Amtrak to inquire about the dog, they told me that the dog had to be a certified and accredited service animal (by whatever state agency does these things). The Amtrak agent stressed to me several time during our first conversation that the only animals Amtrak allows on board are actual service animals (seeing eye dogs mainly). She also said that I needed copies of the dog's service papers.

As it turned out, the dog was not a real service animal, so my clients looked into what was involved in getting the dog trained and certified. It turned out to be such a hassle that they ended up cancelling the trip because of the dog.

My point is that Amtrak was extremeley strict about their animals on-board policy, and I can't believe people have brought on small dogs and cats without incident.

David

 

[alanh]

If they do mistakenly deny transport to a legitimate service animal, there are serious legal consequences, not to mention the PR nightmare. So the inclination is to err on the side of letting someone board with their animal, even if it's questionable.

 

[George Harris]

When calling the reservation center, you get a quotation of the rules. When you get on the train without proper paperwork, the conductor is really balancing whether to call your bluff against the realization that he will be in real trouble if he is wrong.

 

[A.J.]

on my last long-distance train trip, a man and his son were in the roomette next to me. the kid was HORRIBLE, but in my opinion the father made it worse. he let the kid run up and down the hall a lot, the kid played a dvd player way too loudly, and when the father felt like disciplining him, they argued and everyone on the upper level had to listen to the kid slam the door shut every two minutes. I have seen a lot of kids traveling Amtrak and have never seen a kid that badly behaved, combined with a parent who couldn't/wouldn't control him.

in light of that, I'd rather deal with a dog next door.

 

[EB_OBS]

Service animals are individually trained to perform a specific task. I think the revisions that were planned for the ADA last January were put on hold unfortunately. Those revisions would have stated clearly that "farm animals and exotic animals" cannot be trained as service animals as well as that "therapy" AKA "comfort" animals are NOT service animals and thus not protected under the ADA. There were some good points to the revisions & clarifications. If anyone knows for sure whether or not any of the law was changed please post with links.

I have a great deal of experience with service animals as a rental housing manager and manager of commercial and public buildings.

I do not often specificaly tell people they are wrong on facts on this board, but in this case I will.

-The regulatory agencies that enforce anti-discrimination laws do not hold that proof of training is a prerequisite to an animal qualifing and service animal, only that a health care provider certify that an individual qualifies per statue as disabled, and describes a particular type of animal as needed in connection with that remedy.

-Animals (sometimes called comfort animals)prescribed by health care providers for those with mental disablities (including and ranging upwards from simple depression)are indeed legally defined as service animals.

Anyone subject to the ADA or Fair Housing Amendments Act that ignnore these principles is at legal jeopardy, as experts in the field have clearly stated at seminars that I have attended.

I am not a lawyer, so this is not legal advice, but an experienced layman's advice.

I am not wrong about "comfort" animals. These animals are not covered under the ADA as they are not trained to do anything. A person can get as many notes as they want from doctors or therapists and it does not make the animal a service animal. Comfort animal just sits on a persons lap and allows itself to be touched and/or pet to control a persons anxiety or other social disfunction. The animals have 99% of the time not been trained to do anything or provide any kind of assistance to the person. This type of animal is not covered under the ADA and yet it is these people who abuse the law the most and are the most vocal when challenged.

Your experience with housing falls under the ADA and the Fair Housing Act and is much more allowing with the tenants needs other than just a physical or medical disability. Access to public places that don't allow pets is separate from permanent housing.

Just FYI, I never stated anyone with a service animal required proof of said animal being a legitimate service animal. Regardless there are minimal and specific questions that may be asked and simple observation of an animals behavior and it's interactions with it's owner can provide much information.

As I stated in one of the posts, the ADA was slated to be clarified on many points this past January but I believe the DoJ put the changes on hold. It's exactly this reason, "comfort" animals, "farm" animals, etc.. that the law needs clarification.

 

[EB_OBS]

If they do mistakenly deny transport to a legitimate service animal, there are serious legal consequences, not to mention the PR nightmare. So the inclination is to err on the side of letting someone board with their animal, even if it's questionable.

This is exactly why most of the fakers get their pets on-board and exactly why the ADA changes need to be implemented.

 

[EB_OBS]

When calling the reservation center, you get a quotation of the rules. When you get on the train without proper paperwork, the conductor is really balancing whether to call your bluff against the realization that he will be in real trouble if he is wrong.

In my experience, the persons with disabilities traveling with service animals are almost 100% in communicating with Amtrak reservations that they will be traveling with a service animal. Although it is not legally required you notify the carrier, most passengers indeed do.

It's always the ones with questionable animals that show up unexpected with their "service" animals in tow, not having notified Amtrak that they will be traveling with a service animal.

 

[EB_OBS]

Ah good news. I just found this.

Stafford County Sun

It looks like the DoJ is ready to move forward with updating the ADA afterall.

 

[George Harris]

When calling the reservation center, you get a quotation of the rules. When you get on the train without proper paperwork, the conductor is really balancing whether to call your bluff against the realization that he will be in real trouble if he is wrong.

In my experience, the persons with disabilities traveling with service animals are almost 100% in communicating with Amtrak reservations that they will be traveling with a service animal. Although it is not legally required you notify the carrier, most passengers indeed do.

It's always the ones with questionable animals that show up unexpected with their "service" animals in tow, not having notified Amtrak that they will be traveling with a service animal.

Exactly!!! Recently behind a woman tying to pay with a check in a place with a prominently displayed "No Checks" sign. Irate, hostile, "I am so offended", etc., etc. Finally she decided to use her debit card. Well, what do you know? It was declined. How about that? No money behind the check. At that point she walked out. The people behind the counter were way more patient that it would seem to be possible

 

[kitty76]

*Not to make light of those with disabilities, but a cat??? One of the things that supposedly is big on the On-line dating sites is the Love or dislike of pets! (ie "Must like cats! If you sleep with your pets don't contact me!" etc. etc. ) :lol:

I have no problem with assistance animals that are legally certified as such but Fido or Fluffy, my little darling, don't belong on any form of transportation especially trains!

**Disclaimer:I love dogs, had one for years when I didnt live in No animal aprtments and was able to properly take care of them, and agree with Johnny Carson, if you want to see a cat go down to the local zoo and admire them! :lol:

I have a rare sleeping condition that makes life difficult, instead of taking the easy way out I am going to school to gain employment. The more stress (including physical activity) can make me essessively tired and even drunk like. I have no idea sometimes that I may trip on things, fall or even realize that I need a rest. My kitten has helped me tremendously since I got him, notififying me of break times and making sure I have a clear route to walk anouncing if I stop that he has the way. I would like to getting him better trained, but obviously people mostly see dogs as the trainable type. I have had less bruises, fractured bones and other such problems since the kitten and see his potiential... people have tiny dogs smaller than a cat as a service animal!I would love for him to travel with me so I don't have the fear of waking up in some foriegn hospital because I had an accident. I can't drive a car because of my condition or I would just bring him that way, why should the quality of my life be less because some person thinks a cat can not provide the assistance a dog of similar size or smaller. I can't give what little energy away to take a dog for walks or scoop it up, my kitten will let me know dialy to do my chores he needs (my apt has recently BANNED dogs because people don't pick up after their dogs). I want to train my cat further but due to people's attitudes like yours I am having no luck (thanks *sarcastically) P.S. some cats are just as trainable as dogs (if not more so )

 

[AlanB]

Please note that this is a two year old topic!