SoCal HSR News

[George Harris]

Bullet train plan would leave path of destruction (print headline)

"More than a mile-long segment of California 99, the major freeway serving the farm belt, would have to be moved about 100 feet and three exits would have to be closed. In Kings County, a processing plant that handles about a quarter of a million pounds of dairy cow carcasses would be bisected by the rail, said Jim Andreoli, chief executive of Baker Commodities, owner of the plant. Shutting down for even a few days would leave a mountain of carcasses.

This has got to be one of the most lopsided articles ever seen on the subject. These people that are being affected will be crying all the way to the bank. You can't detour around everything. I think the one mile segment they are talking about is in Fresno. Look in the plans, which are part of these environmental statements, and you will see that the exits are rbuilt. Suspect most of these whiners are positioning themselves for bigger payoffs.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

Tried normal reply, but it wouldn't work.

Anyway, yeah, the print headline alone reads like a Godzilla movie poster, and/or Republican propaganda. The L.A. Times really seems to have atrophied back to its roots as a reactionary shill sheet.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

The Times has published a couple reader letters responding to its latest HSR story. Copy/pasted to avoid dredging through the day's other letters, and names omitted as always. However, I happened to recognize one of the names as that of an AU member, whooz not me. Let the guessing begin!

In the path of high-speed rail

 

Re "Bullet train plan would leave path of destruction," Oct. 23

Letter 1:

In France I rode the high-speed TGV between Lyon and Paris. It was fast and quiet, and there were no vibrations. It was also nearly empty.

So how many people would ride a bullet train between San Francisco and Los Angeles? We really need high-speed trains between L.A. and San Diego, where Amtrak pokes along at about 40 miles per hour. Another route that could use better trains is the Riverside-Temecula-San Diego corridor, where weekday traffic moves at a crawl.

Beyond that, perhaps just fast non-bullet trains should be added to the mix, which cost much less.

____________

Letter 2:

Kittens. The Times forgot to mention the millions of fluffy kittens that will be killed by the California high-speed rail project.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

U.P., and the nation's largest farm, weigh in on Cal HSR's proposed route. Hint: They're not fans.

Railroad denounces plans for bullet train

"The company's comments as part of an environmental review assert that the authority, which is building the $43-billion system, has made a 'false conclusion' that the bullet train would not affect the freight railroad's operations during construction or later passenger service. Documents and drawings show encroachment onto the railroad's right of way in Fresno and Merced. The comments were provided to the Times by Union Pacific."

_________

"Union Pacific's concerns come only weeks after J.G. Boswell, the nation's largest farm, asserted that the bullet train could destroy processing plants, irrigation canals and a private airport when it cuts through Kings County. Boswell, which has a long history of fiercely defending its property rights, asked for a six-month delay in the environmental review process. Shortly after, the authority announced that it would issue a new environmental report in six months and allow parties to comment again."

 

[WhoozOn1st]

Bleak...

Projected bullet train costs double

"California's bullet train will cost an estimated $98.5 billion to build over the next 22 years, a price nearly double any previous projection and one likely to trigger political sticker shock, according to a business plan scheduled to be unveiled Tuesday."

_______________

Bleaker...

Cost could derail bullet train plans

"'This is not a train to nowhere,' said California High-Speed Rail Authority board member Dan Richards, a finance expert appointed to the rail agency's board this summer by Gov. Jerry Brown. 'It will be a train to where trains are waiting. That is the new strategy.'"

"The extended construction scheme still would begin next year with a controversial spine of track in the Central Valley, leading to initial operation of 220-mph trains to either San Jose or the San Fernando Valley in roughly a decade, officials said.

"However, the new construction schedule would lead to dramatically higher costs at a time when California's heavy debt load already has yielded one of the lowest credit ratings in the nation."

_______________

Commentary...

Still no straight route to confidence in bullet train

"Now we're told that was all wrong. Actually, the cost of the first phase alone has tripled to $98.5 billion. The completion date has been delayed until 2033. There's $3 billion in federal money available but no more on the horizon. And no private investors are in sight. They want to see passengers actually buying tickets."

 

[saxman]

A little perspective...

High Costs Threaten California's High-Speed Rail Project, But the Wider Context Must be Understood

More broadly, the state must make a decision about how it wants to invest in its transportation future. As already noted, the state department of transportation is likely to invest about $300 billion in mostly highway infrastructure over the next two decades. With so much spending directed towards the roads network, it cannot be easy to dismiss a large spending commitment to rail. But the difference between the two is obvious: Because the rail line is a single project (despite its statewide implications), it is viewed in terms of its huge costs and long-term lifecycle; the roads improvements likely to occur during the same period are four times as expensive — but broken into much smaller, shorter-term projects, so they are far less politically vulnerable.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

A little perspective...
High Costs Threaten California's High-Speed Rail Project, But the Wider Context Must be Understood

More broadly, the state must make a decision about how it wants to invest in its transportation future. As already noted, the state department of transportation is likely to invest about $300 billion in mostly highway infrastructure over the next two decades. With so much spending directed towards the roads network, it cannot be easy to dismiss a large spending commitment to rail. But the difference between the two is obvious: Because the rail line is a single project (despite its statewide implications), it is viewed in terms of its huge costs and long-term lifecycle; the roads improvements likely to occur during the same period are four times as expensive — but broken into much smaller, shorter-term projects, so they are far less politically vulnerable.

I'm pretty sure many AU members have a more accurate and complete perspective on California HSR than could be gained by the general public reading the L.A. Times, where it's been a lively story, editorial, and Op-Ed topic lately...

Editorial:

Still on board the bullet train

"The bullet train would be the backbone of public transit systems that would connect to it in urban centers. It's still a good investment, even if a much bigger one than voters were originally told. Bullet trains have been successful in places with even bigger financial problems than California (notably Spain), and we'd like to think that the home of such visionaries as Steve Jobs, Howard Hughes, D.W. Griffith and Earl Warren is at least as forward-thinking on transportation as, say, Japan or Turkey."

Op-Ed:

Take this bullet train. Please.

"The new report from the same old consultants assures us that we don't need to worry about where the $100 billion will come from or who will actually ride this railroad. The new report has new numbers — most assuredly correct numbers, because why shouldn't we trust these people? And they have a plan."

 

[WhoozOn1st]

Not really news from the Party of No...

Bullet Train Funds in GOP Sights

"The case against the bullet train is being led by a group of California Republicans, including Rep. Jeff Denham (R-Atwater) and Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-Bakersfield), the House majority whip, who have argued the project is deeply flawed and has become unaffordable as the cost has spiraled to $98.5 billion.

"Denham, a subcommittee chairman on the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, said he believes all of the project's grants can be rescinded by Congress and should be reallocated to highway construction in the Central Valley. Republican staffers are formulating plans to grab the bullet train money, which they said has not been spent or put under contract."

 

[leemell]

Not really news from the Party of No...

Bullet Train Funds in GOP Sights

"The case against the bullet train is being led by a group of California Republicans, including Rep. Jeff Denham (R-Atwater) and Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-Bakersfield), the House majority whip, who have argued the project is deeply flawed and has become unaffordable as the cost has spiraled to $98.5 billion.

"Denham, a subcommittee chairman on the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, said he believes all of the project's grants can be rescinded by Congress and should be reallocated to highway construction in the Central Valley. Republican staffers are formulating plans to grab the bullet train money, which they said has not been spent or put under contract."

This just in:

"Californians For High Speed Rail

Great news! The California High Speed Rail project achieved a significant milestone today. The U.S. Department of Transportation "obligated" all remaining federal funds today previously awarded to California's HSR project. This is significant because now funds are no longer subject to be rescinded (or taken back) by any future legislation in Congress."

 

I guess they heard the House and decided to act.

 

[leemell]

Excerpted form the Railroad.net, Railroad Industry News:

"Funding Secured for First Phase of California High-Speed Rail

Posted: 27 Nov 2011 12:34 PM PST
An important step in making California high-speed rail a reality has recently been announced in a California High-Speed Rail Authority press release. The announcement reveals that the authority and the Federal Railroad Administration have signed a cooperative agreement, which will allot $928 million for the first phase of high-speed rail construction. With this agreement, it is confirmed that enough funding has been secured for the design, engineering and construction of the first 130 miles of high-speed rail. ...

Moderator edit: reduced the quoted material due to copyright issues and credited source.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

Roadblock after obstruction after hurdle...

Bullet train funding plan faulted

"The funding plan for the California bullet train does not comply with key provisions of a ballot measure that voters approved to authorize the project and $9 billion in state bonds to help finance it, according to a report released Tuesday.

"The study — by the Legislative Analyst's Office, which periodically reviews the $98-billion construction proposal — concluded that the most recent funding plan does not meet important requirements of Proposition 1A because high-speed trains cannot operate on the first stretch of track to be built next year in the Central Valley."

Note the use of past tense.

​

 

[leemell]

Roadblock after obstruction after hurdle...

Bullet train funding plan faulted

"The funding plan for the California bullet train does not comply with key provisions of a ballot measure that voters approved to authorize the project and $9 billion in state bonds to help finance it, according to a report released Tuesday.

"The study — by the Legislative Analyst's Office, which periodically reviews the $98-billion construction proposal — concluded that the most recent funding plan does not meet important requirements of Proposition 1A because high-speed trains cannot operate on the first stretch of track to be built next year in the Central Valley."

Note the use of past tense.

​

They start next year or lose the Federal funding. This is the first strike back by a legislator.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

Bullet train would lose in revote

"'It is easy to understand voter frustration on a lot of things at this very moment, but it shouldn't dictate the future of California's transportation infrastructure,' said state Senate President Pro Tem Darrell Steinberg, (D-Sacramento). 'A knee-jerk reaction to a snapshot in time would be a mistake.'"

 

[Devil's Advocate]

President Elect Gingrich must be furious to hear that America's last best chance for high speed rail is already on the ropes and will likely be long gone before he can be sworn in. :lol:

 

[George Harris]

Bullet train would lose in revote

"'It is easy to understand voter frustration on a lot of things at this very moment, but it shouldn't dictate the future of California's transportation infrastructure,' said state Senate President Pro Tem Darrell Steinberg, (D-Sacramento). 'A knee-jerk reaction to a snapshot in time would be a mistake.'"

The anti-HSR people are getting major publicity, and are not letting the facts get in the way of their whines. "Bussinesses will be shut dow! ! !" Horror of horrors! Yes, there will be businesses that have to relocate. News Flash! You can't go fast and go around everything. The whiners will bet paid to relocate. Affected facilites, such as the school in Bakersfield will be relocated! Overpasses adn underpasses will be built, some roads will be relocated. Do you really think the railroad will cost as much as is bugeted? Much of the money will go to making these whiners happy.

The reason that it is justifiable to build something that may not make a profit, but based on what has happened in other parts of the world probably will, is that many people are benefitted that are not paying fares to ride the trains. Think of all the cars NOT on the roads. Think of the airport congestion that is not there, etc., ect. Think of all the exhaust fumes from cars and planes that are not spewed into the atmosphere.

 

[leemell]

The LA Times printed this pretty neutral and fairly informative article today on the driving requirements for the CAHSR project.

 

[guest]

The LA Times printed this pretty neutral and fairly informative article today on the driving requirements for the CAHSR project.

The usual "bullet train or death" fanatics on this thread will claim the LA Times is in league with hundreds of others in some evil conspiracy to kill the project (even tho the Times editorially supports the concept) but I don't know how any objective observer can read this article and not sense that something terribly wrong has gone on with the planning and budgeting process. There are too many people from too many different sides of the political spectrum raising questions for defenders to just shout "conspiracy" or "NIMBY" or other epithets any more and expect to be taken seriously.

In a perfect world, the bullet train would be a great addition. But for a small smidgeon of the $98 billion being bandied about, you could provide LA, San Diego, Sacramento, Orange County, etc. with well-functioning rapid transit systems more than competitive to private auto use. It's time to start thinking of alternatives before everything is lost.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

U.S. stands by California bullet train project despite critics

"'We are not going to flinch on that support,' said Joseph Szabo, chief of the Federal Railroad Administration.

"Szabo said that his agency had committed itself to provide $3.3 billion for a construction start next year in the Central Valley and that federal law prohibits any change of mind about where to begin building the first segment of the state's high-speed rail system."

"'The worst thing we could do is make obligations to folks and start to renege on our word,' Szabo told the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee."