Amtrak ethics

[Ispolkom]

I long ago decided that most arguments about ethics were really attempts to avoid doing what you know is the right thing. This is probably one of them.

Is it right to book a bedroom from New York Penn Station to Alexandria, Virginia on the day before Thanksgiving?

I try to plot out my Amtrak travels as far in advance as possible, as they are usually a mix of AGR rewards and paid-for tickets, and I hate to pay more than I have to.

Next November Mrs. Ispolkom and I head east, first on the Empire Builder and the Lake Shore Limited to Boston. After a couple of days in Rhode Island seeing in-laws (and also seeing an Acela go through Kingston station, I hope), we head on the day before Thanksgiving to spend the holiday with more of my wife's family in northern Virginia.

This leg of the trip puzzled me. The obvious answer was to take #67. The problem is that this train no longer has a sleeper, and the more time I spend in sleepers, the less I find sleeping in coach tolerable. I considered Acela, but it was too expensive. Just recently I hit upon the solution: Take the first regional from Providence to New York City, go to the Metropolitan Museum to see this, eat a dozen oysters at the Grand Central Oyster Bar, then take the Crescent to Alexandria. We could drop our luggage at Club Acela, enjoy a cocktail in our bedroom (it was cheaper than the roomette), eat dinner if they serve it that early, even check our luggage.

But this, of course, means that some poor persons traveling to Atlanta won't be able to get that bedroom, unless they score an upgrade out of Alexandria.

I figure that I booked the room fair and square, so I shouldn't feel guilty. That was the attitude I took last summer, when we had the only family bedroom from St. Paul to Portland on the Empire Builder. But should I at least feel guilty enjoying the Club Acela and our vast amount of space in the bedroom on the Crescent when others are suffering through the busiest travel day in the Northeast Corridor? Especially since the total trip costs less than business class on #67 would?

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

How do you know that nobody's going to want a bedroom from, say, Lynchburg to Atlanta on that same train?

 

[the_traveler]

No, it's perfectly fine! Many people book bedrooms and/or roomettes between NOL and ATL or CHI to MSP or LAX to OKJ - and those are day trips!

 

[transit54]

I'd actually argue that what you're doing benefits Amtrak. You're assuming that Amtrak will sell 100% of its rooms on that particular train out of some point north of Alexandria. That no one at Alexandria or south of it will ever decide to get a sleeper on that day. I think that's a false assumption. Surely someone could board shortly after Alexandria heading somewhere between Atlanta and New Orleans.

Assuming I'm right, you're actually providing Amtrak additional revenue by filling an otherwise empty room from NYP to Alexandria.

So I say, go ahead and book it!

Edited for clarification.

 

[RRrich]

It appears that you are a terribly bad and immoral person to do that type thing - people are starving in Africa and you think only of yourself. FOR SHAME

Heck. someone had to say it

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

There is no ethical problem at all.....zero. Somebody may well want to travel from Alexandria to New Orleans or Greensboro to Tuscaloosa or any combination whatsoever.

It brings up something funny, though as to the nature of the stops on the corrider.

I double checked the timetable and no , there is no problem traveling from NYC to Alexandria. I had thought that maybe Alexandria was a stop to receive only but it is not. So, no problem.

Northbound, however,you may not ride from Alexandria to NYC on the Crescent because the Alexandria stop is only to discharge.

Just pointing out the apparent discrepancy, I realize this has no direct bearing on your question.

I notice the Silver Meteor, alone, does stop at Alexandria southbound to receive only. So you could not ride it from NYC to Alexandria.

Northbound I note that both silvers as well as the Crescent stop at Alexndria to discharge only. Not so the Carolinian or Palmetto.

 

[George Harris]

In late 1995 I was working briefly in Newark NJ. Desire to take Crescent south to B'ham - then bus to see certain relatives shortly before Christmas. No space, coach or sleeper. Went to Newark about 8:00am. No space on Crescent. Took NJT/SEPTA to Philly. Checked there. No space. Took unreserved regional train or whatever they called them then. Checked at DC. Yes for coach. No for sleeper. Got on train. Checked with conductor after Alexandria. Roomette available. Grabbed it. Then went to diner, ate supper, and to bed. Fallback position if no coach in DC was to take Metro to Alexandria VA and try there. If that failed, then it would have been a long night on the dog. I was going to make the trip.

 

[daveyb99]

I would book it.

However, I have also complained about this exact thing: "day trip" traffic blocking overnight travel.

I took the TE FTW-CHI and watched a bedroom sit empty the entire trip, only to be taken up at Springfield. Four hours of use blocking 24-hours of use. THAT does not seem like a logical use of AMTRAK resources.

I even asked if that passenger could be moved to another vacated bedroom (it was vacated in STL), and that did not work.

In your case, you are blocking a WAS-NOL passenger (given they are not smart enough to check ALX-NOL (since that is the first stop for departing passengers southbound).

I doubt AMTRAK could effectively implement a 'hours minimum rule' similar to airline upgrades: want a sleeper for a short trip, then wait till 48-hours in advance. And I doubt AMTRAK has the data on how many passengers did NOT upgrade because of the blocking.

AMTRAK revenue should figure a way to manage this better. A little effort could produce $$$ in return.

 

[Ispolkom]

I would book it.
However, I have also complained about this exact thing: "day trip" traffic blocking overnight travel.

....

In your case, you are blocking a WAS-NOL passenger (given they are not smart enough to check ALX-NOL (since that is the first stop for departing passengers southbound).

Oh, don't worry, I snapped up they ticket faster than you can say, oh some phrase it takes a long time to say. I may have moral qualms, but a deal is a deal. I know that it's not my problem if Amtrak can't manage sleeper inventory more efficiently, just like it's not my fault that I can book a 1-zone AGR reward MSP-PDX-SAC-DEN. And I certainly won't think twice about sticking it to other common carriers. (I'm talking about you, Northwest Airlines!) For some reason, though, I have a soft spot in my black, bitter heart for Amtrak.

 

[sky12065]

But this, of course, means that some poor persons traveling to Atlanta won't be able to get that bedroom, unless they score an upgrade out of Alexandria.

I agree with most that say what you're doing is NOT an ethics issue. If you had a reservation at a hotel that was fully booked and you, for whatever reason, only need the room for only part of the night, would you feel uncomfortable that someone else that would have liked that room for the full night would be denied a room that evening? I'll bet not! If your the early bird that gets the worm, it's yours and you have the right to have it. Of course the worm may not be agreeable with this!

Besides, the person being denied the room on the train for the full trip does have an alternate in most cases if they want to make to effort at what I'm thinking of, or if the Amtrak agent is willing to try. Presuming all rooms are full, the idea is to progressively start checking for availability from stations along the route until (and if) you find where a room becomes available. In your particular case that would be Alexandria to Atlanta (?) as an example. Once a point is found that's available through to their destination, book that room and book a coach seat from the starting point up to when that room is available. It will take a little work, but it is doable.

The only exception to this is the rare case where someone like me can only use an H room and where any other room or coach seat is not an option. That would deny me the ability to be able to travel at all! There may be some legitimacy to there being an ethic problem here, but even if that were the case, I feel that your rights definitely trump my needs.

BTW, I did run into this kind of situation last summer when I was traveling from CHI to FLG. On the way west another passenger took occupation in our H room when we got off at FLG and on the way back to CHI another passenger had to vacate the room because we had it reserved from FLG to CHI. I kind of felt sorry for the woman who had to vacate because she too was handicapped, but only because Amtrak personnel kept her standing alone and uncomfortable just outside the sleeper longer that they should have until they helped her to wherever she was being moved to! I know how that feels because it happened to me several years ago when exiting CHI's Metro Lounge. Non-handicapped got the red cap service first and I was left standing until one returned to get me. I was hyperventilating and nearly collapsed by the time one returned!

 

[MrFSS]

We have heard of folks here on the forum who have booked coach during the daylight hours of a long trip and then sleeper for the night time portion. It saves sleeper costs and if you start the sleeper portion in time for the evening meal you can have dinner and breakfast in the AM, too. It will cut the cost down considerably.

 

[George Harris]

I took the TE FTW-CHI and watched a bedroom sit empty the entire trip, only to be taken up at Springfield. Four hours of use blocking 24-hours of use. THAT does not seem like a logical use of AMTRAK resources.. . .

AMTRAK revenue should figure a way to manage this better. A little effort could produce $$$ in return.

A similar thing used to happen, and maybe still does, between New York and Washington. An Acela train would be full out of Newark NJ to Philly, and then less than hafl full from there to DC. You would frequently get the sold out message if trying to go to DC. Since there were extra trains between NY and Philly, it would have seemed reasonable to limit the NY - Philly reservations to the point that the longer trips would not be blocked out.