why can't food be better

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I wish you guys were going to be on the EB on my upcoming trip. Sounds like it could be a rolling party :)
 
Radvlad said:
I wish you guys were going to be on the EB on my upcoming trip. Sounds like it could be a rolling party :)
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Um, when's your trip?
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As a budget oenologist of many years' standing, I can testify that the low-bidder merlots decanted on Amtrak trains are not only unpretentious and drinkable but also contain modest yet bright suggestions of diesel, subtly tinged with creosote, that goes well with bloody rare sous-vide beef. The prices aren't too bad, either; in a local restaurant this evening I paid $8 for a glass of cabernet that really should have stayed on the beach in Chile.
 
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blondninja said:
The whole idea of walking the train to take reservations is lame. Install iPads or have people order or preorder from their smart phone.

Have menu options on the screen. Let them eat whenever they want selecting open seating times. Expand service like a normal restaurant instead of 3 to 4 hours then closing.
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While there is potential in the concept of 'online' ordering, having someone walk the train with menus and able to discuss the menu has advantages; You want (or should) to get more people into the diner and you'd like them to order suggested or featured items they might not choose when pre-ordering from a tablet.

fillyjonk said:
What I DON'T want is to see the diners replaced with, say, a "Subway" branded car where you have to buy a Subway sandwich. Or a McDonald's car. That would actually make me less want to travel LD on Amtrak, or to try to bring my own food.
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I think I'd take a McDonald's or Subway car if it replaced the lounge instead of the diner (and served 24 hours, ideally).

Radvlad said:
There was another thread where someone suggested doing airline type meals (reheat and serve). Sleeper accommodations are classified as first class. I don't think it would be cost prohibitive for Amtrak to allow people to choose their meals at the time of booking and those meals could be boarded, kept in the chiller until time to be served. I was a flight attendant for eight years and all you need is a convection oven. Typical domestic first class meal costs around 10.00 to produce. I'm not kidding. If Amtrak did this, then they could have plenty of options (vegetarian, vegan, Kosher, etc.) on board for those who want it.
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Pre-ordering of meals would potentially help inventory management for Amtrak, I've little doubt. But again, with pre-ordering you largely lose the opportunity for additional revenue by selling items at the time of selection. However, the real problem here is that travel reservations are often made weeks or months in advance; I'm not in the habit of deciding exactly what I want for dinner months in advance (on July 17th I'll have the chicken, fried green tomatoes, and a sweet tea....uh, no). I can't even tell you right now what I want for a bedtime snack tonight.

The idea of better food is not even really dependent upon a dining car (though the withdrawal of dining service from the Silver Star is indeed a mistaken idea). If the Star's lounge car menu looked more like the Acela dining menu - which certainly doesn't have a diner - it would address many of our more serious objections. Indeed, those Amfleet II lounges were ostensibly rebuilt as 'diner-lite' cars; Amtrak can do better even with the limited facilities.
 
A Voice said:
But again, with pre-ordering you largely lose the opportunity for additional revenue by selling items at the time of selection. However, the real problem here is that travel reservations are often made weeks or months in advance; I'm not in the habit of deciding exactly what I want for dinner months in advance (on July 17th I'll have the chicken, fried green tomatoes, and a sweet tea....uh, no). I can't even tell you right now what I want for a bedtime snack tonight.
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Do airlines ask for passengers' meal choices on booking or on check in? If it's the former, this problem exists there too; if it's the latter Amtrak could do some kind of a pre-order discount and stock a limited quantity onboard for upsells/coach passengers.
 
A Voice said:
However, the real problem here is that travel reservations are often made weeks or months in advance; I'm not in the habit of deciding exactly what I want for dinner months in advance (on July 17th I'll have the chicken, fried green tomatoes, and a sweet tea....uh, no). I can't even tell you right now what I want for a bedtime snack tonight.
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Never been invited to a wedding?

Such many times requires you to select your meal at the time of your RSVP. Yea, it might be months in advance. And yea, once there, the "other" meal might look better than the one you selected. But we live with it, and still manage to have a good time.
 
Cho Cho Charlie said:
A Voice said:
However, the real problem here is that travel reservations are often made weeks or months in advance; I'm not in the habit of deciding exactly what I want for dinner months in advance (on July 17th I'll have the chicken, fried green tomatoes, and a sweet tea....uh, no). I can't even tell you right now what I want for a bedtime snack tonight.
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Never been invited to a wedding?

Such many times requires you to select your meal at the time of your RSVP. Yea, it might be months in advance. And yea, once there, the "other" meal might look better than the one you selected. But we live with it, and still manage to have a good time.
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Everyone always skips over the most important detail in this type of conversation: OTP. Have you ever seen a wedding 5 hours late or the wedding "detoured' to another venue?

You can attempt to make meals stops and arrange for food in advance....but then, the train has to back up because of a switch and is now 2 hours late. Then, it follows another train and is 4 hours late. Now, you arranged food is cold, unavailable or you're hungry again since you're now on the train 6 hours longer than you anticipated. Sure, you can attempt to tough it out in the cafe car (assuming there is something you want and enough left,) but what happens to everyone boarding down line? Hopefully, you can line up more food. (KFC or Pizza anyone??)
 
Train2104 said:
A Voice said:
But again, with pre-ordering you largely lose the opportunity for additional revenue by selling items at the time of selection. However, the real problem here is that travel reservations are often made weeks or months in advance; I'm not in the habit of deciding exactly what I want for dinner months in advance (on July 17th I'll have the chicken, fried green tomatoes, and a sweet tea....uh, no). I can't even tell you right now what I want for a bedtime snack tonight.
Click to expand...
Do airlines ask for passengers' meal choices on booking or on check in? If it's the former, this problem exists there too; if it's the latter Amtrak could do some kind of a pre-order discount and stock a limited quantity onboard for upsells/coach passengers.
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The one I am familiar with - Singapore Airlines lets you make menu selections at any time between when you buy the ticket and 48 hour AFAIR, before departure. After that deadline, if you have not made a selection, you get to choose from among the three or so generic menu choices on offer on the flight. This facility also was available for upper class only, not in coach back then, when I used it.
 
American Airlines lets you select your meal at 30 days out. There are 2 selections you can choose from. Has always worked great on my trips. This way I can guarantee the entree that I want. No reason Amtrak can't do this. Again, all you need is a convection oven to reheat the meal. No reason to pay a "chef" when the dining car attendants could do this. Amtrak could carry extra meals on board for those coach passengers that want to pay for a meal.
 
Last week on the CS I asked about the pancakes, fresh made or ore cooked. The "chef" said fresh vase and they did taste as such, very good!
 
Thirdrail7 said:
Everyone always skips over the most important detail in this type of conversation: OTP. Have you ever seen a wedding 5 hours late or the wedding "detoured' to another venue?
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Actually, yes. I've seen a 5-hour-late wedding. And separately I've seen *several* weddings detoured to other venues (outdoor weddings which got rained out, mostly).
But those are other stories... NOT models you want to emulate! :)
 
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neroden said:
Thirdrail7 said:
Everyone always skips over the most important detail in this type of conversation: OTP. Have you ever seen a wedding 5 hours late or the wedding "detoured' to another venue?
Click to expand...
Actually, yes. I've seen a 5-hour-late wedding. And separately I've seen *several* weddings detoured to other venues (outdoor weddings which got rained out, mostly).
But those are other stories... NOT models you want to emulate! :)
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That must have been some honeymoon! :giggle:
 
How many Amtrak jobs are lost when a dining car is removed? Are they "lost" or reassigned to another department?

Also, would some level of "self-service" be realistic in a dining car- with say one dining attendant and one kitchen manager and pre-ordered meals?
 
NETrainfan said:
How many Amtrak jobs are lost when a dining car is removed? Are they "lost" or reassigned to another department?

Also, would some level of "self-service" be realistic in a dining car- with say one dining attendant and one kitchen manager and pre-ordered meals?
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We did something like that on the Broadway in the late 70's.

Amtrak refitted a lounge car, and put a buffet tray-line in. As an LSA, I had one attendant, and other than heating up and serving the food to the passengers, as they slid their tray down the line, there was no real "cooking". Everything was in a steam-table.

We helped seniors and others actually carry the tray to the lounge-eating area, on that track, at that time, it was pretty hard just walking, let alone carrying a tray with hot food.

Couple of main dishes, then veggie sides, the food was actually pretty good, but then again, I brought my own spice box with me each time I worked it, which was only five or six times. LSA's hated the job, so those of us on the extra board always got it. "Too much work", the senior LSA's said.......

Me? I loved it. Every chance I could, I'd walk the food for the passenger, and take a drink order. We'd bus the tables, steal extra fresh flowers from the diner, and put them on half a dozen lounge tables. Made pretty decent tips IIRC.

It was the personal service and attention to detail that got the tips.

We also had liquor kits, and sodas, but I don't remember what the hours of operation are, because I don't think we were a full-service lounge, with chips and snacks, but I could be wrong. Prolly had my head in the steam table too much.

It was on that train, in that car, that a VP of Amtrak had to honestly advise me, "i'd be better off finishing college, than I would staying working for Amtrak........." I was furloughed that fall, and never did go back to work for Amtrak.
 
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Rrdude, I remember having used that service on the Broadway Limited back then and loved it.

BTW United Airlines surprised me by serving a steak medallion done medium with a very nice sauce to go with it, on the Houston to Frankfurt 787-9 flight, in Business First class. They have definitely been working on improving their food service and it shows.
 
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Progress is a strange thing. Making food provision on trains more cost-effective has downgraded the quality on offer. Perhaps people would care more about Amtrak if they had a more enjoyable experience in the dining car. That way passengers win and staff can take more pride in their work.
 
Isn't it possible to upgrade food quality without added costs?

For instance, my husband and I go to conferences where caterers serve delicious casseroles and salads

and sandwiches with home-made bread. They do not seem like expensive items.

Amtrak could serve better food without added costs- it's just a matter of being creative.
 
It's really a matter of bad priorities and poor procurement practices. I am astounded that Amtrak doesn't have point-of-sale inventory tracking in the dining cars yet -- apparently it isn't even in all the *cafe* cars yet. But rather than get rid of thousands of man-hours of time-wasting inventory counting and paperwork, Amtrak chooses to skimp on quality.
 
I've been fortunate to have traveled Amtrak during it's better days. My personal opinion, which may fuel some debate here, to the reason why the food can't be better, the service, the product, is because of the ridiculously high wages of the employees, fueled by Union labor, which, in its day, was needed/appreciated, but today is simply an expensive crutch, which allows unacceptable employees to remain on the job, being paid far higher wages than they deserve. The conditions that sleepers have been allowed to deteriorate to, much from the neglect of employees to simply do their jobs is a perfect reflection of what is wrong with Amtrak.

There was a time, even not too long ago, that you could sit down in the diner and have a reasonably tasty meal, which was prepared onboard. Not so now. It's downright awful.
 
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