Why does the California Zephyr terminate in Emeryville?

[BCL]

Just curious why. Further along there are probably a couple of large staffed stations (Oakland - Jack London and San Jose Diridon) that could handle this kind of service). I thought Oakland used to be the end of the line, but I guess that particular station is gone. Maybe they don't have the same parking capacity nor the same convenience for thruway buses to San Francisco (OKJ could probably do it) but I would think that one could still park in Emeryville even if it's not the starting point.

 

[MikefromCrete]

Emeryville's a new station with parking, easy access to the Bay Bridge for the connecting buses and I would imagine, easy access to yard facilities. No need to go anywhere else.

 

[Notelvis]

Going into Oakland would require the train to back up to reach the yard which is between Emeryville and Jack London Square. This reverse move would include running down the middle of the street through Jack London Square and that's asking for trouble.

Besides, the Emeryville Station is closer to the Bay Bridge which the connecting buses to downtown San Francisco use.

 

[zephyr17]

They don't have to back the train from EMY into the yard like the would from OKJ, just pull forward. The two stations are just a couple of miles away from each other with the yard in between.

Amtrak has a coach yard between OKJ and EMY, they don't have the facilities to service a long distance train at SJC.

They used to run into OKJ, but it just took extra time and trouble to get the train to and from the yard involving reverse moves. Wasn't worth the trouble and expense just to save a couple of miles so they changed the terminal to Emeryville.

OKJ of course is still there. It replaced the old SP station at 16th and Wood which was closed after the Loma Prieta quake (after having used temporary quarters at 16th and Wood for awhile). Now it not only doesn't have train service, but no tracks, the tracks having been moved for the construction of the new 880 replacing the collapsed Cypress Viaduct. Now the 880 freeway is between the 16th and Wood station (still standing) and the tracks. The 16th and Wood station was north of the yard, and the street running, too, so backing the wasn't an issue when they used the old SP station. There was no Emeryville station back then, either. Arguably, the EMY and OKJ station pair together are the replacement for the old Oakland SP station (Amtrak station code OAK).

BTW, the 16th & Wood SP station was and is in a spectacularly bad area of West Oakland. Both EMY and OKJ are in better locations and they are both better served by public transit than 16th & Wood was.

EMY is more convienent to the Bay Bridge, too. Shorter connection times for northbound and eastbound trains. Passengers coming or going to the south on the Coast Starlight San Francisco connection buses do go to OKJ. Going north on the Starlight, the San Francisco buses connect at Emeryville.

All in all Emeryville makes all kind of sense, with very little justifcation for terminating at OKJ.

 

[BCL]

Emeryville's a new station with parking, easy access to the Bay Bridge for the connecting buses and I would imagine, easy access to yard facilities. No need to go anywhere else.

I was thinking maybe the buses still mostly connect at Emeryville even if it's not the end of the line.

I've noticed that CS #14 connects to the bus at OKJ. They built a station that's about as nice as the one in Emeryville, but only gets one LD train a day in each direction.

Still - I guess the convenience of just parking it at the maintenance yard without having to back it up make sense.

And I looked up the opening dates, and Jack London is actually newer than Emeryville by almost two years.

 

[stntylr]

Just put one of the Amtrak California cab control Surfliner cars on it and have train run backwards to Chicago.

 

[BCL]

Just put one of the Amtrak California cab control Surfliner cars on it and have train run backwards to Chicago.

Wouldn't an ordinary California Car do the trick?

Heck - why not just do the trick with a locomotive on either end like with Acela? They already need two.

 

[the_traveler]

People in the street running areas near OKJ are use to trains going down the street. However the difference is the California trains have a locomotive (with an engineer on one end) and a cab control car (with an engineer) on the other end. The CZ only has an engineer in the locomotive on one end - so the conductor must stand at the rear door during the backup move down the street. The conductor had no controls to stop or slow the train. Any command must be radioed to the engineer 10 cars or so back!

So now the CZ is terminated at EMY, and it just has to pull forward 2 miles or so to the yard.

 

[X]

Just put one of the Amtrak California cab control Surfliner cars on it and have train run backwards to Chicago.

Wouldn't an ordinary California Car do the trick?

Heck - why not just do the trick with a locomotive on either end like with Acela? They already need two.

Only Superliners used for push-pull corridor trains are equipped with MU cables, MU stands for Multiple Unit and is used to connect locomotives together, to allow the lead locomotive to control the trailing one(s). Cab cars use MU to control the locomotive on the other end, but to do so all cars in between must be equipped with MU pass-thorough cables.

 

[X]

People in the street running areas near OKJ are use to trains going down the street. However the difference is the California trains have a locomotive (with an engineer on one end) and a cab control car (with an engineer) on the other end. The CZ only has an engineer in the locomotive on one end - so the conductor must stand at the rear door during the backup move down the street. The conductor had no controls to stop or slow the train. Any command must be radioed to the engineer 10 cars or so back!
So now the CZ is terminated at EMY, and it just has to pull forward 2 miles or so to the yard.

To be clear, push-pull trains only have one engineer, who switches ends when the train switches direction.

Conductors actually do have a means of slowing or stopping the train when they're on the rear "protecting the shove", I'll let some random blogger explain:

http://hkisorphoto.blogspot.com/2012/04/backup-hose.html

 

[railiner]

People in the street running areas near OKJ are use to trains going down the street. However the difference is the California trains have a locomotive (with an engineer on one end) and a cab control car (with an engineer) on the other end. The CZ only has an engineer in the locomotive on one end - so the conductor must stand at the rear door during the backup move down the street. The conductor had no controls to stop or slow the train. Any command must be radioed to the engineer 10 cars or so back!
So now the CZ is terminated at EMY, and it just has to pull forward 2 miles or so to the yard.

If I am not mistaken, when the conductor is at the rear of a Superliner doing a reverse move, as an example, backing into CHI, he uses the radio to communicate with the engineer, but he also has a back-up hose equipped with a brake valve and an air whistle. Another example is at DEN.

I remember when the old WP CZ used to discharge passengers at its Oakland station, and then continue on to Middle Harbor Road, also street running, where Santa Fe Ry. buses took passenger's over the Bay Bridge to Santa Fe's bus terminal at 44 Fourth Street in San Francisco. This terminal also served buses to Santa Fe's SF Chief and their Los Angeles train/bus service at their terminus in Richmond.