Raton Pass Closed

[Devil's Advocate]

Gosh, you're a pessimist... I wouldn't be surprised if the House would zero out Amtrak's budget, but I'd want to say that Amtrak has more of a following today than they did back in the 1990s and such.

I have watched passenger rail in America contract and then stagnate for nearly four decades. It's true that Amtrak has more customers today than several years ago but they also have fewer political allies and they're even further in the red now than before. In my view that means bad things for Amtrak. Maybe in your view that means good things for Amtrak. Either way I think we can agree that time will tell. Most of the AU forum seems to be convinced that nothing can ever take Amtrak down completely. I happen to disagree with that view and I've given Amtrak a maximum life expectancy of fifteen years. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, but my gut says this ship is in trouble and will have sunk long before I draw my last breath.

 

[printman2000]

Just got home from watching #4 pass through town. She entered the Southside around 9:15pm. Made a very brief stop at the BNSF depot for a crew change and left the northwest part of town around 9:45.

 

[Steve4031]

How far is that from Kansas city? If you are talking Amarillo, I think 4 is a bit late.

 

[printman2000]

How far is that from Kansas city? If you are talking Amarillo, I think 4 is a bit late.

Yes Amarillo. Not sure how long it takes to get to KC. As far as the reroute goes from the past, it is right on time.

 

[colobok]

Where can I find the info about #3 arrival to ABQ and LAX via detour?

Amtrak.com is absolutely irrelevant to this. They don't even show the time of today's arrival to ABQ on the status page. Is it so difficult to display?

 

[gswager]

Where can I find the info about #3 arrival to ABQ and LAX via detour?

Amtrak.com is absolutely irrelevant to this. They don't even show the time of today's arrival to ABQ on the status page. Is it so difficult to display?

Yes, it is difficult due to lack of explanation or lack of features on its software. Any stops between ABQ and I believe Newton, KS are excluded because the train is on a detoured route.

Amtrak website doesn't say much, so most of AU members use Status Maps.

I'm surprised that today's departing #4 from LAX did not showed, so my speculation that it was cancelled. If it showed all the way to Gallup or even ABQ, then most likely it'll go for detoured route.

 

[AlanB]

Again...how is this doing to times into FLG/ABQ westbound and the timetable in general eastbound? I know that running "limited" from Kansas into NM may cut some time off of things, but I'm not sure what the reroute does.

With no stops, other than crew changes, and higher overall running speeds it should have minimal impact on the arrival times at all stations still being serviced. Now of course the one train that had to backup to ABQ won't be so fortunate as it lost considerable time no doubt backing and waiting for permission to run the other route.

 

[AlanB]

You're still forgetting the inconvenient fact that Amtrak does not have enough qualified T&E crews on that route to cover a daily service. You'd need approximately twice as many conductors, engineers, etc. Even if you could take an Albuquerque or Minot or Omaha crew and fly them to El Paso, it would take a few weeks to get them qualified on the route.

If I understand correctly if a UP crew is traveling an unfamilar route on the UP network they need a pilot for the first two or three runs or so, correct? So what I'm curious about is why would an Amtrak crew that normally runs on UP track would need a few weeks of preparation before they could even start service? Not saying you're wrong, I'm just trying to understand why this would be so different.

While I'm far from an expert on this, I think that it takes far more than 2 or 3 runs for any crew to become qualified on a section of track. UP or otherwise doesn't matter.

Being qualified means that you have to basically know where every signal is, every grade crossing, slow orders, etc. And for the conductor, they have to be able to look out the window of a coach and know exactly where they are. That's not easy when you can't see the mile markers and very much of what's ahead of you.

I suspect that it takes something more like 2 or 3 weeks to become qualified on a route.

Additionally one has to consider that a "pilot" is simply another engineer who is qualified on that track. UP doesn't exactly have dozens of engineers just sitting around to ride as pilots for Amtrak. And then there is the bill that Amtrak will get for all those pilots; UP or any RR doesn't supply them for free.

 

[AlanB]

Crew? The same crew that's getting paid for sitting around waiting for the lines to open.

As was noted in one of the EB disruption topics, the crews aren't getting paid for sitting around. Short of minimum hour guarantees, if they're not on a train they aren't getting paid.

 

[Rail Freak]

Well, just got up & still half asleep. I have a flight out of Tampa this morning to ABQ to catch the #3. Should I go or not? If yesterday's #3 did'nt go that means no #3 out of ABQ today, correct? Thanx!

 

[Rail Freak]

Well, just got up & still half asleep. I have a flight out of Tampa this morning to ABQ to catch the #3. Should I go or not? If yesterday's #3 did'nt go that means no #3 out of ABQ today, correct? Thanx!

Got hold of Amtrak & they said I should have no problems catching the #3 to LAX this afternoon. So, I'm writting this from the Tampa Airport! I came very close to canceling everything.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

Union Pacific has said in order for the Eagle to be a daily train Amtrak would need to pay for 800 million dollars in track work. Now maybe if Amtrak said they just need to do it temporarily until things on the other lines calm down UP could make an exception, but otherwise its going to take at least 800 million to get the daily TE running.

Steve, and others: let us remember that 3 major transcOn routes are closed; not just for Amtrak but to freight, as well. The last thing any of the cl1 s will do right now is ignore their own mares nest Of logistics problems to Amtraks benefit

 

[frugalist]

Well, just got up & still half asleep. I have a flight out of Tampa this morning to ABQ to catch the #3. Should I go or not? If yesterday's #3 did'nt go that means no #3 out of ABQ today, correct? Thanx!

Got hold of Amtrak & they said I should have no problems catching the #3 to LAX this afternoon. So, I'm writting this from the Tampa Airport! I came very close to canceling everything.

I'm glad you decided to go. That's what I would've advised if I had read your OP before you made your decision.

Please come back to this thread and let us know what time you get into LAX tomorrow. Are you connecting to the CS? If so, and if #3 was late into LAX, let us know that you made your connection. I wonder if they'll hold #14 for a late #3, or if they'll bus you to a station farther up the line. Curious minds want to know. [We're making that connection in about 3 weeks.]

 

[henryj]

I read where they lost several bridges due to the fire on the Raton route. So until or if those are ever replaced the detour may turn out to be permanent. Wichita and Amarillo may have just received transcontinental rail service like it or not.

 

[printman2000]

I read where they lost several bridges due to the fire on the Raton route. So until or if those are ever replaced the detour may turn out to be permanent. Wichita and Amarillo may have just received transcontinental rail service like it or not.

Can you post a link? I have not been able to find any info on actual rail damage.

I am currently staked out waiting for #3 to pass me just NE of Amarillo.

 

[henryj]

I read where they lost several bridges due to the fire on the Raton route. So until or if those are ever replaced the detour may turn out to be permanent. Wichita and Amarillo may have just received transcontinental rail service like it or not.

Can you post a link? I have not been able to find any info on actual rail damage.

I am currently staked out waiting for #3 to pass me just NE of Amarillo.

Here is a link to the ABQ Journal. http://www.abqjournal.com/main/2011/06/14/abqnewsseeker/i-25-remains-closed-due-to-fire.html. A post on Train Orders said the siding east of the tunnel burned and possibly the signals. The fire is called the 'track fire' because it is burning along the track row between Trinidad and the summit tunnel. Doesn't sound good, but details on the status of the rail infrastructure are hard to find right now as the fire is still burning there.

jf

 

[printman2000]

Just got back from chasing #3. She went through downtown Amarillo about 10:30am.

 

[printman2000]

By the way, all three SWC's I have seen through here had 4 coaches on the rear.

 

[printman2000]

I read where they lost several bridges due to the fire on the Raton route. So until or if those are ever replaced the detour may turn out to be permanent. Wichita and Amarillo may have just received transcontinental rail service like it or not.

Can you post a link? I have not been able to find any info on actual rail damage.

I am currently staked out waiting for #3 to pass me just NE of Amarillo.

Here is a link to the ABQ Journal. http://www.abqjournal.com/main/2011/06/14/abqnewsseeker/i-25-remains-closed-due-to-fire.html. A post on Train Orders said the siding east of the tunnel burned and possibly the signals. The fire is called the 'track fire' because it is burning along the track row between Trinidad and the summit tunnel. Doesn't sound good, but details on the status of the rail infrastructure are hard to find right now as the fire is still burning there.

jf

That link (for me) did not work. Went to a page not found. I searched their site and found an article. I still have not seen anything "official" that says there is track damage.

 

[printman2000]

I have seen this statement on many news sites...

The Daily Southwest Chief service, which runs between Chicago and Los Angeles, will continue to run, using motorcoaches and commuter trains for detours.

What commuter trains are they talking about? The New Mexico Rail Runner is the only commuter train on the route but I cannot think of where they would use it. Unless they are using it to get passengers to Lamy. Lamy is never mentioned as a missed station either.

Of course, I leave from Lamy in less than two weeks so this has got my mind going!

 

[VentureForth]

And the only reason to go to Lamy is to get to Santa Fe which the NM Railrunner already serves.

But it is conceivable that rather than pulling into ABQ and backing up, they just stay on the TransCon and let folks transfer to the Railrunner to get to ABQ. Of course, the biggest problem with that is ABQ is a major station stop with crew change, checked bags and even the occasional train wash.

 

[printman2000]

And the only reason to go to Lamy is to get to Santa Fe which the NM Railrunner already serves.

But it is conceivable that rather than pulling into ABQ and backing up, they just stay on the TransCon and let folks transfer to the Railrunner to get to ABQ. Of course, the biggest problem with that is ABQ is a major station stop with crew change, checked bags and even the occasional train wash.

They will continue going up to Albuquerque and wyeing the train. They also refuel there.

I go to Lamy and it is not to get to Santa Fe.

 

[Anderson]

You know, I'm about to book my trip on the SWC. As much as I want to run through Raton Pass again, there's a part of me that is half hoping for the detour...there's just something I like about a train running non-stop for a really long time (in this case, it sounds like about 14 hours with just crew changes).

 

[VentureForth]

Printman2000, if you have a reason to go to Lamy and stay in Lamy (or at least not go to Santa Fe), I envy you. It's a beautiful place to hike, and even railfan (well, at least it used to be...seems to be very little traffic other than Amtrak now).

 

[GlobalistPotato]

And the only reason to go to Lamy is to get to Santa Fe which the NM Railrunner already serves.

But it is conceivable that rather than pulling into ABQ and backing up, they just stay on the TransCon and let folks transfer to the Railrunner to get to ABQ. Of course, the biggest problem with that is ABQ is a major station stop with crew change, checked bags and even the occasional train wash.

They will continue going up to Albuquerque and wyeing the train. They also refuel there.

I go to Lamy and it is not to get to Santa Fe.

They can always use a NPCU/Cabbage Car, allowing the train to be in push-pull mode between Belen and ABQ.