Vermonter derailment 2015-10-05

[KnightRail]

Short video of the move posted by 'thenorthfieldnews'



Also video in a report by WPTZ

http://www.wptz.com/news/vermonter-pulled-out-of-ravine/35773234

 

[neroden]

Well, at least it wasn't sliced into pieces on site, which is a good sign.

How about the coaches? If they were moved intact rather than sliced up on site, that would again be a good sign.

 

[jis]

Nothing was sliced up on site.

 

[KnightRail]

How about the coaches? If they were moved intact rather than sliced up on site, that would again be a good sign.

According to this video report from NECN's Jake T. they were rerailed and can be seen towards the end of the video. The two coaches and cafe that were on the rear of the train don't look too bad relatively speaking compared to the two leading coaches.

http://www.necn.com/news/new-england/Amtrak-Vermonter-Resumes-Southbound-Runs-More-Cleanup-to-Do-at-Derailment-Site-331827081.html

 

[Hal]

Well, at least it wasn't sliced into pieces on site, which is a good sign.

That locomotive won't ever be back in service.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[TylerP42]

Well, at least it wasn't sliced into pieces on site, which is a good sign.

How about the coaches? If they were moved intact rather than sliced up on site, that would again be a good sign.

Not entirely, they will probably be used for part then when done with that purpose scrapped.

 

[A Voice]

How does anyone here know, for certain, that locomotive #102 will or won't be repaired and returned to service? I've seen it declared both ways between here and over at TrainOrders.

Even Amtrak cannot yet know the exact extent of the damage and how much it would cost to repair the unit; It has only just been recovered for transport to Beech Grove, where it has yet to be inspected. Now, Amtrak may have a pretty good idea of the damage, and it is indeed possible that there are enough obvious problems to make repair uneconomic, but I ask again - how do you know it will not be repaired, particularly with Amtrak already short of power?

 

[TylerP42]

How does anyone here know, for certain, that locomotive #102 will or won't be repaired and returned to service? I've seen it declared both ways between here and over at TrainOrders.

Even Amtrak cannot yet know the exact extent of the damage and how much it would cost to repair the unit; It has only just been recovered for transport to Beech Grove, where it has yet to be inspected. Now, Amtrak may have a pretty good idea of the damage, and it is indeed possible that there are enough obvious problems to make repair uneconomic, but I ask again - how do you know it will not be repaired, particularly with Amtrak already short of power?

They still have Dash-8's which I've seen quite a few times on the CL.

 

[KnightRail]

How does anyone here know, for certain, that locomotive #102 will or won't be repaired and returned to service? I've seen it declared both ways between here and over at TrainOrders.

Even Amtrak cannot yet know the exact extent of the damage and how much it would cost to repair the unit; It has only just been recovered for transport to Beech Grove, where it has yet to be inspected. Now, Amtrak may have a pretty good idea of the damage, and it is indeed possible that there are enough obvious problems to make repair uneconomic, but I ask again - how do you know it will not be repaired, particularly with Amtrak already short of power?

The railroad barons of the internet ask their magic mirror on the wall and report back the 'facts'. Many units that looked much worse returned. Example #121: http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2627787

 

[TylerP42]

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=549888

Another photo of the damage to the locomotive.

 

[acelafan]

That looks pretty bad, but I'm no expert in locomotive restoration.

 

[jis]

My guess is if the monocoque frame is bent on the left top corner it will be scrapped. Otherwise, depending on a financial analysis it may or may not be rebuilt. Just a somewhat educated speculation, nothing more.

 

[A Voice]

That looks pretty bad, but I'm no expert in locomotive restoration.

Indeed it does look bad, particularly for a locomotive design which relies on a monocoque design.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

locomotives far worse are still running.

 

[west point]

Since there will be many parts removed to fix the frame and mono cube we can probably expect many different parts in 102 if it is rebuilt.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

yes same happens anytime any locomotive enters shop, from entire engine blocks to alternators, fans brake valves etc.

 

[neroden]

Well, Amtrak has announced that they intend to repair all the cars (not clear whether that includes the loco):

http://www.wptz.com/news/wrecked-amtrak-cars-set-to-be-repaired/35800290

Looking at the locomotive... I'm guessing that won't run with the same body shell again. But Amtrak has a bunch of spare P40 body shells still, right? (On Track On Line lists 14 stored.)

It should be possible to take one of the P40 shells and the innards from AMTK 102 (which are probably mostly OK) and make a complete loco.

 

[A Voice]

Well, Amtrak has announced that they intend to repair all the cars (not clear whether that includes the loco):

http://www.wptz.com/news/wrecked-amtrak-cars-set-to-be-repaired/35800290

Looking at the locomotive... I'm guessing that won't run with the same body shell again. But Amtrak has a bunch of spare P40 body shells still, right? (On Track On Line lists 14 stored.)

It should be possible to take one of the P40 shells and the innards from AMTK 102 (which are probably mostly OK) and make a complete loco.

There are also 7-9 out of service P42's, based on the On-Track-On-Line roster, so there should be plenty of available parts sources. Thing is, if Amtrak is indeed short of power as reported, why aren't those already stored units getting fixed (perhaps some are, of course). My guess, again, is that it will still come down to money. Whichever units can be fixed cheaper or easier or faster will be, and the rest will sit.

Quick question: Does Amtrak own the P42DC locomotives outright, or are they leased in an arrangement similar to many freight carrier locomotives (or Acela)? If they are leased, then I presume terms require they be returned to the lessor (or bought out) at the end of the lease. If Amtrak has to pay either way, that could be a factor in what does or doesn't get repaired.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

the P40's were leased, later purchased, but P42's are outright owned by Amtrak.

 

[neroden]

If you have one locomotive with a completely wrecked body but intact interior, and one with a prime mover which burned up but an intact body, it might not be economical to repair either one *by itself*, yet it might be economical to create one locomotive out of the good parts of both of them.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

Locomotive engines do not burn up, all components are easy to replace, from crankshaft to power assemblies .

 

[neroden]

I've definitely seen a melted diesel engine, but that was an antique... they probably make 'em differently in recent decades...

 

[Hal]

I've definitely seen a melted diesel engine, but that was an antique... they probably make 'em differently in recent decades...

In the real world they do burn up. I have seen the interior melted on locomotives from fire.

 

[R30A]

At least half of the P42s were leased. No idea if the early buyout was taken on them, nor do I know if all of the EBO dates have come up for all of them, but absent further information than what I have found online, I don't think we can dismiss the potential that 102 is still leased.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Locomotive engines do not burn up, all components are easy to replace, from crankshaft to power assemblies .

He talking about the engine block. Cast Iron chunk of metal. However at some point easy replacement of components is open for discussion. We use to do million miles in frame rebuilds. (On class 8 trucks) Now we sale them overseas at 500,000 miles.