U.S./Canada border crossing discussion

[railiner]

Yes. I liked the Port of Del Bonita. MT, especially for access to the Cut Bank Amtrak station. On the other hand, as I've written here before, at Sweet Grass, MT I was questioned by US officials as to why I was leaving the U.S. As a Berlin veteran I'm touchy about questions like that.

In 1970, I made an epic bus trip (mostly on a free pass), from New York City to Fairbanks. I connected via Sweetgrass, MT. I disembarked the Intermountain Transportation Company bus from Butte there, walked across the border into adjacent Coutts, Alberta, and boarded Greyhound Lines of Canada to Edmonton.
The inspector asked me where I was going, and when I told him Fairbanks, he wanted to see my passes to my destination, as well as a couple of hundred dollars to insure I had the means to

The only time I ever had a real problem with US Customs was in 2005 at the Blue Water Bridge when the agent asked me how long I was in Canada and I replied about 5 hours as I was driving from Boston to Chicago and driving through Ontario shaves about 100 miles off the trip and she told me to go to the office. ( Let me add I have dual citizenship because my Mom was from Newfoundland and there was a loophole because of when Newfie officially became part of Canada)

What I have noticed since 9/11 is that US officials are not as local to their assignment as they once were.

A few years ago I entered the US at Fort Kent, Maine which is not a busy crossing and and the US agent had a southern drawl.

View attachment 34277

I blew a gasket one night on the Lake Shore Limited when the Border Patrol did a sweep in Northeast Indiana when I had splurged on a sleeper from Chicago to Boston.

https://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/30/nyregion/30border.html
I was used to the sweeps around Buffalo but Indiana?????

I once rode the Bangor and Aroostook RR (Highway Division) bus between Bangor and Fort Kent. Prior to reaching Fort Kent, the bus crossed the St. John River border bridge from Madawaska, ME to Edmundston, NB. It picked up a border agent at the border, who rode the bus the short ride to and from the Edmundston depot to clear passengers getting off in Canada, and did not inspect those going thru back into the US. Anyone (no one on my trip) getting on in Canada would be inspected by US officials back at the border crossing. I suppose there were more doing so going the other way.

 

[jiml]

There were other trains that crossed the border twice (or even more), for routing convenience, such as Thunder Bay to Winnipeg thru Minnesota around the south side of Lake of the Woods, or the former San Diego and Arizona Eastern thru Mexico. Never rode those, but I would imagine thru passengers were treated similarly.

Different times....

The Minnesota crossing you describe is still used for freight. There are a couple of videos that show the process.

 

[railiner]

In my experience CBSA is worse than CBP, at least when it comes to my visits to Canada and return, since they are uniquely ignorant about VIA Rail and cast doubts and aspersions on anyone who suggests that they are going to Canada to ride the Canadian.

A few years ago, I rode the Adirondack Trailways bus from New York to Montreal, specifically to ride the VIA Rail Jonquiere train, which was assigned a Skyline Dome for a few trips. When asked at the border the purpose of my trip, the Canadian officer just asked to see my ticket.
Coming back into the States, I made the mistake of being truthful to the American officer, who was incredulous that anyone would make such a trip for just a one night stay, just to ride the train. He thoroughly inspected my bag, and asked an inordinate amount of questions. I finally showed him photo's I took on my phone, and he let me pass, shaking his head in bewilderment...

 

[jebr]

I've generally found that CBSA is far more thorough in their questioning/inspections than CBP, at least for me as a US citizen. There's been a couple times where I've been traveling along and crossing into Canada where (despite, at most, having a parking ticket on my record) I would get the full car search, secondary interview, etc. CBP is generally pretty quick and easy, with just a few questions at the border. That said, I do have to chuckle at the one time where CBP asked us to pop our trunk when we were crossing back in, as it was deer hunting season and they wanted to make sure we weren't bringing back anything that we had recently hunted down in Canada.

 

[MARC Rider]

I've had mixed experiences crossing by car. In 1987 cI took a trip up there with my South American girlfriend. CBSA made us get out and go into the office to check her passport, but they didn't seem to care about the stuff from my garden in the picnic cooler in the trunk, even though there were signs that said certain produce from Maryland was prohibited. On the way back into the US, they held us up at the border to double check on her paperwork (there was a question that maybe her visa had expired, even though her residence permit was still valid). They had us pop the trunk, and they looked into the picnic cooler, but didn't seem to mind the fresh food inside. I got a real lecture from a CBSA agent at the Windsor tunnel back in 2005 when they were starting to require passports and I didn't have one, but he let me in. I started getting worried about being let back into the US, but the US customs guy just passed me through. Walking across the Rainbow Bridge, both sides just passe dus through with only a cursory look at out passports, but we had to wait in line on the American side while a CBP agent was haranguing a Canadian guy about all his busts for weed possession, but in the end, he let the Candian guy into the US. The last time I entered Canada at I-81 at Derby Line, VT, the CBSA guy looked at our passports and asked us out purpose for visiting Canada. I said "tourism" and he just waved us through. I'm hoping to have a similar uneventful experience on my upcoming trip.

 

[jis]

I have not used my Passport Book to cross into Canada and back by ground in quite a while now. Typically I use my Passport Card with CBSA to enter Canada, and my Global Entry Card with CBP to enter the US. CBP tends to just wave me through without questioning or anything when presented with the Global Entry Card. CBSA often asks inane questions no matter what.

 

[PVD]

One of the common triggers is a heavily loaded car, they will question you regarding bringing things into Canada that are heavily taxed when purchased. Trying to avoid PST/GST is a big deal.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Entering Canada has always been a pain in my experience, not just compared to Mexico but to every other country I've ever visited. In my view primary screening to enter Canada is worse than secondary screening to enter other countries, including the US. I've heard Australia is similarly unwelcoming.

 

[lstone19]

I've generally found that CBSA is far more thorough in their questioning/inspections than CBP, at least for me as a US citizen. There's been a couple times where I've been traveling along and crossing into Canada where (despite, at most, having a parking ticket on my record) I would get the full car search, secondary interview, etc. CBP is generally pretty quick and easy, with just a few questions at the border.

Well, of course. Entering your own country and entering a foreign country are completely different processes. You are always admissible to your own country so once you prove you are a U.S. citizen, the Immigration (admission of people) part of what CBP does is over; it’s only the Customs (admission of goods) part that they have to do and these days, there is more emphasis on the Immigration part than the Customs part.

OTOH, when you want to enter Canada, you first have to prove or they need to determine that you are admissible. And then they move on to the Customs part.

I’ve been in Canada three times this year - twice by cruise ship and once by air. The cruise ship entries were complete non-events (one a simple port call but the other the end of the cruise). Declaration submitted on the ship to the ship who then submits them to CBSA. I guess if CBSA has an issue with somebody, they let ship know. Everyone else is then free to walk-off without further inspection. The other by air was also largely a non-event. We have NEXUS which does expedite things but while we were asked at Immigration what our plans were in Canada (ride the Canadian), the inspector did know what that was and told us to enjoy the trip. We the proceeded through baggage claim to the CBSA Customs inspector at the exit which was simply turn in the form from the NEXUS kiosk and marked by the Immigration inspector with no further questions.

 

[Siegmund]

I've generally found that CBSA is far more thorough in their questioning/inspections than CBP, at least for me as a US citizen.

20 years ago, I would have agreed with you. Entering Canada I was often questioned quite extensively, especially on the "are you SURE you don't have any guns in the back of your truck?" type of question. (And I got the full search treatment once, as a young long-haired man who claimed he was attending a bridge tournament, which didn't sound plausible to the officer.)

But since then, the Canada entrance process has stayed about the same complexity level, while the returning-to-the-US process has gotten vastly stricter. I find going north is faster than going south almost every time now. It got worse yet again after BC legalized marijuana.

 

[MARC Rider]

By the way, I have a reservation for the 0635 Cascade departure from Vancouver to Seattle. What time should I plan on arriving at Pacific Central Station to be sure I have enough time to get through customs and immigration? (I'm in business class if that makes any difference.)

 

[01piglet_patinas]

I've generally found that CBSA is far more thorough in their questioning/inspections than CBP, at least for me as a US citizen. There's been a couple times where I've been traveling along and crossing into Canada where (despite, at most, having a parking ticket on my record) I would get the full car search, secondary interview, etc. CBP is generally pretty quick and easy, with just a few questions at the border. That said, I do have to chuckle at the one time where CBP asked us to pop our trunk when we were crossing back in, as it was deer hunting season and they wanted to make sure we weren't bringing back anything that we had recently hunted down in Canada.

Would you please explain what CBSA is and what CBP is-I am not familiar with the acronyms

 

[jis]

Would you please explain what CBSA is and what CBP is-I am not familiar with the acronyms

CBSA: Canada Border Service Agency

CBP: US Customs and Border Protection

 

[Bob Dylan]

By the way, I have a reservation for the 0635 Cascade departure from Vancouver to Seattle. What time should I plan on arriving at Pacific Central Station to be sure I have enough time to get through customs and immigration? (I'm in business class if that makes any difference.)

I'd get there @ least an Hour early Joe, say 530AM.

 

[greatwestern]

I'd get there @ least an Hour early Joe, say 530AM.

I agree.

Last time I used that service (2019) also booked in business I arrived at 5:30 and there was a queue of about 20 ahead of me (they had separate lines for business and non-business passengers). As a UK citizen I was treated somewhat differently to US/Canadian citizens and was escorted to a separate room by the US agent and told to wait (without specific explanation). Eventually an official came in, checked my documentation and asked for $6 in US currency as a processing fee and then let me out into the boarding line.

Another non US/Canadian citizen (not UK) was in the room at the same time and I remembering him having some problems as he didn't have any USA currency on him - like me he had no prior knowledge that there was a processing fee (and therefore no preparation for it).

 

[djhud]

Here's a slightly unrelated question, but, in modern times, has the border crossing to Canada ever been speedy (even in the 80's I remember it being somewhat slow) in either direction or has it always been sticky?

I have crossed on business and pleasure a number of times with no problem. But once, I took my family of five, including two young girls and our baby plus grandma & grandpa in my van to Niagara from Northern Indiana. On the return we decided to come back thru Canada on the north side of Lake Erie. I can no longer remember if we took CA 401 or 402, likely it was 402 to connect to I69. Anyway, crossing over US Customs pulled us over to give us a more thorough look for some reason. That guy screamed and spit every expletive known to man at me numerous times including numerous 'F' bombs, right in front of my family. As a minister and a higher level US government employee, I was infuriated. There was absolutely no reason for this treatment. I felt like he was baiting me for some reason but I did not bite...just kept my mouth shut even though I wanted to put him directly in the presence of Jesus. When I got back I reported the incident to Customs but never got a response. It was bizarre.

 

[01piglet_patinas]

I have not used my Passport Book to cross into Canada and back by ground in quite a while now. Typically I use my Passport Card with CBSA to enter Canada, and my Global Entry Card with CBP to enter the US. CBP tends to just wave me through without questioning or anything when presented with the Global Entry Card. CBSA often asks inane questions no matter what.

You can't use the Passport Card to come back into the United States as a US citizen? I only want to buy a Passport Card since I only want land or sea travel - no planes

 

[AmtrakMaineiac]

You can't use the Passport Card to come back into the United States as a US citizen? I only want to buy a Passport Card since I only want land or sea travel - no planes

You can use the passport card for crossing the border in both directions as long as it is a land crossing i.e. not air travel, for either Mexico or Canada.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I said riding the Canadian and was told things like "sounds like fun" and "enjoy your trip."

I was told "What is that?" and "Why are you really here?" followed by several minutes of circular logic and intentional misunderstandings.

OTOH, when you want to enter Canada, you first have to prove or they need to determine that you are admissible.

The CBSA helped disabuse me of any notion that my admissibility implied I was welcome or worthy of basic courtesy. Nobody expects border crossings to be fun or friendly but everyone has a point beyond which the desire to return vanishes and the CBSA found mine.

 

[jis]

You can't use the Passport Card to come back into the United States as a US citizen? I only want to buy a Passport Card since I only want land or sea travel - no planes

You can use a Passport Card. But Global Entry establishes that you are a vetted and trusted traveller over and above just a Passport Card.

 

[Rambling Robert]

I have two Canadian Border phone numbers
(one might be ArriveCan)
8004619999
8332837403

Either 800 number should be of help because they are very helpful/friendly about giving you information or giving you another 800 number to call. BTW I got a live voice right away.

I first crossed by car in 1973 through Calais to Saint Stephen - was fairly smooth but the return to Calais was very difficult - long lines and vetting at the booth. BUT ONLY DRIVERS LICENCES were required - no passport ha ha.

-As of July 2023 Canadian border crossing is still excepting the ArriveCan app, although not necessary, but they say that it may save some time

My October 2023 crossing-was through Calais and the Saint Stephen’s was EZPZ.

THIS WAS AMTRAK/VIARAIL:
In June 2022 mandatory use the “ArriveCan app” I took the EB to Spokane and then rented a car to Jasper. The “arrivecan app” work however, they were doing A detail vetting for every 20 vehicles. So my crossing - because of a vehicle, that was the one in 20 VETTED. ONES - took about an hour, although my time at the booth was under five minutes.

In June 2023, I took the Mapleleaf to Toronto, and in Niagara falls the amount of time spent going around from one room to another AT THE BORDER CROSSING was IMO Unnecessary. The person interrogating me was a dead ringer for Inspector Clouseau. This made it even more ridiculous.

 

[lstone19]

I was told "What is that?" and "Why are you really here?" followed by several minutes of circular logic and intentional misunderstandings.


The CBSA helped disabuse me of any notion that my admissibility implied I was welcome or worthy of basic courtesy. Nobody expects border crossings to be fun or friendly but everyone has a point beyond which the desire to return vanishes and the CBSA found mine.

I obviously don't know you but I suspect how people present themselves at the border makes a big difference. Show up reasonably well dressed (and as an airline retiree traveling on travel privileges, when I fly in I am always dressed to my airline's employee travel dress code (a t-shirt and dirty jeans does not qualify)) and you've already made the first step of showing you're low risk. Show up in tattered clothes and they're going to wonder if you have the money to support your stay in Canada. If you're driving, if you show up in a beater car with all sorts of junk in it (note earlier comment on page 1 about "old pill bottles rattling around in the back of the car") and it looks like you live in the car, I'd expect trouble.

I only have two border crossings into Canada that stand out:
- Entering at Pacific Highway (commercial crossing across from Blaine, Wa.) on the Amtrak connecting bus from the Coast Starlight where in addition to the typical questions, we were asked if we had accommodations reserved (we did).
- Entering at YYZ (Toronto airport) on a business trip, I received extra questioning until they understood I was there to meet with another business on behalf of my U.S. employer and was not seeking to be employed in Canada. And I'll admit, Canada can be tougher with their questions - similar business trips to Germany, the U.K., and Japan did not receive questioning like that.

In the last ten years, I've entered Canada about 20 times and never had an issue that suggested there were any doubts about being admitted. Most were nothing more than presenting passport (NEXUS card since getting that in 2019) and saying what the plans were and on our way we went.

 

[PVD]

The old days were so different, and sometimes amusing. I was in Windsor, Ont at one of the late Roger Neilson's coaching symposiums, and at that time, Detroit and Toronto were battling for first. Roger chartered a bus and got us tickets for the game at the old Tiger Stadium. Cross the bridge, US Customs guy hops on, "Is everyone Canadian" chorus of yesses, one lone no, sir (me) "where are you from" me: "United States" Ok, step to the front, I'll need to see your identification and suitable document. Great, the folks from another country get a wave, I have to prove I belong....

 

[Bonser]

My experience has been just the opposite. Twice entering at YVR and when asked why I was coming to Canada, I said riding the Canadian and was told things like "sounds like fun" and "enjoy your trip."

I've only entered at Rouses Pt but have done so about 10-15 times and never had an issue with Canadian Border Police. They were all friendly and thoroughly professional and never batted an eye if I mentioned rail travel on the Ocean or just walking around Montreal. And, like lstone19, always get a enjoy your trip or some such sendoff.

 

[jis]

I've only entered at Rouses Pt but have done so about 10-15 times and never had an issue with Canadian Border Police. They were all friendly and thoroughly professional and never batted an eye if I mentioned rail travel on the Ocean or just walking around Montreal. And, like lstone19, always get a enjoy your trip or some such sendoff.

You couldn’t possibly have been inspected by CBSA at Rouses Point. That is a CBP checkpoint in the US. CBSA on that route would be Lacolle in Canada. Or if way back in the past then Cantic.