This is really interesting, since New Jersey Transit already has plans to operate the same route. Amtrak proposes adding passenger train route to Scranton
Another reason why the 750 mile rule needs to go.Essentially what needs to happen is enough of a grassroots movement, in PA, NY, and NJ, to convince the PA state government to back this. The Northeastern PA counties are all for it, own the tracks within Pennsylvania, and are backing it. NJT is not opposed but is not willing to put the money in because it mostly benefits PA. PA state government has been resistant to funding in the past.
Another reason why the 750 mile rule needs to go.
It should be a state-funded train, set up jointly just as Oregon and Washington do. HOWEVER, there should be a Federal match in recognition of its contribution to interstate commerce and its contribution to the revenues of connecting trains. Congress repeatedly chiseled away at that until they reached the 100% state funding requirement.Not at all. This should be a state funded train, not federal funds. NJ and Pennsylvania can work together if they want to.
It should be a state-funded train, set up jointly just as Oregon and Washington do. HOWEVER, there should be a Federal match in recognition of its contribution to interstate commerce and its contribution to the revenues of connecting trains. Congress repeatedly chiseled away at that until they reached the 100% state funding requirement.
What about the NJT/Metro-North Line to Port Jervis? I imagine that without traffic it's much faster to drive, especially considering that you have to transfer to PATH just to get into New York City, yet the service appears to be sustainable. I would think that traffic into New York is so bad that the "slower" train won't really be that slower, and people will patronize it just to avoid having to deal with a car in Manhattan. It also boggles my mind that parts of the Poconos are included in the New York Metropolitan Statistical Area.I have my doubts about restoring service to Scranton from New York...
Even when the Lackawanna was at its peak, the journey time from that era, could never come close to today's driving time. If it came close, it might be viable, but it just takes too long to attract enough rider's to make it...
And SEPTA will have to get off its "we shall not run any diesel trains" principle too, for that to happen Maybe get some DEMUs to provide single seat ride into Suburban Station perhaps. Push comes to shove, 30th St. lower level can always be used as a termination point for diesel trains. Even those coming from the Reading side can avoid the tunnels by transferring over to the NEC by the connecting ramp that exists near North Philadelphia, though Amtrak won't be pleased with yet another conflicting traffic in that busy section.I believe service from Pottsville-Reading-Philadelphia would be a much better investment for the State, as it would probably both cost less and have more demand than Scranton-East Stroudsburg-NYC. The stations, commuter demand, and tracks are already there. I think the local transit agencies already own stations in Pottsville and Reading. A third track would probably have to be added which wouldn't be cheap, but would provide a good return on investment.
And SEPTA will have to get off its "we shall not run any diesel trains" principle too, for that to happen Maybe get some DEMUs to privde single seat ride into Suburban Station perhaps. Push comes to shove, 30th St. lower level can always be used as a termination point for diesel trains. Even those coming from the Reading side can avoid the tunnels by transfering voer top the NEC by the connecting ramp that exists near North Philadelphia, though Amtrak won;t be pleased with yet another conflicting traffic in that busy section.
While I would love to see that, again, whether via Scranton or Port Jervis routes, train service to Binghamton and beyond would just take too long compared to driving..../qgukw
I always thought that Amtrak could run a service on the Southern Tier of New York via the Lackawanna Cuttoff and Scranton. Starting in NYC, it would stop in key places such as Stroudsburg, Scranton, Binghamton, Elmira, Corning, Hornell, Buffalo with a possible terminus at Niagara Falls. If this were to happen, funding would also be provided by NY as well.
While I would love to see that, again, whether via Scranton or Port Jervis routes, train service to Binghamton and beyond would just take too long compared to driving....
I always thought that Amtrak could run a service on the Southern Tier of New York via the Lackawanna Cuttoff and Scranton. Starting in NYC, it would stop in key places such as Stroudsburg, Scranton, Binghamton, Elmira, Corning, Hornell, Buffalo with a possible terminus at Niagara Falls. If this were to happen, funding would also be provided by NY as well.
Again, have you ever actually taken the buses through here? Blech. Yuck. Ugh. They're OK until the last 30 miles outside NYC and then oh my god, they average 10 mphI have my doubts about restoring service to Scranton from New York...
Even when the Lackawanna was at its peak, the journey time from that era, could never come close to today's driving time. If it came close, it might be viable, but it just takes too long to attract enough rider's to make it...
Swampoodle! If they transfer the Chestnut Hill West line to the Reading side (as long proposed) Amtrak probably would be OK with receiving a few diesel trains from Pottsville or Reading in exchange.And SEPTA will have to get off its "we shall not run any diesel trains" principle too, for that to happen Maybe get some DEMUs to provide single seat ride into Suburban Station perhaps. Push comes to shove, 30th St. lower level can always be used as a termination point for diesel trains. Even those coming from the Reading side can avoid the tunnels by transferring over to the NEC by the connecting ramp that exists near North Philadelphia, though Amtrak won't be pleased with yet another conflicting traffic in that busy section.
In 1942, the Lackawanna Limited took 7 and 1/2 hours from Hoboken to Syracuse, 9 and 1/2 hours to Buffalo, even though its route was over 50 miles shorter...I wonder how the timekeeping would compare to the Water Level Route.
While I would love to see that, again, whether via Scranton or Port Jervis routes, train service to Binghamton and beyond would just take too long compared to driving....
True, bur not everyone--especially in New York City--has a car. And if you do happen to have one, finding a gratis parking space could take a half hour. I could never figure out why my friend went through that routine every day. He worked in the Bronx, and came home to Manhattan.
And just to add: I know folks who live near Scranton. This proposal has been on the table since the mid-80s, believe it or not.
I would agree that it is very expensive to drive and park in NYC, but plenty still do. Especially if they have a varied work schedule, and/or need their cars while there. I also agree that a lot of them ride the bus, which can clearly be seen by the Trans-Bridge, Martz, and Short Line schedules. It is interesting that there seems to be a whole lot more traffic between Northampton, Monroe, and Pike counties commuting to NYC then Philly. Seems like Monroe county especially consists mainly of ex-New Yorker's.And in Pennsylvania, most people who have cars don't drive them in New York City.
Although the bus might be a bit quicker on the schedule, many people don't like taking the bus for many reasons as well that they are much more prone to delays than trains are due to traffic. A good example would be going from Syracuse to NYC with the bus having shorter travel times but a lot of people still chose to take the train due to reliability, comfort, etc...The bus can make better time then trains can, and even cars, when using the contra-flow Lincoln Tunnel Bus Lane, eastbound...
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