National network?

[henryj]

Amtrak has too many N-S gaps.
Dallas and Houston

Miami and Chicago (via Atlanta and Nashville)

New Mexico, Denver, and Cheyenne

Pioneer/Desert Wind

I agree with this guy. Texas to Colorado and extending the Heartland Flyer to KC and MSP can be added to that list.

 

[RichardK]

My discussion started off talking about more direct service and then I morphed into expressing the need for a better network. Being able to access more major cities without having such circuitous routes would be my goal. It is quite sobering to sit here with my own "pie in the sky" ideas until a post on this forum brings me back to reality.

 

[zephyr17]

The north-south gap that someone pointed out is the big reason. There isn't any north south service between Chicago and the West Coast, for instance, as well as north-south(ish) connections like Chicago-Florida. If they could close some of those gaps, we'd have a much more comprehensive network, but that isn't going happen anytime soon.

NARP has a good, though pie-in-the-sky proposal of what a real network would look like.

Even just the day before Amtrak, the country had a much more comprehensive passenger train network, although it was being abandoned as fast as the railroads could file petitions and the ICC would let them. Almost nothing would have been left within 5 years if nothing had been done. More than half the country's passenger trains died that day, though.

 

[BCL]

My discussion started off talking about more direct service and then I morphed into expressing the need for a better network. Being able to access more major cities without having such circuitous routes would be my goal. It is quite sobering to sit here with my own "pie in the sky" ideas until a post on this forum brings me back to reality.

Like I said, it's nothing that a few billion dollars couldn't fix.


You boys know what makes this bird go up? FUNDING makes this bird go up.

He's right. No bucks, no Buck Rogers.

 

[Tennessee Traveler]

Yep, I am prejudiced. Until NASHVILLE, TN has Amtrak service there is no national service. Comparing Amtrak connections in Chicago,etc, to airline connections at multiple hubs is a non-comparable comparison. Airline connections(Nashville has excellent national and international service and 10 airlines) are more comparable to service stops such as Denver and Reno/Sparks on the CZ--besides Nashville has nonstop service to 49 cities including Los Angeles, New York(all three airports), Seattle, Toronto, Miami and most everything in between. Unfortunately, the political leadership in Tennessee is definitely anti-passenger rail. I love traveling Amtrak but every Amtrak trip requires a airline flight to begin and end my trip.

 

[PaulM]

I actually prefer the way the trains are now, having a break even if only for an hour or more between days on the train gives me a chance to get some fresh air. I love to travel as far as possible on the trains that I take, but I think without a break at the end of each train, it would be too much for even someone as crazy as I am.

I'm glad to see I''m not the only one preaching the multi-seat ride heresy.

I believe reasonable connections without going 500 miles out of the way, not one seat rides, was the OP's point.

 

[Paulus]

Amtrak has too many N-S gaps.

Dallas and Houston

Miami and Chicago (via Atlanta and Nashville)

New Mexico, Denver, and Cheyenne

Pioneer/Desert Wind

I thought that Amtrak California would love to run the San Joaquin from Oakland to Los Angeles, but SP just isn't going to let passenger trains use the Tehachapi Loop except for some rare cases.

It really just doesn't make all that much sense to do so quite frankly. It's five hours from Bakersfield to Los Angeles by train or two hours by bus.

 

[BCL]

Amtrak has too many N-S gaps.

Dallas and Houston

Miami and Chicago (via Atlanta and Nashville)

New Mexico, Denver, and Cheyenne

Pioneer/Desert Wind

I thought that Amtrak California would love to run the San Joaquin from Oakland to Los Angeles, but SP just isn't going to let passenger trains use the Tehachapi Loop except for some rare cases.

It really just doesn't make all that much sense to do so quite frankly. It's five hours from Bakersfield to Los Angeles by train or two hours by bus.

Why would it be five hours unless you're going out of your way to slow down?

I do remember when the CS was running through the Tehachapo Loop because of track maintenance elsewhere, it was a big deal on this board. However, I thought that maybe they were just trying to keep a similar schedule to the CS.

 

[Paulus]

Why would it be five hours unless you're going out of your way to slow down?
I do remember when the CS was running through the Tehachapo Loop because of track maintenance elsewhere, it was a big deal on this board. However, I thought that maybe they were just trying to keep a similar schedule to the CS.

Because it's not built for passenger speeds and it's rather longer, 150 miles, coming down through a largely single track and twisty route (Antelope Valley Subdivision/Line). Bus is 109 miles on the I-5, 3 miles of connecting streets. Even when they close the Grapevine and they have to come down through the Antelope Valley I'm fairly sure that the bus is the faster option.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

Why would it be five hours unless you're going out of your way to slow down?
I do remember when the CS was running through the Tehachapo Loop because of track maintenance elsewhere, it was a big deal on this board. However, I thought that maybe they were just trying to keep a similar schedule to the CS.

Because it's not built for passenger speeds and it's rather longer, 150 miles, coming down through a largely single track and twisty route (Antelope Valley Subdivision/Line). Bus is 109 miles on the I-5, 3 miles of connecting streets. Even when they close the Grapevine and they have to come down through the Antelope Valley I'm fairly sure that the bus is the faster option.

True. As much as the gap in connection works, the bus is the far superior option. The route is circuitous, slow and single track with sidings for almost the entire route, and goes far out of the way. The 5 is, while truck AND traffic prone (don't even get me started on the eternal jam that is Newhall Pass), the bus is faster, and more reliable. The 5 COULD be shut down, and is a few times a winter, and buses would still be faster as there is so much congestion on a Tehachapi and no way to get permanent slots.

 

[Texan Eagle]

What's the issue getting to San Francisco? There's a bus linking the Texas Eagle to the California Zephyr. And Emeryville is only 7 miles from San Francisco, with full-service buses including checked-in baggage to the San Francisco Ferry Building.

Read the OP's post carefully again. He is mentioning about inconvenience in reaching San Francisco from Dallas, which is valid and true. To go from Dallas to SF, you have to first go down to San Antonio, connect to a train that runs only three times a week to Los angeles, and then ride up the coast to Bay Area. If you happen to be traveling on a day when the Sunset does not run, then you have the ridiculous routing of having to go first to Chicago, and then ride the California Zephyr to Emeryville.

There are a couple of important "missing links" in the network in the center of the country, and the OP is right in pointing it out. An extension of Heartland Flyer to connect to Kansas and Omaha would provide Texas and Oklahoma connections to Chief and Zephyr to travel west without having to backtrack to Chicago. But as we all know, that's only something we can dream of. Not gonna happen.

 

[RichardK]

What's the issue getting to San Francisco? There's a bus linking the Texas Eagle to the California Zephyr. And Emeryville is only 7 miles from San Francisco, with full-service buses including checked-in baggage to the San Francisco Ferry Building.

Read the OP's post carefully again. He is mentioning about inconvenience in reaching San Francisco from Dallas, which is valid and true. To go from Dallas to SF, you have to first go down to San Antonio, connect to a train that runs only three times a week to Los angeles, and then ride up the coast to Bay Area. If you happen to be traveling on a day when the Sunset does not run, then you have the ridiculous routing of having to go first to Chicago, and then ride the California Zephyr to Emeryville.

There are a couple of important "missing links" in the network in the center of the country, and the OP is right in pointing it out. An extension of Heartland Flyer to connect to Kansas and Omaha would provide Texas and Oklahoma connections to Chief and Zephyr to travel west without having to backtrack to Chicago. But as we all know, that's only something we can dream of. Not gonna happen.

Yes, I could not have said it better. That is my entire point.

 

[chakk]

A book I own that I really enjoy reading again and again is

Night Trains: The Pullman System In The Golden Years Of American Rail Travel

by Peter T. Maiken

Especially the Appendix, which includes a listing of the location and consist of every train in the USA that carried Pullmans on a hypothetical night in 1952. Even then, one could go nearly EVERYWHERE via sleeping car, and often without changing cars -- even from coast to coast. Unfortunately, my travels throughout the 1950's were limited to coach travel, as my parents were not inclined to book sleepers for our family of 5 or 6.