turbo trains
- Thread starter trainfan
- Start date
Help Support Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum:
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
all ANF turbo's are scrapped and the rohr turbo's are stored in bear delaware
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
Your first picture link does not work but the other two links are the rohr turbo's they did not run in midwest.
Only the ANF's were operating there, if i am not mistaken
Only the ANF's were operating there, if i am not mistaken
Last edited by a moderator:
Hmmm - I just tried all three again and they worked fine.
Last edited by a moderator:
jamesontheroad
OBS Chief
And here's a shot (from Wikipedia) of CN's TurboTrain in the early seventies. They ran almost exclusively (although I could be wrong) between Montréal and Toronto.
I've never seen any shots of the interiors of these trains - were they relatively comfortable inside and how was the ride?
*j*
I've never seen any shots of the interiors of these trains - were they relatively comfortable inside and how was the ride?
*j*
Interestingly enough, the first time that I clicked the first link, I too got the typical "I can't find this page" from my browser. However, when I clicked refresh, the image did load the second time around.
There must be a bit of a timing issue with the site hosting the pictures.
Some of those units look vaguely similar to the Gas Turbine trains that used to run in France until a few years ago, is there any connection?
http://50031.fotopic.net/p23745368.html
http://50031.fotopic.net/p23745368.html
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
http://50031.fotopic.net/p23745368.html
you are correct the ANF turbo trains were built in France and bought as standard units if you look at the picture in Amtrak color it still shows buffer beam where the buffers were located. in between the cars the couplers aare typical hook turn buckle stylke European couplers.
Today this would no longer be possible due to more stringent FRA rules.
you are correct the ANF turbo trains were built in France and bought as standard units if you look at the picture in Amtrak color it still shows buffer beam where the buffers were located. in between the cars the couplers aare typical hook turn buckle stylke European couplers.
Today this would no longer be possible due to more stringent FRA rules.
Last edited by a moderator:
G
Guest
Guest
Yes. The Turbotrains- all three types, are not diesels, but "gas turbines". They use a special type of petroleum called "Bunker C". Union Pacific was the pioneer in gas turbines (in the 1940's). In those days, Bunker C was regarded as a waste product, and therefore quite cheap. However, in more recent times, it has been discovered that Bunker C is quite good for making certain types of plastic, and prices soared. High fuel costs are really the Turbo's only disadvantage. There are reliable, don't require costly electrification, and are very fast (The UAC Turbotrain still holds the North American speed record)As you can guess, I love the Turbos!
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
Actually bunker C was only used in UP's big blow turbine, the ANF units and the Sikorsky(UT) units ran on a kerosene based jet fuel and the Rohrs ran on regular diesel.
To run Bunker C you need preheating as was done on the big blow tender, Bunker C is like tar when cold.
Bunker fuel(from wikipedia)
Bunker fuel is technically any type of fuel oil used aboard ships. It gets its name from the containers (known as Bunker Tanks) on ships and in ports that it is stored in, called bunkers. Bunker A is No. 2 fuel oil, bunker B is No. 4 or No. 5 and bunker C is No. 6. Since No. 6 is the most common, "bunker fuel" is often used as a synonym for No. 6. No. 5 fuel oil is also called navy special fuel oil or just navy special, No. 6 or 5 are also called furnace fuel oil (FFO); the high viscosity requires heating, usually by a reticulated low pressure steam system, before the oil can be pumped from a bunker tank. In the context of shipping, the labelling of bunkers as previously described is rarely used in modern practice.
To run Bunker C you need preheating as was done on the big blow tender, Bunker C is like tar when cold.
Bunker fuel(from wikipedia)
Bunker fuel is technically any type of fuel oil used aboard ships. It gets its name from the containers (known as Bunker Tanks) on ships and in ports that it is stored in, called bunkers. Bunker A is No. 2 fuel oil, bunker B is No. 4 or No. 5 and bunker C is No. 6. Since No. 6 is the most common, "bunker fuel" is often used as a synonym for No. 6. No. 5 fuel oil is also called navy special fuel oil or just navy special, No. 6 or 5 are also called furnace fuel oil (FFO); the high viscosity requires heating, usually by a reticulated low pressure steam system, before the oil can be pumped from a bunker tank. In the context of shipping, the labelling of bunkers as previously described is rarely used in modern practice.
Last edited by a moderator:
oldtimer
OBS Chief
Omly the United Aircraft Turbos can be called Turbotrains as it is a trademarked name. They also were used by the New Haven - Penn Central and later Amtrak to provide service from Boston to New York Penn. Amtrak brought two RTG sets built by ANF from France in 1973, and later four more sets in 1975.
The RTG's were called turboliners. (the first use by Amtrak of the ----liner names, as in Superliners and Viewliners.) the RTG train sets ran on diesel fuel, but the first two had a dual fuel system that started the engines on #1 oil and ran on #2. The last four set used #2 oil in one fuel system.
The RTG's were called turboliners. (the first use by Amtrak of the ----liner names, as in Superliners and Viewliners.) the RTG train sets ran on diesel fuel, but the first two had a dual fuel system that started the engines on #1 oil and ran on #2. The last four set used #2 oil in one fuel system.
George Harris
Engineer
Maybe this is another example of the old saying, "Love is blind."
Yes, these things are fast. But, so far as I know, the record for speed on rails in North America is held by the jet powered RDC experiment done by New York Central.
My impression has been that these are very maintenance intensive pieces of equipment.
Electrification or lack thereof is a straw man. Diesel power does not require electrification either, and there are some very fast diesel trainsets out there. Aside from not having to carry around the generator of the electricity for the traction motors, the major benefit of electrification is that the source of the power can be, and should be anthing but oil.
And yes, these things are voracious fuel hogs.
Concerning the Turbos used on St. Louis to Chicago, and on to Milwaukee for a while: It was what happened when one of these things hit a garbage truck that had a lot to do with the ending of any exemption allowing the UIC hook and screw coupling. When the train compressed on impact, several of the hooks popped off, cars separated and crashed into each other.
George
had8ley
Engineer
And the wide angle view in the cab from Albany to NYP in the dead of winter with ice on the Hudson is one of my favorite rides.
jamesontheroad
OBS Chief
According to Wikipedia...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbotrain
...there's a working Turbo Train kept at the National Railway Museum in Mulhouse, in France. It's not far from here, I'd been thinking of going to have a look round. If I do, I'll post a pic. That would be the closest we could get to answering the OP's question...
*j*
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbotrain
...there's a working Turbo Train kept at the National Railway Museum in Mulhouse, in France. It's not far from here, I'd been thinking of going to have a look round. If I do, I'll post a pic. That would be the closest we could get to answering the OP's question...
*j*
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
Mullhousen is interesting museum worth the visit.
Here is picture of french RTG's same all way 5 cars just different color and interior.
Here is picture of french RTG's same all way 5 cars just different color and interior.
No, not anymore. However there is one trainset that can run, but not active. It has been stored Bear, Delaware.
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
The ANF's are cut up. the Rohr/SSS units (latest rebuilds) 3 sets are stored in Bear Delaware and will never run again due to dispute between Amtrak and state of New York.
Amtrak claims ownership and New York just spend millions rebuilding the sets, 3 more sets are at super steel schenectady in various states of rebuilding but work is stopped and no solution in sight without costly lawsuits neither Amtrak nor NYS can win.
Amtrak claims ownership and New York just spend millions rebuilding the sets, 3 more sets are at super steel schenectady in various states of rebuilding but work is stopped and no solution in sight without costly lawsuits neither Amtrak nor NYS can win.
Last edited by a moderator:
Penn Central
Train Attendant
The seventh set(There were seven total) never even made it inside the Super Steel facility, and is currently rusting in a siding, where it is likely to sit for the rest of its days 
. Since it was never disassembled for rebuilding, I suppose it could theorectcally run, although it would require some Very costly maintenence.
A Picture
. Since it was never disassembled for rebuilding, I suppose it could theorectcally run, although it would require some Very costly maintenence.A Picture
Last edited by a moderator:
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
The 7th set will need a lot cause it arrived with a blown gasturbine, it was towed by locomotive for few weeks with other powercar providing hep. the Turbine is not same as in other sets so there is big problem.
Penn Central
Train Attendant
Which is why I strongly suspect it will never run again, along with the three partially rebuilt ones. It would simply cost too much money. The three completed sets might have a chance, provided that they are being stored indoors in Delaware, although they probably aren't..
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
The Turbo's will never run again, If Amtrak uses the Turbo's, NYSDOT will slap them with a lawsuit for mis representation, fraude, theft, etc , And Amtrak will not return the sets to New York so New York can not run them.
If a third party were to buy them and repay NYSDOT , then NYSDOT could still sue if Amtrak lets them run anywhere on Amtrak network, just because Amtrak said the units are no good and are techincal nightmare, its a political no win situation.
If a third party were to buy them and repay NYSDOT , then NYSDOT could still sue if Amtrak lets them run anywhere on Amtrak network, just because Amtrak said the units are no good and are techincal nightmare, its a political no win situation.
I think it is a political no-win to keep $70 million worth of newly rebuilt high speed trainsets in storage. New York seems interested in using the Turbos for the express New York - Albany train. What else could be holding up the service?
To allow these trainsets to simply waste away after all of the money spent on them is unacceptable, and borderline criminal, imo. New York taxpayers should not allow another dime to go toward the state's high speed rail program until a use is found for the equipment that taxpayers already bought.
To allow these trainsets to simply waste away after all of the money spent on them is unacceptable, and borderline criminal, imo. New York taxpayers should not allow another dime to go toward the state's high speed rail program until a use is found for the equipment that taxpayers already bought.
Dutchrailnut
Conductor
Yes New York spend miliions on these trains but same if I spend money on my neighbours car does not give me rights to his car.
NYSDOT reneged on upgrading the Hudson line for 125 mph operation, nothing was done, so Turbo's are not needed.
second: the Turbo trains were extensivly rebuilt but supersteel schenectady failed to deliver the manuals and drawings, so Amtrak can keep up with the sets.
third : The AC was undersized and cars can not be cooled enough so Amtrak rejected the sets based on being a liability.
So no matter what its a losing deal with no end in sight other than to leave the trains stored.
NYSDOT reneged on upgrading the Hudson line for 125 mph operation, nothing was done, so Turbo's are not needed.
second: the Turbo trains were extensivly rebuilt but supersteel schenectady failed to deliver the manuals and drawings, so Amtrak can keep up with the sets.
third : The AC was undersized and cars can not be cooled enough so Amtrak rejected the sets based on being a liability.
So no matter what its a losing deal with no end in sight other than to leave the trains stored.
Latest posts
-
-
-
-
Connecticut Inland Route and Albany - Boston Corridor (Compass Service)- Latest: AmtrakMaineiac
-
-
