The next train to get a Parlor Car.

[Anderson]

Haha. I'm sure there are some people who will do that just for the PPC.

It's kinda like people upgrading to FC on the Acela just to have a meal...

I don't upgrade to FC for the meal. Yes, that's nice, but hardly the reason that I upgrade.

I upgrade for the single seat, when I'm riding solo. I upgrade for the at seat service. I upgrade for the extra AGR points. I upgrade for the lounge, even though I get that anyhow. And I upgrade for the free booze!

Ditto. I also upgraded as a way of...let's say making it easier that I was going to an old girlfriend's wedding (we've always been close...just not in a "romantic" way; I've known her since we were three, etc.). It was definitely worth it, and if I take the Acela again, I'm definitely going to consider FC if it's in the budget...all of those perks you mentioned make it worth the upgrade.

The only thing not on my list is the free booze, and that's because I don't drink.

 

[TransitGeek]

And I upgrade for the free booze!

See, now you've got me reconsidering paying for an Acela ride. I'm wondering how wasted one could get between BOS and WAS without being either cut off or thrown off.

 

[jphjaxfl]

Separate Lounge Cars for First Class passengers were very common right up until Amtrak. Nearly all the long distance from Chicago to the west coast that weren't all Pullman had some sort of seperate lounge for Sleeping Car passengers. Many times the first class lounges had some revenue rooms in them like the Dome Observation Lounges of the California Zepyhr. It might be possible for Amtrak to build some Superliner Sleepers that have a seperate lounge on the upper or lower levels. They would need to increase the cost of a sleeping room to offset the lack of revenue of the rooms that would need to be taken out. This would not be a Parlor as was previoulsy described.

 

[Anderson]

Separate Lounge Cars for First Class passengers were very common right up until Amtrak. Nearly all the long distance from Chicago to the west coast that weren't all Pullman had some sort of seperate lounge for Sleeping Car passengers. Many times the first class lounges had some revenue rooms in them like the Dome Observation Lounges of the California Zepyhr. It might be possible for Amtrak to build some Superliner Sleepers that have a seperate lounge on the upper or lower levels. They would need to increase the cost of a sleeping room to offset the lack of revenue of the rooms that would need to be taken out. This would not be a Parlor as was previoulsy described.

Actually, that's a good question. I know you have a crew lounge in the Transdorm...I wonder if you couldn't make for something nice using half of the upstairs area.(say, replace either the bedrooms or the roomettes with a lounge area).

Also, it just hit me...it'd have to be a bit surreal going into one of the PPCs as someone who'd been in the same cars a few times when they were in service on the El Capitan back in the day. I know there had to be a couple of folks who ended up in that position.

 

[AlanB]

And I upgrade for the free booze!

See, now you've got me reconsidering paying for an Acela ride. I'm wondering how wasted one could get between BOS and WAS without being either cut off or thrown off.

Well as long as one can hold one's liquor to the point where one isn't doing stupid things, one can get quite wasted. I've had 5 glasses of wine just between Boston & NY, which is pretty much a full bottle of wine. Just remember that you still have to walk once you get off the train in DC!

Note: It's best to pick drinks that mix well, just in case they run out of your favorite. Beer & wine of course are best for that, not that you want to mix the two, but going from red to white or one label to another beer label isn't usually a problem.

 

[The Davy Crockett]

And I upgrade for the free booze!

See, now you've got me reconsidering paying for an Acela ride. I'm wondering how wasted one could get between BOS and WAS without being either cut off or thrown off.

Sounds like you will need to do this in the name of "research"! :lol:

I've upgraded to First Class only once = this last February - but will do it again when traveling solo. The single seat is pretty sweet.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

While what you say us true, most times, the sleepers on the CS are full departing LAX. They almost empty out by SJC, OKJ or EMY. Then they refill with people connecting off the CZ at either EMY or SAC going north. Thus, the CS sells out the sleepers twice per trip for a 1 night trip!

I just hope Amtrak saves a full length sleeper ticket for me when I finally get a chance to head out there.

So how is it "eating into profits"?

If the CS never runs into any problems with short-distance riders preventing long-distance tickets then maybe it doesn't.

See, now you've got me reconsidering paying for an Acela ride. I'm wondering how wasted one could get between BOS and WAS without being either cut off or thrown off.

You could buy more than enough booze to get yourself completely wasted and add a nice hotel room to sleep it off for the extra $200 it takes to move from a North East Regional ticket to First Class on Acela. Or at least those were the prices I was seeing.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

You could buy more than enough booze to get yourself completely wasted and add a nice hotel room to sleep it off for the extra $200 it takes to move from a North East Regional ticket to First Class on Acela. Or at least those were the prices I was seeing.

A nice hotel room? I'm assuming you mean it will look nice after the beer goggles because those rooms aren't cheap. And I don't know about you, but drinking alone in a hotel or in a bar I am unfamiliar with just isn't all that appealing.

Acela FC is a nice place to get your buzz on, people are friendly, the train feels cool, and you also get the meal and you can pretend you're a bigshot (if you aren't one already).

It's not about practicality it's about having a little fun.

 

[Ryan]

Exactly - the bottle and a half of wine that I drank from WAS to BBY would have been much cheaper to buy on my own, but the entire experience was certainly worth the extra bucks for a special weekend.

 

[Peter KG6LSE]

And I upgrade for the free booze!

See, now you've got me reconsidering paying for an Acela ride. I'm wondering how wasted one could get between BOS and WAS without being either cut off or thrown off.

forget playing beat the bar tender My link .Play beat the car tender . :blink:

I have only once had a "drink"on a train .

And that was so I could use my credit card " in some way "..

as a way to tip my DCA I had who remembers me from a trip I made last year ..

I had no cash on me at the time .

Peter

 

[amamba]

And I upgrade for the free booze!

See, now you've got me reconsidering paying for an Acela ride. I'm wondering how wasted one could get between BOS and WAS without being either cut off or thrown off.

On my first FC trip between PVD and PHL I received five little airplane bottles of jack daniels. I was pretty toasted by arrival.

Although, that was the only time I have been actually served the little bottles to mix the drink myself. Most of the attendants will mix the drink for you and bring it to you in the lowball glass.

Additionally, I almost had to switch to the other whiskey that they have because at that point they ran out of Jack daniels.

Lastly, I will say that I have been saving my AGR points for the FC upgrade coupons. I think its a pretty good deal. You can get 5 of them for 10,000 points, and I haven't yet had a problem where I have been unable to upgrade. I have ridden FC on the acela on all of my acela trips over the past year and it has been so amazing that I feel like I can't go back to BC - I am spoiled! Of course, this year the upgrade coupons I got with my points were only 12 hour upgrade coupons - I wonder if you are select plus if they send you the 48 hour ones?

But, it is certainly something that I really wouldn't be doing if I was paying the accomodation upgrade/charge myself, unless I got a pretty low bucket on the fare to begin with (like the $99 BOS - NYP low bucket fare). Additionally, the fact that I can ride FC on acela has pushed me to take the train over flying on the PVD - PHL run. My parents live outside of PHL so that is a common destination for me.

 

[AlanB]

See, now you've got me reconsidering paying for an Acela ride. I'm wondering how wasted one could get between BOS and WAS without being either cut off or thrown off.

You could buy more than enough booze to get yourself completely wasted and add a nice hotel room to sleep it off for the extra $200 it takes to move from a North East Regional ticket to First Class on Acela. Or at least those were the prices I was seeing.

Except that you can't drink your own booze onboard the train.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

A nice hotel room? I'm assuming you mean it will look nice after the beer goggles because those rooms aren't cheap.

I found three-star hotels in BOS, NYC, and WDC for around a hundred per night. I guess if you require five-star rooms they won't be acceptable to you, but for me they're fine. On the other hand if a hundred dollar bar tab isn't enough to get you wasted then you might have a drinking problem.

And I don't know about you, but drinking alone in a hotel or in a bar I am unfamiliar with just isn't all that appealing. Acela FC is a nice place to get your buzz on, people are friendly, the train feels cool, and you also get the meal and you can pretend you're a bigshot.

I'm not sure why you equate hotels with lousy bars or drinking alone. Or why you're hesitant to explore anything you're not already familiar with. Some of the nicest bars I've ever seen were in hotels, and I can think of a dozen hotels that made me feel like more of a big-shot than a "free" $200 drink on Acela ever could.

Except that you can't drink your own booze onboard the train.

You don't think $100 to spend on Amtrak drinks would be enough to get any normal person messed up?

 

[Ispolkom]

Except that you can't drink your own booze onboard the train.

Unless you're in a sleeper. That's why the last time we traveled between New York and Washington, we took a roomette on the Crescent (we were ticketed to Alexandria, actually). We still got dinner in the diner, and the social separation of Club Acela at Penn Station(especially pleasant on the day before Thanksgiving). But we also got an assigned compartment, which had a door to mute the cellphone talkers. Best of all, it cost less than two Acela First Class tickets, even including the cost of sparkling wine we drank, and the half bottle of wine we bought at dinner. Heck, I think we even had a predinner aperitif with Wayman on that trip.

Still, we're curious about Acela, so I canceled our tickets next month on the regional and Mrs. Ispolkom used some AGR points to book us from Washington to New York Penn in Acela First. We'll see how much liquor we can get outside of, how the food compares to usual Amlunches, and how many cellphone-using loudmouths there are on a midday Saturday train.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

A little terminology note. A parlor car was a revenue ticketed assigned space car for day use superior to coaches. Somewhat like business class or Acela first class.

Parlor cars represented a luxury ticketed space before most coaches had air conditioning and reclining seats. As coaches improved parlor cars became a bit redundant.

Te use of the term "parlor" in Pacific Parlour Car is just a ploy on alliteration. It sounds good and catchy, and is good. It is a neat car and I am glad Amtrak maintains it. But the the title is a bit on the misleading side. The PPC is really a specialized lounge car....it is not a true parlor car in the sense of assigned ticketed space as an alternative to coaches.

In the preAmtrak days parlor cars did operate all over the country but they were always especially heavy in the NE corrider.

 

[railiner]

The Pacific Parlour Cars are really highlevel lounge cars built for the all coach El Capitain that Santa Fe operated from Chicago to Los Angeles so not as upscale as true Parlor Cars. Up until the time of Amtrak, Espee operated a real Parlour Lounge Observation Car on the Coast Daylight from Los Angeles to San Francisco. When it was still running, the Shasta Daylight from Portland to Oakland carried a Parlor Lounge Observation Cars as well as the Daylight train from Los Angeles via Bakersfield to Oakland. The only service that Amtrak offers that would be similar to Parlor Car service would Acela First Class where meals and beverages are served at your seat which was an option on Parlor Cars. In the early days of Amtrak, Parlor cars were operated on some Northeast Corridor trains plus 2 routes in the midwest.

I believe that this definition of 'parlor car' has been discussed here previously, but essentially, you are correct. The original 'parlor car' was a railroad or Pullman Company operated First Class ticket plus seat charge required deluxe revenue reserved chair car for daytime travel. They usually had revolving, reclining extra roomy seats, arranged only one row on each side of the aisle, with a small table that would fold up from the side of the car. They had porter service who would serve beverages and sometimes meals from a small galley or adjacent diner. Some of them had a drawing room that could accommodate 6 or 7 for meetings. Others had a separate non-reserved lounge area, which could be in the form of a 'Skytop' or 'bullet'.

Amtrak's PPC is entirely different, aside from being a Hi-Level. It is a non-revenue lounge car that is reserved for those holding sleeping car accommodations. Someone at Amtrak thought that the name 'parlor car' had a nice 'ring' to it...that it sounded like a 'posh' accommodation, and that it was a long time since anyone traveled in the old definition, so there would be no confusion as to its meaning.

The concept is very nice, and would be great if it were expanded to other routes.

A little terminology note. A parlor car was a revenue ticketed assigned space car for day use superior to coaches. Somewhat like business class or Acela first class.

Parlor cars represented a luxury ticketed space before most coaches had air conditioning and reclining seats. As coaches improved parlor cars became a bit redundant.

Te use of the term "parlor" in Pacific Parlour Car is just a ploy on alliteration. It sounds good and catchy, and is good. It is a neat car and I am glad Amtrak maintains it. But the the title is a bit on the misleading side. The PPC is really a specialized lounge car....it is not a true parlor car in the sense of assigned ticketed space as an alternative to coaches.

In the preAmtrak days parlor cars did operate all over the country but they were always especially heavy in the NE corrider.

They were heavy in the NE, indeed. So heavy in fact, that I believe the premier train on the old New Haven, the Merchants Limited, at one time in its heyday, was entirely consisted of parlor cars!

 

[Anderson]

Terminology question: What's a club car? My main exposure to them is from old Looney Tunes/Merrie Melodies gags (one where the "club car" alternates between having a bar brawl in it and having a cabaret show going on...somehow I suspect being outside the "normal" fare of said cars. Call it a hunch) which, for obvious reasons, are showing their age.

Also, how did this vary from the "Metroclub" cars on the Metroliners (which seem to have been a predecessor to the FC on Acela and nothing else)?

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Terminology question: What's a club car? My main exposure to them is from old Looney Tunes/Merrie Melodies gags (one where the "club car" alternates between having a bar brawl in it and having a cabaret show going on...somehow I suspect being outside the "normal" fare of said cars. Call it a hunch) which, for obvious reasons, are showing their age.

Also, how did this vary from the "Metroclub" cars on the Metroliners (which seem to have been a predecessor to the FC on Acela and nothing else)?

Club lounge and also tavern lounge are some of the names for a lounge car.

The subject of lounge car and dining car terminology is quite interesting. You would enjoy old timetables. Cars which include food would be diner lounge, grill lounge,etc. Names indicating lower cost dining would be coffee shop lounge, snack lounge etc.

Keep in mind that there were many different railroads and they did not have to have a nationally consistent set of names for things.

Some cars of a lounge car type would also include a parlor section. Keep in mind though that a parlor car is like a coach, a sleeper or a slumbercoach. It is actual assigned space, not be confused with a lounge even though the same car may have a lounge section.

 

[GlobalistPotato]

So an all-Parlor car train would be the corridor version of an all-Pullman sleeper car?

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

So an all-Parlor car train would be the corridor version of an all-Pullman sleeper car?

Yes, both sleepers and parlor cars were considered first class. Any train which had a first class lounge and parlor cars, the parlor passengers as well as the sleeper passengers were allowed in the lounge.

I do not think there were many all parlor car trains besides the Merchants Limited, but if they were they were considered all first class.

There was a time when Long Island RR had parlor cars going out to Montauk. Some parlor cars had private rooms,like drawing rooms, probably not used for beds but for private friends or family space, good for private parties with 3 or people.

To re iterate:

coaches

sleepers (or "pullmans")

slumbercoaches

parlor cars

were ALL ticketed revenue space.

As oppposed to domes, lounges, diners, observation cars, etc.

Some parlor cars, many in fact, were combined with other kind of space in the car, such as parlor lounge. The parlor part would be reserved space, the lounge would be a place to wander to if you desired, just like today.

Again, "Pacific Parlor Car" is all about a catchy sounding alliteration, very clever, very neat. But it does kind of confuse the situation by leading people to think that a parlor car is a specialized lounge car. It is not. A parlor car is where you space is. A lounge, includng PPC, is a place to volutarily visit.

Ad mentioned in my earlier post, parlor cars decreased somewhat as coaches improved.

Some people who are more purist than I do not like comparing business class or Acela first class with parlor cars. but I think it is close enough to make sense. Exact seating etc can vary. I have seen parlor cars which were a long row of single seats on both sides

One thing I try to point out from time to time is that there were many railroads, they were not responsible to each other, they could call anything anything. There was not a consistent national corporation like Amtrak. To study the old lines be prepared for considerable variety.

For a few years there was a parlor dome on what was then called the Southern Crescent. This car was originally on the Wabash Railroad from Chicago to St. Louis. It ran on the Southern Crescent from Atlanta to New Orleans. The downstairs was reserved parlor space, the dome above was for all passengers.I think some people on it were confused and they thought the downstairs was a lounge.

 

[had8ley]

So an all-Parlor car train would be the corridor version of an all-Pullman sleeper car?

Yes, both sleepers and parlor cars were considered first class. Any train which had a first class lounge and parlor cars, the parlor passengers as well as the sleeper passengers were allowed in the lounge.

I do not think there were many all parlor car trains besides the Merchants Limited, but if they were they were considered all first class.

There was a time when Long Island RR had parlor cars going out to Montauk. Some parlor cars had private rooms,like drawing rooms, probably not used for beds but for private friends or family space, good for private parties with 3 or people.

Bill;

I still get invitations from the LIRR to make parlor car res to Montauk and all points west that it stops. (I think Speonk or maybe Islip is the first stop)and have been for quite some time. Maybe Alan can fill us in. Also wondering if it retained the name "Cannonball?" I'm still of the opinion that the surplus of CCC's could be put to good use by adjusting the dining area into a parlor area; don't have to have single seats but it would a whole lot better than building a car from the ground up when these CCC's are sitting somewhere with birds building nests in the drawbars instead of 3 mil or more to build a new PPC.

 

[GlobalistPotato]

Again, "Pacific Parlor Car" is all about a catchy sounding alliteration, very clever, very neat. But it does kind of confuse the situation by leading people to think that a parlor car is a specialized lounge car. It is not. A parlor car is where you space is. A lounge, includng PPC, is a place to volutarily visit.

So really, my thread was "What LD train will get a fancy new lounge?"

I wonder if Amtrak does some whole research and marketing campaign to see what first-class travelers would like in a new "upscale" lounge. This "upscale lounge" would be similar for both the LD trains and any potential high speed trains.

So I have to imagine Amtrak having a "modern upscale lounge" that looks like a nightclub, with a rave and everything.

Like thieeeees:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&rls=en&tbm=isch&q=modern+nightclub&revid=1639246113&sa=X&ei=USanTa_zCrC60QGAiLX5CA&ved=0CDcQ1QIoBA&biw=1861&bih=993

Hehe. Some of those nightclubs remind me of a laser tag arena.

WHAT NEXT AM I GOING TO PROPOSE NEXT? Laser tag on Amtrak?

Hey, maybe it's more likely than Amtrak turning profitable...

 

[The Davy Crockett]

Again, "Pacific Parlor Car" is all about a catchy sounding alliteration, very clever, very neat. But it does kind of confuse the situation by leading people to think that a parlor car is a specialized lounge car. It is not. A parlor car is where you space is. A lounge, includng PPC, is a place to volutarily visit.

So really, my thread was "What LD train will get a fancy new lounge?"

I wonder if Amtrak does some whole research and marketing campaign to see what first-class travelers would like in a new "upscale" lounge. This "upscale lounge" would be similar for both the LD trains and any potential high speed trains.

So I have to imagine Amtrak having a "modern upscale lounge" that looks like a nightclub, with a rave and everything.

Like thieeeees:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&rls=en&tbm=isch&q=modern+nightclub&revid=1639246113&sa=X&ei=USanTa_zCrC60QGAiLX5CA&ved=0CDcQ1QIoBA&biw=1861&bih=993

Hehe. Some of those nightclubs remind me of a laser tag arena.

WHAT NEXT AM I GOING TO PROPOSE NEXT? Laser tag on Amtrak?

Hey, maybe it's more likely than Amtrak turning profitable...

From the pictures of nightclubs in your link, I'm thinking it is too bad you never got a chance to see the original (pre Amtrak) Autotrain, or the lounge car on the Montrealer, "Le Pub" - with its piano. While certainly "low tech" by today's standards, and not necessarily 'First Class," they each had their own distinctive look and feel - in contrast to the almost uniform sterileness of today's lounge cars on Amtrak.

 

[Anderson]

The more I've heard about it, the more I've wished I could've taken the Montrealer. Then again, I also found out on Tuesday that an older guy I know took the original CZ (the three-RR project) in a Pullman (and he really liked it). There are so many things to "check off the boxes" on out there (and, for the record, this is why I'm looking into taking a berth at least once before Via phases them out...in forty years I'll wish I had, just as I know that if it was forty years ago right now, I'd have been burning through a tangible fortune running on a bunch of soon-to-be-discontinued/cut back trains).

 

[railiner]

The more I've heard about it, the more I've wished I could've taken the Montrealer. Then again, I also found out on Tuesday that an older guy I know took the original CZ (the three-RR project) in a Pullman (and he really liked it). There are so many things to "check off the boxes" on out there (and, for the record, this is why I'm looking into taking a berth at least once before Via phases them out...in forty years I'll wish I had, just as I know that if it was forty years ago right now, I'd have been burning through a tangible fortune running on a bunch of soon-to-be-discontinued/cut back trains).

Join the club! It is better to do it and regret spending the money, then not doing it and regret never to get another chance....

In the final year or so of railroad operated California Zephyr, they ran some newspaper ads. extolling the trains virtues, and ended with an ominous warning: "...while you can!".

They were right, as in 1970, a year before Amtrak, the WP portion of the train was discontinued. Forever.