Ice, Coffee, Water, and Tips

[librarian]

My wife and I returned from our train trip which included the Capitol Ltd., California Zephyr, Coast Starlight, and the Southwest Chief in a trip that started and ended in Pittsburgh. Thinking of issues discussed over the past weeks, I looked for answers during our trip spanning May 17 - June 4.

Ice was not available for passengers to access on any of these trains as in the past. Your Sleeping Car Attendant had to retrieve ice upon request in a cardboard bucket. I understand the reason, and it was not a problem if your attendant was available for the service.

Full sized bottles of water were placed in sleeper rooms at the beginning of the trip on each train, and the Sleeping Car Attendant would generally provide additional bottles upon request.

The Coffee Urn in the Sleepers operates from 6 am - 11 am only, perhaps a bit longer until the pot is exhausted of coffee. Juices were the same schedule, or until the container was empty.

Dining Car Menus are new, but the same on all trains. Even the specials are the same. The new salads are nice, and all staff we encountered in the Dining Cars were pleasant and service-oriented, but they are serving the SAME food all the time. All the food we were served was good, but once you pass 6,000 miles on a trip, you realize that it is the SAME.

After recent tipping questions, I made a casual note to observe tipping in the Dining Cars and with Red Cap service, and was surprised to note that half of the passengers seem to leave NO tip at all for either service.

Service in the Metropolitan Lounge in Chicago was excellent and pleasant, except for one snippy comment made to me that was unnecessary. Service in the new Los Angeles Metropolitan Lounge was great, what a lovely facility. Red Cap service there seems necessary due to the need to cross active railroad tracks and the distance to the platform.

The Pacific Parlour Car on our Coast Starlight was completely useless, as no meal times were available when I asked, and the same people seemed permanently parked in the soft seats in the car.

The Capitol Ltd. was using the CCC Cross Country Cars for Dining Cars, meaning that the available capacity restricted the number of meals that could be served. In addition, the other end of the CCC car was used as the sales point for the snack sales, while the downstairs of the Lounge Car was closed. The staff seemed to be using the four tables for their office in the snack end of the CCC, none of which was working well.

 

[KmH]

On my recent trip Iowa to Oregon and back on the CZ/CS I also noted quite a few pax that didn't tip at all, or tipped a minimal amount for dining car, baggage storage, and red cap services.

 

[Lonestar648]

I have also found that a surprising number of pax did not tip in the DC on most trains. On a CL one couple told me that the workers are highly paid and do not need tips, which I challenged them, but many I think meals included includes the tipping. When service is good I have always been a generous tipper and make it a point that others know I am tipping which I believe has forced some to follow my lead.

 

[TinCan782]

People may tip less but, its not the SCA's fault...they are just following the rules and/or still trying to provide good service which I (we) appreciate.

My last experience was last July on the Coast Starlight (AGR bedroom redemption). The SCA's did (in defiance with the new rules) make a second pot of coffee each morning, bring more bottled water and ice on request. We'll see how my upcoming trip LA to DC plays out.

 

[BuffaloBoy]

I just don't get it. I have always traveled coach because I can't afford sleepers and have noticed while eating in various dining cars how little or nothing SOME 1st class passengers cheap out on tips and I have felt squeamish to be sitting at the same table with them when it's time to settle up. I have seen more coach passengers cheap out as well, to be fair. Part of the reason that I do coach on my limited budget is that there are times that I might have been able to squeak out the price of a roomette but I wouldn't have enough cash left to be able to tip properly so I stay with coach. I make sure I have enough 1s,5s,and 10s in my wallet for tips and grab a good nights sleep in a Chicago hotel mid trip, which is way cheaper than a roomette, as long as I don't hit the bars! I have read a lot of rants from Amtrak passengers about their service and just wonder sometimes why they got bad service. Tips get you happy service most of the time anywhere and on LD trains it gets you happier service as the trip goes on. I am happy to announce that I am going to have a roomette on part of my next trip for the first time after so many years of traveling and you bet your booty I will establish a good relationship with the crew right from the gitgo. It may not make a difference to lazy crew members (I have never met one) but I think that tipping decently will make my trip better anyway. At the least, I will feel good about myself.

 

[shelzp]

I tip. But on a recent trip I forgot to leave one in the dining car after lunch. I think it was because I seldom eat in there since I prefer to have meals brought to my room. Anyway when I got back to my room I put my hand in my pocket and the money was still there so I turned around to go back and stick it on the table and when I was entering the car I ran into the couple I had been seated with. The man asked if I had left something behind and I said no but that I had forgotten to leave a tip. He told me he left a $5 under my plate for me. I thanked him and tried to reimburse him but he said it was no problem and they hoped we'd meet again at dinner.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I give what I consider good tips to SCA's for providing easy and timely access to ice, water, juice, and coffee throughout my trip. These are items which are tedious to pack and carry due to volume and weight so when they're provided by the train staff that is a major benefit to me. Conversely, if such services are reduced or discontinued then I have a lot more weight to drag around with me and my desire to tip is substantially reduced.

I don't have enough vacation time to travel by Amtrak exclusively so nearly every trip includes at least one flight. That often makes packing these items at home impossible and would likely require me to buy my drinks at airport prices. Ice is basically impossible for me to bring in any worthwhile quantity. These changes are a major inconvenience to me and the fix eats into the same budget that provides the tip.

If the SCA doesn't want their tip spent on items replacing what Amtrak previously provided as part of the ticket then perhaps they could consider bringing their own supplies to augment Amtrak's remaining provisions. So far as I know most SCA's are not flying into their post. It would seem that the SCA's are uniquely positioned to purchase and store extra water and juice and coffee and indeed some have done so.

That way the passengers are able to get what they need and the SCA's are able to retain their tips. Everbody wins. Except the diner crew. In the past couple years the quality and variety of Amtrak food has fallen substantially while the delays, confusion, and general grouchiness have remained the same or even increased. As a result it sounds entirely probable that people who fail to leave a tip are not confused so much as dissatisfied.

-DA

 

[seat38a]

Still writing the trip report but in regards to tipping on our trip two weeks ago on the CS and Empire Builder, when we boarded the train, we tipped the SCA $5/ person per night to start. At the end of the trip if the service was great, we gave them the other half and more. My parents and I did notice a difference in service on both occasions. In the dinning car, we left tips for every meal. So far on 3 trips on LD trains, this method really does seem to work out well.

With the dining car, weather you leave a tip or not on your first visit does seem to set the service with the waiter for the rest of the meals you will have on the train. With the SCA, it also does seem to put one at the higher end of who gets more attention or not. My conclusion is, that "NO", "CAN'T", and quoting policy are things that never shows up during the trip if you tip.

 

[neroden]

Under no circumstances whatsoever does it make sense to tip for genuinely bad service. I leave generous tips for good service, and particularly for anything above-and-beyond, but for bad service... no way. Tipping in advance is just bribery, and it doesn't always work, either; it doesn't prevent disappearing SCAs or hostile dining car staff.

The dining car... yeah, I used to tip reliably and well. I've stopped because the service has stopped being satisfactory on the last several trips. This could just be flukes. If I get decent service again, I'll tip again.

I've tipped most of my SCAs well, but I try to avoid tipping the disappearing ones who can't be arsed to show up in the sleeping car for over four hours at a time during the day. Honestly, if you tip the shirkers, does it give the good workers any incentive to do any work?

 

[caravanman]

I am genuinely STUNNED that Devils Advocate thinks that employees should pay for items to replace those dropped by Amtrak?

A lot of publicity states that sleepers are fully inclusive. Many foreign visitors will not be aware of the USA tipping codes, it seems much more optional overseas.

The thing that annoyed me most about this report was the fact that staff are blocking the tables from fare paying passengers... not a great way to improve revenue...

I would be rather annoyed if I did not leave a tip due to bad service, and someone else put in their cash instead. That's not the case above, but still...

Ed

 

[AG1]

I am genuinely STUNNED that Devils Advocate thinks that employees should pay for items to replace those dropped by Amtrak?

A lot of publicity states that sleepers are fully inclusive. Many foreign visitors will not be aware of the USA tipping codes, it seems much more optional overseas.

The thing that annoyed me most about this report was the fact that staff are blocking the tables from fare paying passengers... not a great way to improve revenue...

I would be rather annoyed if I did not leave a tip due to bad service, and someone else put in their cash instead. That's not the case above, but still...

Ed

There is no USA tipping code. Tipping is not required by USA law or regulation. Amtrak states tipping is optional.

Nobody has the right to tell you to tip, not to tip, or how much to tip. Don't be pressured or brainwashed by others to do something which is 100% voluntary on your part. Unfortunately, some people feel it is their purpose in life to impose their personal actions on others.

 

[FormerOBS]

Unless policy has changed --- and I'll be STUNNED if it has --- FDA rules say Amtrak employees are not permitted to serve consumable items that are not supplied by Amtrak. This is supposedly a guarantee of consistent quality and a protection of the customer, as well as a policy designed to prevent lawsuits. If the SCA provides ice, water, coffee, juice, coffee creamers, sugar, tea bags, candy, cookies, etc. from a private, non-Amtrak supply, he can get in trouble. Some do it anyway because they care. Some refuse to do it because they are scared to.

So I say first, if you want SCA's to continue to do this, please don't tell the Company they are doing it. That's a sure way to end the practice, and possibly get somebody fired. And second, don't punish an SCA who is scared to break a rule for you. Some managers can be #*$#@!@@W%.

Tom

 

[OBS]

No Tom, the policy has not changed. And I will agree with everything else you said as well....

 

[Chey]

I have also found that a surprising number of pax did not tip in the DC on most trains. On a CL one couple told me that the workers are highly paid and do not need tips, which I challenged them, but many I think meals included includes the tipping. When service is good I have always been a generous tipper and make it a point that others know I am tipping which I believe has forced some to follow my lead.

Yeah, my first sleeper trip, it didn't occur to us to tip the SCA till we saw someone else do that. Realizing that it was a reasonable thing to do - especially since we had a GREAT one - I've made sure I have enough tip money every trip. But I do tip the really good ones more.

 

[caravanman]

Many workers use tips to make up their low pay to a living wage, maybe not on Amtrak, but there is a "norm" to expect a tip in the USA, rather than it being an unexpected bonus.

The idea that a SCA not be rewarded for good service because the passenger has spent the tip on buying water or juice seems a tad like "blaming the messenger, not the corporation chairman"...?

I dislike the whole master and servant thing about tipping, it should not be required or expected... just so uncomfortable!

Ed.

 

[George K]

In the dining car, when you guys tip (assuming you're a sleeper passenger and purchased some wine or a beer), do you add the tip to the credit card, or leave extra cash?

It's been my impression that cash is preferred by waitstaff in restaurants.

Same here?

 

[JayPea]

I use cash when tipping in the diner. That's just my personal preference and I have gotten the impression that it's also the personal preference of the waitstaff in the diner as well.

 

[fillyjonk]

I tend to figure tipping the SCA is more for "service" than it is for having water, ice, etc. available. I certainly APPRECIATE bottled water being available but if I got an SCA who provided water but was unavailable to help with making up/putting up the bed, or who didn't help with luggage, I wouldn't tip them.

And I tip in the dining car. Being in sleeper, I don't have a bill (I don't drink, so I don't buy alcohol) so I always make sure I have a stash of 1s and 5s with me for tips.

I've seen some people hand the money directly to the waitstaff; I prefer to leave it on the table.

 

[Dakota 400]

For the Sleeping Car Attendant, the Dining Car Staff, and the Lounge Car Attendant, any tips that I leave, and I will always do so for the SC and DR and at the end of the trip for the Lounge Car person, the gratuity will be in cash.

 

[BuffaloBoy]

Mr. Devils Advocate, I find your response totally insane. I normally like your stuff, but not this time. And FormerOBS you got that right my friend. RRick, I have no comment, I just want to say..........cheap get's what cheap does.

 

[BuffaloBoy]

I also realize that I am acting like a web troll, and from here on in I will keep my comments civil. My apologies if I have offended anyone.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

If SCA's were making less than minimum wage without tips this would be a very different discussion. However, SCA's already make good money. I don't need them to bother with any of the things most passengers require (helping with luggage, making beds, explaining the controls, etc). Like anyone else I tip based on how they handle those services I do need. That means I tip based on the availability of water, juice, ice, and coffee. They are under no obligation to provide any of those things just like I'm under no obligation to tip them. However, if they choose to go above and beyond I'm more than willing to reward their effort with a tip. That view seems perfectly reasonable to me.

A lot of publicity states that sleepers are fully inclusive. Many foreign visitors will not be aware of the USA tipping codes, it seems much more optional overseas. The thing that annoyed me most about this report was the fact that staff are blocking the tables from fare paying passengers... not a great way to improve revenue.

I'm surprised you think this is a reasonable assumption. Can you name a single US focused travel website or guidebook that fails to discuss US tipping culture? Even here on AU we have discussed tipping hundreds if not thousands of times. I have never come across a foreign visitor who seemed genuinely unaware that American culture included widespread and routine tipping. Many may disagree with the idea of tipping for any number of reasons, but in my experience most if not all of them are at least aware of it. Knowledge of American tipping culture is so pervasive at this point that tips from American visitors are often anticipated even in cultures that traditionally eschew tips. The only country where a tip of mine was ever declined was Japan. Everywhere else my tip was happily accepted if not outright encouraged.

I'll be STUNNED if it has --- FDA rules say Amtrak employees are not permitted to serve consumable items that are not supplied by Amtrak. This is supposedly a guarantee of consistent quality and a protection of the customer, as well as a policy designed to prevent lawsuits. If the SCA provides ice, water, coffee, juice, coffee creamers, sugar, tea bags, candy, cookies, etc. from a private, non-Amtrak supply, he can get in trouble. Some do it anyway because they care. Some refuse to do it because they are scared to.

A more reasonable regulator would state that the SCA merely has to inform you that it's not an "official" Amtrak product, which ironically would mean it's probably a name brand rather than some generic commissary supplier nobody has ever heard of, and then let the customer decide for themselves. Instead FDA joins a long list of arbitrary market manipulators beholden to interests that are often unrelated to their core purpose. Meanwhile our officially sanctioned ice cream, peanut butter, tomatoes, chillies, lettuce, cucumbers, pomegranates, beef, chicken, pork, and eggs are routinely contaminated without serious punishment or recourse. Most of the time America's regulators don't even know anything happened until dozens or even hundreds are already injured or dead.

 

[leacrane]

Red Caps...they all seem to work their butts off and as someone with a disability they provide invaluable service getting my baggage and me on the train before the masses. I always tip 2.00 bag

min 5

Dining car staff. Huge range of service from good to rude/slow/incompetent. I know that unlike waiters in a restaurant these folks make good salaries with benefits that I never got. So I will never tip 15% of the absurd prices on menu. A couple bucks for good service. Zero for lousy service

SCA s. . same as above. Large disparity in service. If the SCA gets my bags to and from my room makes my bed and is friendly.. tip up to 10.00. Unfortunately I've had a couple who could not be bothered to bring my baggage to the exit or show his face during trip. No tip

 

[leacrane]

By the way my disability does not require a wheelchair and some days I may use a cane. I've learned that the cane gets me much better service so it is always unfolded in my hand while on Amtrak

 

[seat38a]

Under no circumstances whatsoever does it make sense to tip for genuinely bad service. I leave generous tips for good service, and particularly for anything above-and-beyond, but for bad service... no way. Tipping in advance is just bribery, and it doesn't always work, either; it doesn't prevent disappearing SCAs or hostile dining car staff.

The dining car... yeah, I used to tip reliably and well. I've stopped because the service has stopped being satisfactory on the last several trips. This could just be flukes. If I get decent service again, I'll tip again.

I've tipped most of my SCAs well, but I try to avoid tipping the disappearing ones who can't be arsed to show up in the sleeping car for over four hours at a time during the day. Honestly, if you tip the shirkers, does it give the good workers any incentive to do any work?

Welcome to the real word. Greasing the palm, bribe, "optional fee" or whatever you want to call it, to speed up service is where everything is going these days. Many of the service industry are going that model as well. $20.00 dollars to board early, $30.00 dollars extra to cut in line, tipping the bellman to cut in line of the taxi line. Its been going on right under your nose all these times.