Amtrak Train Separates Outside of Albany, NY (11/21)

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Gotta be very careful about that and don't want to encourage it one bit as you can cause more problems by doing so, especially if part of the train is on a turnout or curve. However, if any situation does justify pulling the emergency brake valve, it's a break-in-two if you don't very quickly feel a deceleration starting (meaning the air in your portion of the train may be bottled up, accidentally or deliberately [vandalisim/sabotage]).
 
Steve4031 said:
Wouldn’t it be difficult to determine if the cars stopped because the guy pulled the emergency brake  or that the train was automatically stopping because the air hose disconnected?  
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Not if someone explicitly says that they or someone else pulled the emergency brake. ;)
 
cpotisch said:
Not if someone explicitly says that they or someone else pulled the emergency brake. ;)
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If I understand the operation of train brakes correctly I’m assuming that the train brakes engaged almost immediately after the cars separated. The person who pulled the emergency brake did so a few seconds or more after the separation.  So it would be hard to tell what actions stopped the train unless the investigation determines that the brakes on the separated cars failed to engage after separation and therefore the action of the individual pulling the emergency brake handle caused the separated cars to stop.  
 
Steve4031 said:
Wouldn’t it be difficult to determine if the cars stopped because the guy pulled the emergency brake  or that the train was automatically stopping because the air hose disconnected?  
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A quick inspection of the air line angle cocks (which would be necessary while piecing the train back together) should show whether or not the air was "bottled" [the **** (s) would be closed].
 
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Who would a reporter believe?

  1. A passenger who said “I pulled the emergency brake and stopped the train!” OR
  2. A person knowledge of how trains work?
Remember, many reporters think the Conductor rides in the locomotive and drives the train!
 
the_traveler said:
Who would a reporter believe?

  1. A passenger who said “I pulled the emergency brake and stopped the train!” OR
  2. A person knowledge of how trains work?
Remember, many reporters think the Conductor rides in the locomotive and drives the train!
Click to expand...
I understand what you are saying.  I was trying to determine how this worked.  That is why I was asking questions.  The post about the angle **** provides some clarification.  
 
By the way, the conductor and the engineer are supposed to conduct a brake test upon leaving the initial terminal and, I believe, at occasional stops en route. The engineer makes a service brake application and the conductor observes an air gauge or brake system monitor (those green/yellow lights you see on the side of Superliners) to make sure that the brakes actually do apply on the last car. This verifies brake pipe integrity and proper operation from locomotive to last car. However, it's still possible for a vandal to close angle cocks at station stops between brake tests and for the conductor to miss it; this is probably what happened to the Federal Express in 1953.

Edit To Add: Upon re-reviewing the article on the Federal it looks as if the cause wasn't vandalism but rather a design flaw which caused the **** to close due to the vibration from train movement.
 
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Air brakes have a lag time, there is a delay after you applied them before the brakes apply enough pressure to slow the train down.  Pipe size and reservoir are delaying factor. Also the railcars do not apply or release the brakes at the same speed. So in this case the air is venting out of the broken pipe were the train split. So there is a rapid lost of pressure up front, but the rear is going to take more time to engage the brakes.  So it may not of been noticeable that the brakes were been applied, when the emergency cord was pulled by the passenger.

We have the small issue of the air line was bottled up.  However a required air brakes test should of been done.  This would of show a problem with the angle ****.

An explanation in Trucking terms.

In a tractor trailer travel at 65 mph a brake lag of 75 feet travel before brakes are applied.

Perception Time 1.5 sec and150 feet.

Reaction Time 1.0 sec and 100 feet.

Brake Lag .75 sec and 75 feet.

Distance travel with out braking: 325 feet.

Braking Distance: 665 feet.

Ok a tractor trailer is not the same as a train with a emergency brake application due to a break in the line.  However it does show the delay.
 
When the brake line is broken by the train seperating, the brakes start to apply. A passenger jumping up straight away and pulling the emergency cord may feel that they have helped to stop the train, but all they have done is to duplicate the actions already in progress by the automatic systems.

Ed.
 
Steve4031 said:
If I understand the operation of train brakes correctly I’m assuming that the train brakes engaged almost immediately after the cars separated. The person who pulled the emergency brake did so a few seconds or more after the separation.  So it would be hard to tell what actions stopped the train unless the investigation determines that the brakes on the separated cars failed to engage after separation and therefore the action of the individual pulling the emergency brake handle caused the separated cars to stop.  
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It's not really that hard. Think of it this way. If for some reason the air was bottled on the rear, if the forward section dumped and the rear end didn't dump IMMEDIATELY, you'd very likely would have had a run in since the rear is heavier than the head end . In other words, the rear end would have surely collided with the head end...like this:

 

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