Acela Test Trains at 165 mph to start 9/24/2012

jis said:

Further update....

The guy on the train was right and the guy on the platform at Princeton Jct. was wrong. The train did not reach planned speeds night before last.

However, the planned tests for this round were completed last night on NEC South.

The test train is resting tonight and heading up north for test runs on NEC North.

So it is time for the_traveler to go and camp out on the platform of KIN for the next couple of nights I suppose. The test sequence will presumably be shorter up north since they don;t have to start at 135 and go up incrementally. They can start at 150 up there.

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Aw, dang. I thought, per one of the newspaper articles, that it was supposed to run down here Thursday night. Maybe I got my T days mixed up. Guess I won't go hang out at one of the Newark SEPTA stations to watch for it tomorrow night.

WHY, oh, WHY does Acela locomotives hunt / sway / yaw, when at 102 tons, are about the same as an AEM-7? I got the 102 ton figure from wiki, so if that's true, are not the rail tanks / pigs / freight units nicknames undeserved they've gotten, or am i not seeing somehing here..?

NE933 said:

WHY, oh, WHY does Acela locomotives hunt / sway / yaw, when at 102 tons, are about the same as an AEM-7? I got the 102 ton figure from wiki, so if that's true, are not the rail tanks / pigs / freight units nicknames undeserved they've gotten, or am i not seeing somehing here..?

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They are considered heavy for HS trains because a typical power head on TGV is less than 75 tons. They really are way too heavy to be effective good high speed power heads. Part of the ride problem at higher speeds possibly stems from that to.

So how did the high speed test turn out? Is Amtrak satisfied with the speed and the ride? What top speed did they maintain?

Sorry if this should be obvious, the posts above kind of confuse me. I thought the next test was going to be last night but no one has talked about any results yet... I hope it went well!

Ziv said:

So how did the high speed test turn out? Is Amtrak satisfied with the speed and the ride? What top speed did they maintain?

Sorry if this should be obvious, the posts above kind of confuse me. I thought the next test was going to be last night but no one has talked about any results yet... I hope it went well!

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All that I have heard is that the tests in NEC South were concluded satisfactorily, which would mean that they operated at the planned speeds stepwise increasing from 135 to 165.

There were no tests planned last night AFAIK. The tests tonight are in NEC North again AFAIK.

These tests were never meant to be a huge earthshaking event. They were to get some additional documentation of train characteristics and track quality towards getting the trains certified to operate at 160mph on those track segments.

jis said:

Ziv said:

So how did the high speed test turn out? Is Amtrak satisfied with the speed and the ride? What top speed did they maintain?

Sorry if this should be obvious, the posts above kind of confuse me. I thought the next test was going to be last night but no one has talked about any results yet... I hope it went well!

Click to expand...

All that I have heard is that the tests in NEC South were concluded satisfactorily, which would mean that they operated at the planned speeds stepwise increasing from 135 to 165.

There were no tests planned last night AFAIK. The tests tonight are in NEC North again AFAIK.

These tests were never meant to be a huge earthshaking event. They were to get some additional documentation of train characteristics and track quality towards getting the trains certified to operate at 160mph on those track segments.

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Thanks for the answer. I wasn't sure if they had reached 160 or 165, or if they were satisfied with the performance of the trainset at that speed. And I guess we might not know the latter for a while. Good to know that the trains were able to hit the speed goal they were aiming for. I hope that all these tests are positive, it will be useful even if only for the boasting rights/Public Relations aspect. But when you get right down to it, speed is something that a lot of people are interested in.

BTW, if you want to see some ride quality problems that Acelas have take a look at this video:



That is why HHP-8s will never run above 125 even if they could, and Acelas will have some difficulty getting certified for 160. They will require a more stringent suspension maintenance and inspection regime to gain certification, is my guess.

Jis, Looking at these two videos. You can see it on the HHP's.. It's one thing I've noticed and have always made fun of with those units is the bounce in the unit. It is less noticeable in the AE sets.. Any particle reason why?

Acela150 said:

Jis, Looking at these two videos. You can see it on the HHP's.. It's one thing I've noticed and have always made fun of with those units is the bounce in the unit. It is less noticeable in the AE sets.. Any particle reason why?

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The HHP-8 excessive rear end yawing problem is due to aerodynamic issues.

An Acela with a well maintained suspension is not too bad as long as you do not try to run it too fast. But still at 125mph, a well maintained Amfleet rides better than an Acela IMHO. And the active tilt system in Acelas does not help the quality of ride on a straight track either.

Amtrak conducted another round of high speed tests with the Acela overnight on September 29-30. No word on the exact reasons for the tests, but someone got a heads-up and took video of the high speed passes. The Acela consist was 1 car longer than usual, because it had the #10003 track inspection car added in the consist. So take it into account when doing your own timing measurements.

Youtube video (6:03 long): The Acela Project: Amtrak Acela Express HIGHSPEED 165MPH+ Testing [2014]

OK, that's a pretty fantastic video. If you don't want to sit through all 6 minutes, it starts getting really good at around the

3:40 mark.

If they ever start running those things at that speed in revenue service, they are going to have to batten down the hatches,

in terms of making sure all the little metal signs and whatnot are bolted down good. You can easily imagine one of them

breaking loose and being tossed up onto the platform.

When they ran the first Metroliner test trains way back when, on one test run it managed to blow out many windows off of one of the PRR wsshboard EMUs. These things happen. That's why they test, among other things.

jis said:

When they ran the first Metroliner test trains way back when, on one test run it managed to blow out many windows off of one of the PRR wsshboard EMUs. These things happen. That's why they test, among other things.

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According to a man I know that was there, this issue was overstated. These old EMU's had wood frame windows and the frames were somewhat, well more than somewhat, deteriorated. The NEC track centers are very close, I understand to be somewhere under 13 feet, as in around 12'-8". This is far closer than they would be on any line built new. In fact, anything under 14 feet would not be considered for any service of any kimd, and for new high speed lines spacings of 15 feet to 16.5 feet are being proposed.

fairviewroad said:

If they ever start running those things at that speed in revenue service, they are going to have to batten down the hatches,

in terms of making sure all the little metal signs and whatnot are bolted down good. You can easily imagine one of them

breaking loose and being tossed up onto the platform.

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Several of the final Acela passes in the video are faster than would be allowed in revenue service, but yes, it looks that the signs on the fence in the middle of the 4 tracks need to be better secured. The fence doesn't look at that solidly attached either.

The catenary got bounced around as well, but it should be new constant tension catenary before we see 150 to 160 mph speeds in revenue service there.

BTW, with the #10003 inspection car, I get a length for the Acela consist of ~749 feet which I will round off to 750'. 165 mph equals 242 feet/second. So has anyone with video analysis tools measured exactly how long it took for the entire Acela to pass by a point on the last runs?

afigg said:

fairviewroad said:

If they ever start running those things at that speed in revenue service, they are going to have to batten down the hatches,

in terms of making sure all the little metal signs and whatnot are bolted down good. You can easily imagine one of them

breaking loose and being tossed up onto the platform.

Click to expand...

Several of the final Acela passes in the video are faster than would be allowed in revenue service, but yes, it looks that the signs on the fence in the middle of the 4 tracks need to be better secured. The fence doesn't look at that solidly attached either.

The catenary got bounced around as well, but it should be new constant tension catenary before we see 150 to 160 mph speeds in revenue service there.

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Wondering -- "constant tension catenary" is that like with the weights and pulleys and such, so the pantographs don't have to do so much up-and-down depending on the season -- temperature? Like in the hot season the "catenary" sags, and the pantographs have to move up-and-down really fast, but in winter cold the cat is taught and might snap (in a cold snap)?

Is there any catenary in the world running high speed trains that is not constant-tension? Huh?

Aside from the NEC.

Maybe somewhere in UK? Or Russia? Or?

Yes, that's exactly what constant tension refers to.

The purpose of the test is to see how everything from the equipment to the people moving about the train handle the speeds. The video posted is actually the retest from the week prior. Based upon the results of this latest tests, I'm betting there will be another batch in this territory.