protocol for cutting through dining car?

roomette said:

leemell said:

It is a form of courtesy and respect.

Click to expand...

It used to be that ***** and gay we're not offensive, also.

OK, now back to trains. Just be courteous and respectful of the staff and patrons and it is fine.

Click to expand...

***** and gay are not offensive unless they are used as an insult. I've never heard "ma'am" used as an insult. The reason some women don't like it is because it makes them feel old, but that's their problem, not the speaker's.

I'm at an age where "miss" seems too young and "ma'am" feels a bit beyond me, but I would never, ever get upset with someone for calling me either. I think it's polite, and I appreciate it. I also use "ma'am" and "sir". At my job, we are required to call policyholders by name, and I hate it. My solution is to ask, "Is it okay if I call you Tom, or do you prefer Mr. Smith?" That way, I've technically said their name and won't get dinged on a call evaluation, but I didn't have to compromise my principles.

Yes ma'am!

the_traveler said:

Without getting into details or (hopefully) an argument, I can tell you from personal experience that not every homeless person does not not have money to spend on train tickets.I may joke that I have "The Penthouse Suite" and that I have oodles of money lining around. The truth is that on paper, I have a net worth of over $1 million - thus making me a millionaire! But it's all paper, and I live from paycheck to paycheck. In fact I live in Section 8 housing! I could pay a "regular" rent, but it would stretch me to the limit!

I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Click to expand...

I have no idea how this works. How does one have a net worth of anything, and get subsidized housing especially when one could pay "regular rent" and still do leisure travel? Not trying to be disrespectful, honestly curious. How in the hell does that system work?

Shortline said:

the_traveler said:

Without getting into details or (hopefully) an argument, I can tell you from personal experience that not every homeless person does not not have money to spend on train tickets.I may joke that I have "The Penthouse Suite" and that I have oodles of money lining around. The truth is that on paper, I have a net worth of over $1 million - thus making me a millionaire! But it's all paper, and I live from paycheck to paycheck. In fact I live in Section 8 housing! I could pay a "regular" rent, but it would stretch me to the limit!

I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Click to expand...

I have no idea how this works. How does one have a net worth of anything, and get subsidized housing especially when one could pay "regular rent" and still do leisure travel? Not trying to be disrespectful, honestly curious. How in the hell does that system work?

Click to expand...

Seriously, I can't agree more.

I like being amused but c'mon.

Why would anyone think that posting this or doing this or living like this or being like this is A-okay and why would they post it here?

JoanieB said:

Shortline said:

the_traveler said:

Without getting into details or (hopefully) an argument, I can tell you from personal experience that not every homeless person does not not have money to spend on train tickets.I may joke that I have "The Penthouse Suite" and that I have oodles of money lining around. The truth is that on paper, I have a net worth of over $1 million - thus making me a millionaire! But it's all paper, and I live from paycheck to paycheck. In fact I live in Section 8 housing! I could pay a "regular" rent, but it would stretch me to the limit!

I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Click to expand...

I have no idea how this works. How does one have a net worth of anything, and get subsidized housing especially when one could pay "regular rent" and still do leisure travel? Not trying to be disrespectful, honestly curious. How in the hell does that system work?

Click to expand...

Seriously, I can't agree more.

I like being amused but c'mon.

Why would anyone think that posting this or doing this or living like this or being like this is A-okay and why would they post it here?

Click to expand...

Well, now that you mention it, I also wonder. Further, what does 'worth a million' on paper mean? You're either worth a million or you're not, right?

IRAs? Investments? Trusts? Just uneducated guesses.

roomette said:

JoanieB said:

Shortline said:

the_traveler said:

Without getting into details or (hopefully) an argument, I can tell you from personal experience that not every homeless person does not not have money to spend on train tickets.I may joke that I have "The Penthouse Suite" and that I have oodles of money lining around. The truth is that on paper, I have a net worth of over $1 million - thus making me a millionaire! But it's all paper, and I live from paycheck to paycheck. In fact I live in Section 8 housing! I could pay a "regular" rent, but it would stretch me to the limit!

I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Click to expand...

I have no idea how this works. How does one have a net worth of anything, and get subsidized housing especially when one could pay "regular rent" and still do leisure travel? Not trying to be disrespectful, honestly curious. How in the hell does that system work?

Click to expand...

Seriously, I can't agree more.

I like being amused but c'mon.

Why would anyone think that posting this or doing this or living like this or being like this is A-okay and why would they post it here?

Click to expand...

Well, now that you mention it, I also wonder. Further, what does 'worth a million' on paper mean? You're either worth a million or you're not, right?

Click to expand...

Oh damn... I see another locked or deleted thread in the future.

Traveler is a 'favorite son' here (I've never figured out how he became a moderator with his, often times, gross generalizations and overuse of bold text and exclaimation points!!!!). I'm just glad that I'm not the only one to question his post about net-worth and also living in subsidized housing. :huh:

AmtrakBlue said:

IRAs? Investments? Trusts? Just uneducated guesses.

Click to expand...

No more than you can have such *net worth* and hide it so you can save it for your family while the government/taxpayers pay(s) for your nursing care or anything else for that matter.

ugh.

Government subsidies are for those with no such assets, on paper or otherwise.

Really awesome bunch of posters here leaping to conclusions without having all of the facts. Keep up the great work, guys and gals.

Ryan said:

Really awesome bunch of posters here leaping to conclusions without having all of the facts. Keep up the great work, guys and gals.

Click to expand...

I agree with Ryan. There is no need to get personal - especially since none of you know all the facts.

Ryan said:

Really awesome bunch of posters here leaping to conclusions without having all of the facts. Keep up the great work, guys and gals.

Click to expand...

No one is leaping to anything.

You're obviously an insider and know something most of us don't and, likely, don't care to know either.

From this post, some of us have easily come to the conclusion that the person who posted this, is taking advantage of government subsidies meant for those that aren't *millionaires* on paper.

It's not cute, coy, or amusing.

Really? I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Without getting into details or (hopefully) an argument, I can tell you from personal experience that not every homeless person does not not have money to spend on train tickets.

I may joke that I have "The Penthouse Suite" and that I have oodles of money lining around. The truth is that on paper, I have a net worth of over $1 million - thus making me a millionaire! But it's all paper, and I live from paycheck to paycheck. In fact I live in Section 8 housing! I could pay a "regular" rent, but it would stretch me to the limit!

I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

JoanieB said:

Ryan said:

Really awesome bunch of posters here leaping to conclusions without having all of the facts. Keep up the great work, guys and gals.

Click to expand...

No one is leaping to anything.

You're obviously an insider and know something most of us don't and, likely, don't care to know either.

From this post, some of us have easily come to the conclusion that the person who posted this, is taking advantage of government subsidies meant for those that aren't *millionaires* on paper.

It's not cute, coy, or amusing.

Really? I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Without getting into details or (hopefully) an argument, I can tell you from personal experience that not every homeless person does not not have money to spend on train tickets.

I may joke that I have "The Penthouse Suite" and that I have oodles of money lining around. The truth is that on paper, I have a net worth of over $1 million - thus making me a millionaire! But it's all paper, and I live from paycheck to paycheck. In fact I live in Section 8 housing! I could pay a "regular" rent, but it would stretch me to the limit!

I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Click to expand...

Give it up JoanieB, The regulars here seem to worship The_Traveler (for whatever reason). I've been witness to it for quite a few years. :huh:

Cristobal said:

JoanieB said:

Ryan said:

Really awesome bunch of posters here leaping to conclusions without having all of the facts. Keep up the great work, guys and gals.

Click to expand...

No one is leaping to anything.

You're obviously an insider and know something most of us don't and, likely, don't care to know either.

From this post, some of us have easily come to the conclusion that the person who posted this, is taking advantage of government subsidies meant for those that aren't *millionaires* on paper.

It's not cute, coy, or amusing.

Really? I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Without getting into details or (hopefully) an argument, I can tell you from personal experience that not every homeless person does not not have money to spend on train tickets.

I may joke that I have "The Penthouse Suite" and that I have oodles of money lining around. The truth is that on paper, I have a net worth of over $1 million - thus making me a millionaire! But it's all paper, and I live from paycheck to paycheck. In fact I live in Section 8 housing! I could pay a "regular" rent, but it would stretch me to the limit!

I could very easily have been "one of those homeless people" despite being a millionaire!

Click to expand...

Give it up JoanieB, The regulars here seem to worship The_Traveler (for whatever reason). I've been witness to it for quite a few years. :huh:

Click to expand...

Yeah, I agree.

He edited/censored one of my posts and flagged it as an offensive comment for using the acronym BS and mentioning the exclusive, now closed, restaurant El Bulli.

Whatever.

This really doesn't have anything to do with Dave personally.

It has everything to do with jumping to unfounded conclusions and accusing people of criminal acts when you don't have any idea what you're talking about and certainly don't have all the facts.

I don't know what his story is (and I'm somewhat curious myself), but I'm sure if he was smart enough to be defrauding the government, he'd be smart enough to not mention it on the Internet.

I cetrainly don't "revere" Dave, and ive only met him in passing once. But rather than jump to conclusions and speak bad about anyone (moderator or not, "insider" or not) I sat back and kept my mouth shut. If Dave wants to share more, I'm sure he will. I'm sure that jumping on him like a pack of wolves is really going to encourage him to share more.

Ryan said:

This really doesn't have anything to do with Dave personally.

Click to expand...

On the other hand he did put his personal life out for everyone else to read and comment on. If he was expecting sympathy for being a millionaire "on paper" living a subsidized life then maybe he miscalculated the reaction. I'm only worth a tiny fraction what Dave apparently is and I feel as lucky as a king. I just don't like the idea of spending everything I have on the world's most expensive health care system or legal bills or any of the various complications that routinely bankrupt even lucky Americans like me.

Ryan said:

It has everything to do with jumping to unfounded conclusions and accusing people of criminal acts when you don't have any idea what you're talking about and certainly don't have all the facts.

Click to expand...

I think folks are simply wondering if the government has all the facts, which seems like a perfectly reasonable reaction to me.

Ryan said:

I don't know what his story is (and I'm somewhat curious myself), but I'm sure if he was smart enough to be defrauding the government, he'd be smart enough to not mention it on the Internet.

Click to expand...

Being proudly unethical, even blatantly so, is often perfectly legal. Just ask Monsanto.

My Dad always wanted his office over a bank. He said that way he could tell people his ass sets over a million dollars. :huh:

hboy:

This is getting so silly - really.

almost everybody (see mathematical definiton of "almost everywhere") in the USA lives in subsidized housing - whether the mortgage interest deduction, section 8, presidents (of the USA or of universities), rent-controlled apartments in NYC, or Halliburton employees near the Williston oilfields.

"Living in subsidized housing" is a jest. Maybe a poor one.

About terms of address - if you try to be polite and the other party takes offense - adjust.

About hats in the dining car - sheesh.

The Davy Crockett said:

My Dad always wanted his office over a bank. He said that way he could tell people his ass sets over a million dollars. :huh:

hboy:

Click to expand...

My mom did have a job over a bank & my dad used to say that. :giggle:

It's easy to be a millionaire and live in section 8 housing if the qualifications of such is simply based on earned income. If your only income is interest paid from an investment - or even taking out your retirement from a retirement fund - then you would certainly qualify. Do I agree that this is right? Not necessarily - just arguing a fascet of something I don't know all the facts to.

For me, the proper protocol for passing through a diner is to step in, be seated, enjoy the company of a couple more people, dine, resolve the bill, and exit to the other side. I'd just wait until dining is over to make my return journey.

As to the previous comment about hats, it's in the Blue Book for staff that wears hats to remove them while in the Diner.

I'm guessing the posts were not based on any posters' "assumptions" but rather on the facts that traveler himself stated in his post.

His post puzzled me, too. Unless he was kidding (and I don't get the joke), I don't understand why anyone whose net worth is a million dollars would post publicly that he's getting subsidized (section 8, specifically) housing which, by his own admission, he doesn't even need, and expect any different reaction. I think it's totally reasonable that that went over like a lead balloon. :wacko: If there's more to his story, now would be a good time to say so, but his post was clear. The money comes from the taxpayers' (read: our) pockets, after all. Legal or otherwise, let the subsidies be for the truly needy.

The post was almost trollish in nature, but the traveler is certainly not a troll. And I enjoy his train posts immensely!

(and that's how I travel through the dining car!! LOL) We do wander OT.

crescent2 said:

I'm guessing the posts were not based on any posters' "assumptions" but rather on the facts that traveler himself stated in his post.

Click to expand...

Those assumptions are made out of ignorance. It's not my place to be spreading Dave's business, he can share what he's comfortable sharing (and given the reaction of some here it's understandable that he's reluctant to share more), but the posters casting judgement absolutely do not have all of the information needed to make those judgements.

Was it bad form for Dave to share enough for people to make those assumptions? Perhaps, but it's absolutely bad form to throw stones when you don't know what you're talking about (the general "you", not you personally) and continue to throw stones when told that there's more to the story.

Since you've brought religion into the conversations here a handful of times here recently, Matthew 7 may be of some relevance to the situation.

As I was headed out to pick up some lunch, I thought of a hypothetical situation to illustrate how it's possible to have a huge number of assets and still be "deserving" of living in Section 8 housing. This is a real hypothetical, and not a "Here's Dave's story wrapped in a 'hypothetical situation' to be polite".

Imagine I'm a fisherman - think Deadliest Catch, but without all the fame and fortune that comes from being a TV show superstar. On paper, my boat and fishing gear are worth far more than a million dollars. However, fishing has been so crappy for the past few years that after I sell my catch, and pay for bait, supplies, fuel and my crew, I'm barely breaking even. In the short off season, I'm able to find a part time job doing some handyman work when I'm not doing maintenance/repairs on my boat, but my annual income has been consistently below the poverty line and below whatever level qualifies me for Section 8 housing. Any cash savings that I had were depleted when I had to rebuild one of the diesels on the boat a few seasons ago and with the cash flow situation being what it is, another such occurrence will bankrupt me.

Sure, I'm "worth a million dollars", but to realize that, I would have to sell everything that I use to make a living. I'm 55 years old, and without that income, I'd surely be out on the street. Don't you think that I deserve a little help?

Now that said, maybe we can get back to the topic at hand? Please?

I am making this post of my own free will, and to (hopefully) stop some of the "assumptions" that I'm "defrauding the Government", am "unethical" and "hiding my assets". Here's how a "millionaire" can qualify to receive "subsidized housing".

Years ago, I worked and built up money in my IRA. Then in 2002, I retired on disability retirement. (Yes I do have a real disability.) This allowed my to withdraw my IRA without penalty. My 2 sisters and I decided to combine our savings to help out the owner of the building where she worked with his mortgage.

This was in the days of 10%+ interest rates. The rate we charged was very low. (I think like 2-3% or less.) Thus we were the "banker", and after the owner became my brother-in-law the owners. The state and town approached my BIL to convert this building to affordable housing. After 8 years of "dotting the i's and crossing the t's", construction began to convert the 150 year old mill to become 12 affordable housing apartments.

Since the conversion, the value is placed at over $4 million. Divided 4 ways, that makes me worth over $1 million - thus a millionaire on paper. But it doesn't mean I'm rich - far from it. Because it it controlled by the Government and (due to it's age) on the Register of National Historical Places, it can not be sold for a few years. Even if it could be, I would be unable to sell my "few slabs of rock in a corner of the building" to get my million dollars.

The only qualification for affordable housing is the amount of EARNED income you receive. My earned income is my disability pension and Social Security that I receive. The amount is $1,700-1,800 a month. For a comparable apartment to the one I have would rent for $1,500-2,000 a month. And that's before things like food and utilities. So you see why affordable housing is needed - and not just by me.

Section 8 housing only means that my rent is 30% of my income.

Although what I have just said is nobody's business, it is all true. I only wanted to clear up some misunderstandings. I bet if many of the members of AU put together a net worth statement (including the value of your house, IRA's, savings, salary from your jobs, etc...), you may discover that you're a millionaire too!

BTW: My average bank balance is under $300 and a large amount in my wallet is $20. If a person like Bill Gates decided to reduce his salary to $1 per year, he would also qualify for Section 8 housing, since the qualification is only your earned income.

I have nothing else to add to this thread, except to say that if it were not for AGR and the Chase MasterCard giving me AGR points, I would not be on very many trains and seldom at any Gatherings - because I could not afford it.

Well said.

Good Post Dave! :hi: The Holier than Thou Types need to MTOB!! ("Walk a Mile in their Shoes!")