Service to Freeport and Brunswick ME to start Nov 1

Just saw the news that the Downeaster service extension to Freeport and Brunswick ME will begin on November 1. Portland Press article. The new schedule can be found on the Amtrak Downeaster website.

The schedule will allow for day trips from Boston to Freeport ME and back. Depart BON at 9:05 AM, arrive at Freeport at 12:10 PM, shop at LL Bean & all the discount stores, get lunch, take the train back to BON at 6:05 PM. The Saturday and Sunday #691 and #698 trains could sell a lot of seats once the word gets out about handy day trips to Freeport gets out.

I don't see a code posted for Freeport yet, but I would expect it would be FRE if that is available and was not an old station code. I think LLB would be a funnier station code, but they don't pick station codes to be funny. Well, except for SOL, SOB and other double meaning station codes. :lol:

Ok, so Freeport and Brunswick ME on November 1. Norfolk on December 12. Good to see service expanding, not contracting.

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

Looks like FRE is not currently being used as a code.

Brunswick is already BRK for Thruway bus services, presumably the train station will use the same code.

Interesting that the positioning runs from POR up to BRK in the morning and from BRK back to POR in the evening as being sold as revenue service.

Wonder how many people that will attract? Not many, I'd guess. I assume there's a reason why the train can't sit in BRK overnight?

fairviewroad said:

Looks like FRE is not currently being used as a code.

Brunswick is already BRK for Thruway bus services, presumably the train station will use the same code.

Interesting that the positioning runs from POR up to BRK in the morning and from BRK back to POR in the evening as being sold as revenue service.

Wonder how many people that will attract? Not many, I'd guess. I assume there's a reason why the train can't sit in BRK overnight?

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Where would it go? There isn't a siding at the station.

There's no overnight facilities yet in Brunswick. They are to be built, and then there will not be any positioning runs to POR.

Hmm...now, can I make this work as well? Let's see...one day getting to BOS, one day up to Maine and back, and one day back home. Yep, sounds like a good weekend. I'll just book from NFK to induce a "paper ticket" issue as opposed to an e-ticket. Best of all, this gives me an excuse to be away in the runup to the election in November!

amamba said:

Where would it go? There isn't a siding at the station.

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I'm not an expert on Maine railroading so I didn't know that. That's why I was asking.

Anyhow, a lack of a siding at the station is only relevant if the tracks in question are needed

for other railroad operations during the overnight hours. From the context, I expect this is

the case.

Now, on to Bangor. At least Concord coach and Cyr give good bus service to the state.

amamba said:

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

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There is a HSIPR grant to NNEPRA and the MBTA of $20.8 million plus $5.2 million of MBTA funds for double tracking, track replacement, and signal & grade crossing upgrades to the tracks in MA. When done, this should allow some time to be shaved off the Downeaster trip time, although I'm not clear on how much from this project alone. The goal to get BON-POR trip time down from 2:30 to around 2:10 in the next few years. I've lost track of the back and forth, but there were or are plans for a possible new station in Portland along with connecting track upgrades as I recall for faster connections to the north towards Freeport. A 2:10 BON-POR trip time will be more competitive.

The status of the track project in MA is not clear because MBTA tends to be rather opaque and does not provide much in the way of status updates for their projects from what I can find.

I think we are seeing an initial conservative schedule on trip times with compromises because the trains have to start from Portland. Once the storage and service facility is built in Brunswick, that will allow for the schedule will be adjusted with all 5 daily trains going to or from Brunswick.

amamba said:

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

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I think trains in general are a tough sell to anyone who owns a reliable car and is looking for the fastest way to get someplace.

Maine Rider said:

amamba said:

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

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I think trains in general are a tough sell to anyone who owns a reliable car and is looking for the fastest way to get someplace.

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Unless you happen to be in France or on some routes in Germany, or Spain, and definitely Japan.

Guest said:

Now, on to Bangor. At least Concord coach and Cyr give good bus service to the state.

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Cyr?!

jis said:

Maine Rider said:

amamba said:

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

Click to expand...

I think trains in general are a tough sell to anyone who owns a reliable car and is looking for the fastest way to get someplace.

Click to expand...

Unless you happen to be in France or on some routes in Germany, or Spain, and definitely Japan.

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Well, I wish I had been to some of those places... but no.

Guess I am thinking more locally, and of people I know. Most of them wouldn't consider taking the train to Boston. Although one guy from work is taking the Downeaster, for the first time, tomorrow! I hope he and his GF have a good experience!

I noted this same exact thing on Flyertalk when this announcement was posted there:

A bit of a weird thing with the new schedule - there's a train that leaves BON at 9:05am and arrives in Brunswick at 12:25pm. The next train South out of Brunswick is scheduled leave at 5:50pm. Are they going to keep a trainset at Brunswick for 5+ hours? Or are they going to send it down to Portland empty? I'm assuming freight traffic must somehow be the reason for this, but I'll be curious to see which one they do.

And I'll add this - if they send it down to POR empty, they'd also be sending an empty unit back to Brunswick for the 5:50 southbound run. That leads me to believe they are keeping the trainset in Brunswick, but why is it okay to keep it there during the day but not at night?

I confess as a Mainer that I do not get the schedule either. But I don't believe there is an extra trainset for this extension, that they could keep in Brunswick while another set makes a couple more Boston/Portland roundtrips.

Can anyone clarify this?

Maine Rider said:

amamba said:

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

Click to expand...

I think trains in general are a tough sell to anyone who owns a reliable car and is looking for the fastest way to get someplace.

Click to expand...

I disagree. I take the acela to NYP and PHL all the time, because it is faster than driving. And taking the train to BOS from PVD is generally faster than driving, too.

amamba said:

Maine Rider said:

amamba said:

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

Click to expand...

I think trains in general are a tough sell to anyone who owns a reliable car and is looking for the fastest way to get someplace.

Click to expand...

I disagree. I take the acela to NYP and PHL all the time, because it is faster than driving. And taking the train to BOS from PVD is generally faster than driving, too.

Click to expand...

Not only that, but reliability is an issue with drive times. For example, RVR-WAS is about 2:10 or so on the train and I can usually bet on that.* Sometimes it is substantially faster. Driving, it can be 80 minutes if you're really lucky and leaving from the north side of town...or it can be 160 minutes if you're unlucky and leaving from downtown.

*Actually, a "hot" Silver can blow this out of the water. 98 of Sept. 8 did RVR-WAS in 1:50, and RVR-ALX in 1:35.

lo2e said:

I noted this same exact thing on Flyertalk when this announcement was posted there:

A bit of a weird thing with the new schedule - there's a train that leaves BON at 9:05am and arrives in Brunswick at 12:25pm. The next train South out of Brunswick is scheduled leave at 5:50pm. Are they going to keep a trainset at Brunswick for 5+ hours? Or are they going to send it down to Portland empty?

I'm assuming freight traffic must somehow be the reason for this, but I'll be curious to see which one they do.

And I'll add this - if they send it down to POR empty, they'd also be sending an empty unit back to Brunswick for the 5:50 southbound run. That leads me to believe they are keeping the trainset in Brunswick, but why is it okay to keep it there during the day but not at night?

Click to expand...

I admit that this is speculation on my part, but I believe that they are keeping the trainset there during the day.

They aren't keeping it there at night because they have no way to service the train until the new facility is built, which is to say re-water it, dump the waste, re-fuel, and otherwise properly clean the train. It's probably only getting a very light cleaning, garbage and a touch up on the restrooms while it sits there during the day.

Swadian Hardcore said:

Guest said:

Now, on to Bangor. At least Concord coach and Cyr give good bus service to the state.

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Cyr?!

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Cyr Bus Lines. They run from Bangor to Caribou.

This is a long shot, but would anyone know when tickets go on sale for this? The schedule says it's effective October 15th, so maybe that's it? In any event, I'm excited to visit Brunswick this fall.

Anderson said:

amamba said:

Maine Rider said:

amamba said:

The major issue I see with this is the amount of time for the trip - a 3.5 hour train ride when a drive takes 2 hours is a tough sell for some people.

Click to expand...

I think trains in general are a tough sell to anyone who owns a reliable car and is looking for the fastest way to get someplace.

Click to expand...

I disagree. I take the acela to NYP and PHL all the time, because it is faster than driving. And taking the train to BOS from PVD is generally faster than driving, too.

Click to expand...

Not only that, but reliability is an issue with drive times. For example, RVR-WAS is about 2:10 or so on the train and I can usually bet on that.* Sometimes it is substantially faster. Driving, it can be 80 minutes if you're really lucky and leaving from the north side of town...or it can be 160 minutes if you're unlucky and leaving from downtown.

*Actually, a "hot" Silver can blow this out of the water. 98 of Sept. 8 did RVR-WAS in 1:50, and RVR-ALX in 1:35.

Click to expand...

A few exceptions do not invalidate my original point. And reliability a problem with driving as compared to trains? Please.

But, on topic: I am eager to take the extended Downeaster asap, and the proposed private extension as far as Rockland, which is just a bit more than a half hour from here. But not because it's faster than driving!

AlanB said:

I admit that this is speculation on my part, but I believe that they are keeping the trainset there during the day.
They aren't keeping it there at night because they have no way to service the train until the new facility is built, which is to say re-water it, dump the waste, re-fuel, and otherwise properly clean the train. It's probably only getting a very light cleaning, garbage and a touch up on the restrooms while it sits there during the day.

Click to expand...

Aha, good theory!

TCRT said:

This is a long shot, but would anyone know when tickets go on sale for this? The schedule says it's effective October 15th, so maybe that's it? In any event, I'm excited to visit Brunswick this fall.

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The newspaper article says tickets for Freeport and Brunswick will go on sale on October 1. Why wait until then, don't know. The tickets to Norfolk service starting December 12 went on sale the day the start date for the Norfolk service was announced. Maybe Amtrak needs extra time to add Freeport to the station and schedule data base. Brunswick ME is in there as a bus connection.

Another question is will Maine Eastern Railroad adjust their schedule and maintain service through the winter season to provide connections to the Downeaster at Brunswick? Take the Downeaster to Brunswick and then Maine Eastern to Rockland ME. That could be a popular weekend getaway connection during the summer season.

Should be a nice scenic ride once the leaves start to change.

Maine Rider said:

I think trains in general are a tough sell to anyone who owns a reliable car and is looking for the fastest way to get someplace.

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There's some truth to this, but most folks don't just consider speed when deciding what mode of transportation to use.

Maine Rider said:

Guess I am thinking more locally, and of people I know. Most of them wouldn't consider taking the train to Boston.

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And yet more than a half-million people rode the Downeaster in the last fiscal year, spending more than $7 million

on tickets. (Granted, not all of them traveled the entire length of the corridor.) So despite your admittedly anecdotal

observations, some people don't consider the travel times to be a deterrent.