Boston South Station

Boston' South Station is a beautiful place, especially since it was remodeled in the early 1990's. But it has some flaws, which may or may not have been intentional.

Although the station has a food court on one side, did you ever notice that the seating for the food court extends almost through the entire station? The metal chairs and small round tables dominate the supposed "waiting area", while the more station-like bench seating is very small and inadequate to handle the number of people waiting for trains. The latter type of seating is located closest to the ticket windows. Do you think this was done to discourage loitering, particularly vagrants? Or to discourage passengers (or railfans) from staying in the station overnight?

Another flaw is those sliding doors between each numbered "gate" and the track area. If you have spent any time in South Station in the winter, you know the feeling one gets when those doors open and the frigid New England air comes into the station. It takes a while for the temperature to moderate back to where it should be indoors. And if it's a windy day, the cold blast coming through those doors is powerful enough to blow your napkins, straw wrappers, empty cups, and even some food right off your table, even if you are sitting relatively close to the food court. In short, one has to keep a coat and gloves on when using the indoor part of the station. When a commuter train comes in and everyone is coming from the train into the station at the same time, the door are open almost constantly for a few minutes, letting the cold and wind into the station for a prolonged period of time. You might as well be waiting outside.

I bet AlanB's answer will be to go First Class so you can use the warm, cozy lounge upstairs. But that is not possible for everyone, especially MBTA commuters.

:huh: When do communter get the time to sit down? I personal leave work and go thur the station right to the platform to my train. Ok it been an few years since I was an communter but.......

Just Thinking

Guest said:

:huh: When do communter get the time to sit down? I personal leave work and go thur the station right to the platform to my train. Ok it been an few years since I was an communter but.......Just Thinking

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Guest,

Some do wait. While some people may time their daily routines to arrive at the train as it is boarding, there are those who might have to wait a few minutes.

I would tend to believe that the poor planning of the seating in South Station (and the last time I was there was in 1995) is most likely to keep the vagrants from using the waiting area as a bedroom. As to the situation with the sliding doors, they could have designed that aspect of the station better.

South Station is very poorly designed, and indeed is no place to wait for a train. With no heat in the winter and no AC in the summer it can get very uncomfortable. Now here's the secret. The waiting area (aka food court) is "outside". Next time you're in South Station you will notice that all the walls, except for the one leading to the tracks is exterior designed. The wall were you would exit to the tracks is all glass. Now, along with Alan, I would excape to the Metropolitan Lounge, but if you are looking for a station that is a bit more comforable to wait I would suggest Back Bay or Route 128.

tp49 said:

I would tend to believe that the poor planning of the seating in South Station (and the last time I was there was in 1995) is most likely to keep the vagrants from using the waiting area as a bedroom. As to the situation with the sliding doors, they could have designed that aspect of the station better.

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What about legitimate ticketed passengers using the place as a bedroom? I admit I once slept there, or at least tried to. It was several years ago in late December, on a day where the temperature got to a high in the mid-teens. I had taken Train 178, which at that time was running via the Inland Route nonstop from New Haven to Boston on account of the Acela improvement project. It was also running in a later timeslot than it does now, plus it took an extra hour to go the longer way via Springfield, so when we arrived on schedule at approximately 3:40 AM, where was I to go? I sat at one of those small tables in one of those hard metal chairs, and tried to put my head down. There were no other train arrivals or departures until the commuters (and the Twilight Shoreliner) started to arrive, but those doors kept on opening and closing. There was noplace I could sit and rest without catching that cold breeze.

Well I was there this past September and there were wooden benches (However, they have known to disapair from time to time. Why? I have no clue!). Now at 3 am I could see your problem, but I usualy arrive about 30 minutes before departure so I'm not there all to much. Now, if this is possible, you could go wait in the bus terminal which has airport style wating area.

Superliner Diner said:

What about legitimate ticketed passengers using the place as a bedroom? I admit I once slept there, or at least tried to. It was several years ago in late December, on a day where the temperature got to a high in the mid-teens. I had taken Train 178, which at that time was running via the Inland Route nonstop from New Haven to Boston on account of the Acela improvement project. It was also running in a later timeslot than it does now, plus it took an extra hour to go the longer way via Springfield, so when we arrived on schedule at approximately 3:40 AM, where was I to go? I sat at one of those small tables in one of those hard metal chairs, and tried to put my head down. There were no other train arrivals or departures until the commuters (and the Twilight Shoreliner) started to arrive, but those doors kept on opening and closing. There was noplace I could sit and rest without catching that cold breeze.

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Diner,

While I empathise with the situation you endured, I honestly do not believe that people who plan these projects take these situations into consideration as they believe they do not happen enough to include these in their design. Depending upon who owns the facility if it isthe government they definitely do not plan for these instances and if it is Amtrak the situation is probably what I previously stated.

I am surprised that they did not lock the sliding doors leading to the platforms after the last train arrived and the passengers detrained. However, the argument of the termianl owner could be that after disembarking from the train your attemt to sleep in the terminal regardless of how cold the outside temperature was constituted a trespassing, as your ticket only grants you a license to use the station for a reasonable time after the train arrived. This is especially true if the station has a sceheduled closing time as GCT and DC Union, I suspect South Station probably does.

Also, decreasing the size of the waiting area gives the people who are charged with making sure the station is safe a smaller area to patrol and an easier area to control. In essence South Station was probably designed with commuters in mind more as the number of commuters is probably higher than the number of Amtrak passengers using the station.

You also have to remember South Station only serves to small sized long-distance trains, the Lake Shore Limited and the Twiligth Shoreliner. Otherwise people are coming and going rather quickly from commuter, regional, or expess trains and also Boston is an end point station, meaning no conections to other trains (unless your a railfan ). B)

tp49 said:

Superliner Diner said:

What about legitimate ticketed passengers using the place as a bedroom?  I admit I once slept there, or at least tried to.   It was several years ago in late December, on a day where the temperature got to a high in the mid-teens.   I had taken Train 178, which at that time was running via the Inland Route nonstop from New Haven to Boston on account of the Acela improvement project.  It was also running in a later timeslot than it does now, plus it took an extra hour to go the longer way via Springfield, so when we arrived on schedule at approximately 3:40 AM, where was I to go?  I sat at one of those small tables in one of those hard metal chairs, and tried to put my head down.  There were no other train arrivals or departures until the commuters (and the Twilight Shoreliner) started to arrive, but those doors kept on opening and closing.  There was noplace I could sit and rest without catching that cold breeze.

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Diner,

While I empathise with the situation you endured, I honestly do not believe that people who plan these projects take these situations into consideration as they believe they do not happen enough to include these in their design. Depending upon who owns the facility if it isthe government they definitely do not plan for these instances and if it is Amtrak the situation is probably what I previously stated.

I am surprised that they did not lock the sliding doors leading to the platforms after the last train arrived and the passengers detrained. However, the argument of the termianl owner could be that after disembarking from the train your attemt to sleep in the terminal regardless of how cold the outside temperature was constituted a trespassing, as your ticket only grants you a license to use the station for a reasonable time after the train arrived. This is especially true if the station has a sceheduled closing time as GCT and DC Union, I suspect South Station probably does.

Also, decreasing the size of the waiting area gives the people who are charged with making sure the station is safe a smaller area to patrol and an easier area to control. In essence South Station was probably designed with commuters in mind more as the number of commuters is probably higher than the number of Amtrak passengers using the station.

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TP49,

I'm not saying that they should go out of their way to accomodate people who arrive late at night (what I did is no longer possible by the way, as the last Amtrak train into Boston is now 11:45 PM most days, 1:30 AM Friday nights/Saturday mornings.) But there are plenty of people who depart during much friendlier hours of the day who would appreciate a warmer, more comfortable place to await their trains.

Trespassing? As long as a public facility is unlocked, and as long as I can prove I am there having arrived and planning to depart on a train from that facility, I hardly think that my presence could be constituted as trespassing. Legitimate passengers should not be confused with vagrants who are in the building for the sole purpose of finding shelter; they have no travel plans.

Now this may be open to a separate discussion, but some stations do have posted opening and closing hours. Chicago Union Station is one. Those passengers using the Pennsylvanian, the only train to arrive or depart during the "closed" hours midnight to 5 AM, are herded through the station by a series of police barricades. Arriving passengers are directed right out into the street, supposedly to take a cab to their hotels. Chicago combated vagrancy by closing Union Station's waiting room to everyone, including those who are taking a train. New York's Grand Central Terminal, which is now a commuter-only station, of course does not need to remain open all night, because all they will get in the wee hours are the homeless seeking shelter. Union Station in Washington does not have any inbound evening or outbound morning commuter service, nor do many trains call there between the southbound Silver Meteor in the late evening, and the northbound Silver Meteor in the early morning, save for a few earlybird northbound corridor trains at 3 AM and around 5 AM.

Even so, the trains in all of those places are segregated by level or by distance from the waiting passengers, so that outside temperatures do not affect the people. All of the others provide a comfortable seating area, usually with the responsibility to show a ticket or stub that identifies you as an arriving or departing passenger.

Well, according to Amtrak's website station hours for Boston are 5:30am to 9:30pm seven days a week. How this is possible I don't know because there are a few trains that arrive after 9:30 and I think an Acela Express departs before 5:30am. Mabey these hours are just for ticket sales or when you detrain security will escort you to the streets, bus terminal, or subway.

Diner,

Again, I would agree with you as to the design of the waiting area in the station could be friendlier in regard to the sliding doors and the weather getting in.

Trespassing? As long as a public facility is unlocked, and as long as I can prove I am there having arrived and planning to depart on a train from that facility, I hardly think that my presence could be constituted as trespassing. Legitimate passengers should not be confused with vagrants who are in the building for the sole purpose of finding shelter; they have no travel plans.

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This point is open to some debate (probably because I'm studying for law exams right now). If however, you had an outbound ticket for the first train out of the station at 6 AM (or whenever it leaves) then you are absolutly correct and I would give a window of around 12 hours (or a reasonable period of time as reasonable minds can disagree) or so for this having arrived at airports up to five hours early for flights due to Amtrak's schedule on the Crescent between TCL and BHM.

IIRC GCT closes down at 1:30 AM as one time I rode in on Metro North from Old Greenwich having to use the facilities rather badly. With the train's restroom out of service I had to wait until the train arrived at GCT. After the train arrived there I went to find a restroom and was promptly ushered out by MTA PD as the terminal was closed even though I just arrived not five minutes before on a MN train. Luckily I got a cab to Penn for my LIRR train home (since it does not close) and was able to use their open facilities.

Maybe this would open up a new discussion but since the problems of the terminal have been pointed out what would we suggest as ways to improve the design?

No matter how you slice it, this is a bad station, and it is a shame that it anchors one end of the Northeast Corridor.

Superliner Diner is correct; the Club Acela is where I would be. So therefore South Stations poor design wouldn't bother me.

However, I would have to agree that this is a major problem. Additionally so is having any station essentially closed when a train is arriving or departing. Certainly any major station should have some provisions for late arriving trains. They should also have bathroom facilities available.

Frankly it's not that hard to lock most of the doors to the station, then post a guard or two at the remaining doors. That way any passenger arriving for a departure can show his/her ticket or reservation. If they don't have that, then they get escorted in to buy said ticket from a machine, before they are allowed to wait. This would also enable the station to largely remain open for arriving passenger, whom again would be allowed to exit by the guards.

That point by Amfleet is a good one about maybe using Route 128 or Back Bay if you feel uncomfortable at South Station. I'm wondering if the Club Acela Metro Lounge is heated and air conditioned? :unsure:

-Late Shore- said:

I'm wondering if the Club Acela Metro Lounge is heated and air conditioned? :unsure:

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Absolutely! It's always quite comfortable up in the lounge, regardless of what temperature it is outside. Plus there are no sliding doors to let in the outside air. In fact the lounge is on the second level of the terminal, so you either have to walk up a flight of stairs, or ride the elevator.

Isn't the lounge in Boston quite new? Does it resemble the ones in DC , Chicago and NYC? Or is it different in some newer, flashier(i.e. Acela-type) way?

I was in Boston two years ago and I do not remember it even being built yet.

Bill,

I could be wrong, but I don't think that it was just built. If indeed it's not brand new, then it did undergo a refurbishment, just like NY & DC did when they went from being a Metropolitan Lounge to a Club Acela.

Quite honestly, I think that Boston has the best lounge out of all the lounges on the NEC. It has a warm inviting feel, with wood tone and the Amtrak blue. While they modernized the area, they were also careful to leave much of the station's original ambiance and architecture. You can look out over the main station and see the tracks; you can also see the streets of Boston.

In my opinion, the next closest in design to Boston would be DC. That said however, DC has no views of anything, plus I still think that the decor is better in Boston.

There is no comparison, however to Chicago's Metropolitan lounge. Yes, the Metro lounge in CHI is still better than the main waiting room. However, by comparison to any of the Club Acela's it leaves a lot to be desired. Last I knew Chicago's furniture was quite well used and in need of replacement. It also is far too small for the number of passengers who use the lounge. Finally based upon my experiences, with one exception, the lounge is staffed by workers who have the worst attitude and customer service skills that I've ever seen while riding Amtrak. One could almost believe that you were at an airline ticket counter, with their attitudes.

Thankfully most other Amtrak employees that I've encountered have far better attitudes and work ethics.

I could be wrong, but I don't think that it was just built. If indeed it's not brand new, then it did undergo a refurbishment, just like NY & DC did when they went from being a Metropolitan Lounge to a Club Acela.

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Actually, the lounge is quite new and has only been around for about a year.

There is no comparison, however to Chicago's Metropolitan lounge. Yes, the Metro lounge in CHI is still better than the main waiting room. However, by comparison to any of the Club Acela's it leaves a lot to be desired. Last I knew Chicago's furniture was quite well used and in need of replacement. It also is far too small for the number of passengers who use the lounge. Finally based upon my experiences, with one exception, the lounge is staffed by workers who have the worst attitude and customer service skills that I've ever seen while riding Amtrak. One could almost believe that you were at an airline ticket counter, with their attitudes.

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Very true. After this summer I have no desire to return. I actaully (and unforunetly) recieved better service at the airport than I did at Union Station.

-Late Shore- said:

That point by Amfleet is a good one about maybe using Route 128 or Back Bay if you feel uncomfortable at South Station. I'm wondering if the Club Acela Metro Lounge is heated and air conditioned?   :unsure:

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Of course if the station is, it has to be.

ClubAcela amenities include:
Complimentary soft drinks, juice, pastries, and snacks.        

Comfortable and quiet lounge seating.        

Reservations and ticketing assistance.        

A selection of newspapers and periodicals.        

Credit card long-distance telephones with data ports for computer usage.        

Complimentary use of photocopy and fax machines.        

Complimentary world-wide web access.        

Conference rooms equipped with speaker phones and VCRs available for rental.        

Information on local dining and entertainment options.        

Train information.        

Advance boarding (where available).        

Quik-Trak ticketing machines.      

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Of course if the station is, it has to be.

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That's the thing though. South Station has very poor heat and no AC!

...but if you are looking for a station that is a bit more comforable to wait I would suggest Back Bay or Route 128.

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I have this thing about finding a suitable seat on a train, so I prefer, if possible, to originate from an endpoint station whenever possible. That is not to say that Back Bay isn't a good departure point, because it does have many of the amenities that South Station has. But there are only so many tracks through there (I think three for the Shore Line and two for the route to Worcester & Springfield), so the platforms get a bit more crowded. Back Bay's advantage is that, like New York or Philadelphia, the waiting room is not on the same level as the trains, which means one can wait in some comfort until the train is announced.

Route 128 has a beautiful new station (though I have yet to use it) to go along with its parking garage and high-level platforms. But it is not served by mass transit, which I would need since I'm a visitor to Boston, not an area resident. The only other way of getting to 128 is to take the T commuter rail, which leaves me once again at either Back Bay or South Station.....so it would not pay to do so.

Ruote 128 is a very nice station (you almost feel like your in Europe!), but the bulk of the crowds do board there so you can end up with an undesireable seat. Back Bay is not too bad and to put things into perspective the amount of passengers combined that get on at both South Station and Back Bay are the amount that get on at 128. Providence is even worse since no one gets off and many get on. I boared there once it was heck!!!

Amfleet said:

Ruote 128 is a very nice station (you almost feel like your in Europe!), but the bulk of the crowds do board there so you can end up with an undesireable seat. Back Bay is not too bad and to put things into perspective the amount of passengers combined that get on at both South Station and Back Bay are the amount that get on at 128. Providence is even worse since no one gets off and many get on. I boared there once it was heck!!!

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I hear you, when I boarded from Newark to take the Metroliner in June 1999, I couldn't sit with my dad until Philly, and Newark was only the first stop!!!

I don't mind sitting by myself, but I must have a window. One trip really annoyed me because I was on the isle and the guy sitting next to me was sleeping, not looking out the window, not leaning his head on the wall. Also, if the cafe has dinette seating I'll usually hangout there.