Replying to Notes from NARP meeting in MT

Because of the long distance it must travel, the Empire Builder doesn’t make much of a profit

According to McHugh and McBroom, the Empire Builder covers more than 65 percent of its operational costs, the second most of any long-distance Amtrak passenger train.

...there seems to be some confusion on the definition of "profit" in that article.

More press coverage of the NARP meeting.
http://www.flatheadb...ger_rail/27155/

I thought NARP was out of the marketing effort. They certainly should be. They should be an independent voice representing passengers and not Amtrak. NARP seems to be the only group actually lobbying congress. URPA seems like a totally off the wall group. I've never heard of RUN.

URPA is also not a group open membership like NARP or RUN. It is a few individuals with a few opinions who publish a newsletter. Nothing more than that. They actually by design do not have members and do not particularly appear to care what anyone else might think about anything they say.

They aren't corrupted by an extreme conflict of interest? They actually represent the riders?

My problem with NARP is that it is too close to Amtrak to give Amtrak any really unbiased feedback. This works against providing truly independent feedback. But they do have very good and deep contacts into Amtrak. OTOH they are completely absent in the way of having contacts with any of the Commuter organizations. I wish they would separate out the Amtrak Marketing part clearly so that the advocacy part does not get infected by it. Fortunately once you establish contact with folks in Amtrak via that route, you can go rogue and work directly with folks from Amtrak. Of course one does have to gain the trust and confidence of Amtrak management folks as an individual, in order to be taken seriously by them.

I would have liked RUN more if they spent a little less time and effort bad mouthing NARP and a little more time doing anything useful. Just my personal opinion, so just take it as such.

Jishnu.

I thought NARP was out of the marketing effort. They certainly should be. They should be an independent voice representing passengers and not Amtrak. NARP seems to be the only group actually lobbying congress. URPA seems like a totally off the wall group. I've never heard of RUN.

RUN or Rail Users Network is a national rail advocacy group run by Richard Rudolph. Look it up. They do some good.

Although they are a national rail advocacy group, their board seems heavily weighted with northeast individuals. Not much from west of the Mississippi or down south. From past working experience, I have dealt with some of them and found them to be a bit personally demanding and somewhat unrealistic; however if they have accomplished more than NARP, I would like to know exectly what. I am no great fan of NARP or certainly not of URPA.

RUN or Rail Users Network is a national rail advocacy group run by Richard Rudolph. Look it up. They do some good.

Sounds like they deserve their own thread where you can tell us about what they're interested in and how it's going. Kind of like how the OP of this thread was kind enough to do for NARP.

They aren't corrupted by an extreme conflict of interest? They actually represent the riders?

My problem with NARP is that it is too close to Amtrak to give Amtrak any really unbiased feedback. This works against providing truly independent feedback. But they do have very good and deep contacts into Amtrak. OTOH they are completely absent in the way of having contacts with any of the Commuter organizations. I wish they would separate out the Amtrak Marketing part clearly so that the advocacy part does not get infected by it. Fortunately once you establish contact with folks in Amtrak via that route, you can go rogue and work directly with folks from Amtrak. Of course one does have to gain the trust and confidence of Amtrak management folks as an individual, in order to be taken seriously by them.

I would have liked RUN more if they spent a little less time and effort bad mouthing NARP and a little more time doing anything useful. Just my personal opinion, so just take it as such.

Jishnu.

I thought NARP was out of the marketing effort. They certainly should be. They should be an independent voice representing passengers and not Amtrak. NARP seems to be the only group actually lobbying congress. URPA seems like a totally off the wall group. I've never heard of RUN.

RUN or Rail Users Network is a national rail advocacy group run by Richard Rudolph. Look it up. They do some good.

I would have liked RUN more if they spent a little less time and effort bad mouthing NARP and a little more time doing anything useful. Just my personal opinion, so just take it as such.

Jishnu.

On this we are completely in agreement.

They aren't corrupted by an extreme conflict of interest? They actually represent the riders?

My problem with NARP is that it is too close to Amtrak to give Amtrak any really unbiased feedback. This works against providing truly independent feedback. But they do have very good and deep contacts into Amtrak. OTOH they are completely absent in the way of having contacts with any of the Commuter organizations. I wish they would separate out the Amtrak Marketing part clearly so that the advocacy part does not get infected by it. Fortunately once you establish contact with folks in Amtrak via that route, you can go rogue and work directly with folks from Amtrak. Of course one does have to gain the trust and confidence of Amtrak management folks as an individual, in order to be taken seriously by them.

I would have liked RUN more if they spent a little less time and effort bad mouthing NARP and a little more time doing anything useful. Just my personal opinion, so just take it as such.

Jishnu.

I thought NARP was out of the marketing effort. They certainly should be. They should be an independent voice representing passengers and not Amtrak. NARP seems to be the only group actually lobbying congress. URPA seems like a totally off the wall group. I've never heard of RUN.

They aren't corrupted by an extreme conflict of interest? They actually represent the riders?

My problem with NARP is that it is too close to Amtrak to give Amtrak any really unbiased feedback. This works against providing truly independent feedback. But they do have very good and deep contacts into Amtrak. OTOH they are completely absent in the way of having contacts with any of the Commuter organizations. I wish they would separate out the Amtrak Marketing part clearly so that the advocacy part does not get infected by it. Fortunately once you establish contact with folks in Amtrak via that route, you can go rogue and work directly with folks from Amtrak. Of course one does have to gain the trust and confidence of Amtrak management folks as an individual, in order to be taken seriously by them.

I would have liked RUN more if they spent a little less time and effort bad mouthing NARP and a little more time doing anything useful. Just my personal opinion, so just take it as such.

Jishnu.

They aren't corrupted by an extreme conflict of interest? They actually represent the riders?