Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum: Replying To CSX TV Commercial - Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum

Jump to content


Replying to CSX TV Commercial

Enter a name

  • Your unique security code

Post

Options

Post Options


Post icon

  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •   [ Use None ]

  or Cancel


Topic Summary

George Harris 

Posted 27 January 2010 - 03:29 PM

Years ago I saw a map showing traffic volumes on the various US inland waterways. Thought I might come up with it on-line. No joy. What I did find was this piece of government financed propoganda that includes a map of where the designated US inland waterways are located.

LINK

Ispolkom 

Posted 27 January 2010 - 09:47 AM

And barge traffic is limited seasonally, as well. It wouldn't be very efficient to try to push a barge to St. Paul in January, and navigation on the Missouri, at least, is often maintained in low-flow periods only at the expense of upper-river interests.

PetalumaLoco 

Posted 26 January 2010 - 07:27 PM

View PostGeorge Harris, on Tue, Jan 26, 2010, 03:27 PM, said:

View PostPetalumaLoco, on Mon, Jan 25, 2010, 09:20 PM, said:

Inland barge is the most energy efficient.

From Trains Magazine, July 09.
Miles per gallon carrying 1 ton of cargo.
Truck freight: 155
Freight railroad: 413
Inland towing: 576
Their source: Texas Transportation Inst. 2007

Presumably an average. But, there can be a huge difference between upstream and downstream. I have watched upstream tows going past Memphis upstream running flat out and barely moving, and the downstream ones using only enough power to maintain control.

Know about the Natchez Trace? It owes its existence to that issue. Flatboats propelled by human power and current would float downstream form Nashville or thereabouts on the Cumberland, Ohio, and Mississippi Rivers to Natchez, which the ocean going ships of that time could reach. The flatboat men would then walk back to Nashville along the trail that became known as the Natchez trace.

Cool. I love little historic tidbits.

George Harris 

Posted 26 January 2010 - 06:27 PM

View PostPetalumaLoco, on Mon, Jan 25, 2010, 09:20 PM, said:

Inland barge is the most energy efficient.

From Trains Magazine, July 09.
Miles per gallon carrying 1 ton of cargo.
Truck freight: 155
Freight railroad: 413
Inland towing: 576
Their source: Texas Transportation Inst. 2007

Presumably an average. But, there can be a huge difference between upstream and downstream. I have watched upstream tows going past Memphis upstream running flat out and barely moving, and the downstream ones using only enough power to maintain control.

Know about the Natchez Trace? It owes its existence to that issue. Flatboats propelled by human power and current would float downstream form Nashville or thereabouts on the Cumberland, Ohio, and Mississippi Rivers to Natchez, which the ocean going ships of that time could reach. The flatboat men would then walk back to Nashville along the trail that became known as the Natchez trace.

PetalumaLoco 

Posted 25 January 2010 - 11:20 PM

View PostGavain, on Mon, Jan 25, 2010, 07:35 PM, said:

...But, purely for the operational period of the life-cycle, freight trains seem to be far and away the most energy-efficient (except for maybe freighter ships?).

Inland barge is the most energy efficient.

From Trains Magazine, July 09.
Miles per gallon carrying 1 ton of cargo.
Truck freight: 155
Freight railroad: 413
Inland towing: 576
Their source: Texas Transportation Inst. 2007

Gavain

Posted 25 January 2010 - 10:35 PM

In terms of its impact on the environment, each mode of transportation needs to be evaluated for its energy and resource-consumption over the entire life-cycle of the engine. We would want to know how much energy is invested in the production of a locomotive engine and rail cars versus the energy invested in the fabrication of the number of semi-trucks required to haul an equivalent tonnage. So, it is important to factor in both how many cars (and, hence, how much tonnage) the average locomotive hauls, as well as how many trains run at the same time, in order to get a sense of how much train is required to haul the total annual ton-miles, and so add in the energy cost of fabricating that much train. Truth be told, we would also want to figure the energy investment of decomissioning or recycling all that train. But, purely for the operational period of the life-cycle, freight trains seem to be far and away the most energy-efficient (except for maybe freighter ships?).

AAARGH! 

Posted 30 November 2009 - 01:59 PM

View PostALC_Rail_Writer, on Thu, Nov 26, 2009, 06:40 PM, said:

View PostLong Train Runnin', on Thu, Nov 26, 2009, 06:22 PM, said:

View PostWhoozOn1st, on Sun, Nov 2, 2008, 11:43 PM, said:

I'm truly amazed at the long life of this topic.


Well it just won't die! :lol:


And the best part...

It runs on only one gallon of fuel.

Don't you mean one cubic yard of hot air?

ALC_Rail_Writer 

Posted 26 November 2009 - 06:40 PM

View PostLong Train Runnin', on Thu, Nov 26, 2009, 06:22 PM, said:

View PostWhoozOn1st, on Sun, Nov 2, 2008, 11:43 PM, said:

I'm truly amazed at the long life of this topic.


Well it just won't die! :lol:


And the best part...

It runs on only one gallon of fuel.

Long Train Runnin' 

Posted 26 November 2009 - 06:22 PM

View PostWhoozOn1st, on Sun, Nov 2, 2008, 11:43 PM, said:

I'm truly amazed at the long life of this topic.


Well it just won't die! :lol:

leemell 

Posted 26 November 2009 - 03:24 PM

View PostGeorge Harris, on Wed, Mar 4, 2009, 12:14 PM, said:

View Postrrrhythm, on Sat, Feb 28, 2009, 07:02 AM, said:

View PostGeorge Harris, on Fri, Feb 27, 2009, 06:08 PM, said:

No. I do not agree.

OK, I respect that.

Can you tell me how their ad is worded? I believe it says: "CSX, our trains move one ton of freight 423 miles on one gallon of fuel."

Is that how the ad is worded?

RJ

This is a true statement. Remember, they are not moving one ton by itself. What we have here is probably best called economy of scale. They are moving the "one ton" along with a whole bunch of other "one tons" Take the total fuel consumption, divide by length of trip and weight, in other words, ton-miles produced, and you get 423 ton miles per gallon, which can correctly be said as moving one ton of freight 423 miles on a gallon of fuel. I do not know how to make it any clearer than it has already been stated by some of the others here.


This engineering/statical/financial process you are talking about is called "normalizing" and is used to compare different processes by creating a common metric. Very common and very valid.

Review the complete topic (launches new window)



This Web site is not operated by or affiliated with the National Railroad Passenger Corporation (Amtrak®).