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A comparison of high speed rail on different countries


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#1 Steve4031

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 02:10 AM

This was an interesting article. It focuses on Japan, China, S. Korea and Russia. It doesn't discotheque high speed services in Europe.

I rode superfast bullet trains in China, Japan, Korea, and Russia, and one is better than the rest - via Laserlike.https://www.business...-russia-2018-7/

#2 slasher-fun

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Posted 10 July 2018 - 01:58 PM

 

 Amtrak's Acela Express, which travels from Boston to Washington, DC, is the closest thing Americans have to a high-speed train. But with a speed that tops out at 241 kilometers per hour (150 mph), it pales in comparison to train systems in China and Japan, which are both faster and more extensive.

 

Wait, there's more expensive high-speed trains than Acela Express, that charges at least $126 for the 225 miles between NYC and DC?



#3 Pere Flyer

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Posted 10 July 2018 - 07:16 PM

 
 Amtrak's Acela Express, which travels from Boston to Washington, DC, is the closest thing Americans have to a high-speed train. But with a speed that tops out at 241 kilometers per hour (150 mph), it pales in comparison to train systems in China and Japan, which are both faster and more extensive.

 
Wait, there's more expensive high-speed trains than Acela Express, that charges at least $126 for the 225 miles between NYC and DC?
Extensive, not expensive. Though you’re probably right about cost-per-mile comparisons.

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#4 cpotisch

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Posted 10 July 2018 - 07:29 PM

Wait, there's more expensive high-speed trains than Acela Express, that charges at least $126 for the 225 miles between NYC and DC?

They said extensive! Extensive I tell you!  Don't worry. Those other high-speed trains are way LESS expensive.


Edited by cpotisch, 10 July 2018 - 07:30 PM.

Routes Traveled: Silver Meteor, Silver Star, CrescentLake Shore LimitedCalifornia Zephyr, Sunset Limited, Texas EagleEthan Allen Express, Empire Service, Maple Leaf, AdirondackAcela Express, Northeast RegionalKeystone Service
 
Wish List: Cardinal, CONO, Empire Builder, Southwest Chief, Crescent (overnight), Adirondack w/ Great Dome, Downeaster

#5 slasher-fun

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 02:53 AM

Woops, my mistake! Sorry about that.



#6 cpotisch

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 08:17 AM

Woops, my mistake! Sorry about that.

It's all good bro!  ;)


Routes Traveled: Silver Meteor, Silver Star, CrescentLake Shore LimitedCalifornia Zephyr, Sunset Limited, Texas EagleEthan Allen Express, Empire Service, Maple Leaf, AdirondackAcela Express, Northeast RegionalKeystone Service
 
Wish List: Cardinal, CONO, Empire Builder, Southwest Chief, Crescent (overnight), Adirondack w/ Great Dome, Downeaster

#7 VentureForth

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 05:59 AM

Yeah, I did a cost/speed was between the Shinkansen original route from Tokyo to Osaka and compared it to Acela. They are similar in distance, but that's it. Shinkansen way faster and modestly cheaper. No food other than pay to eat trolley service. I'll try to reproduce later today...
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14,223 Amtrak Miles. Many more to go.
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#8 seat38a

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 09:13 PM

Last year when I rode Sapsen from St Peterburg to Moscow and back, the seats were the most uncomfortable that I've ever sat in. I saw many people including myself standing around and stretching their backs.



#9 VentureForth

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Posted Yesterday, 10:02 AM

As promised.  Here is a comparison to the first Shinkansen timetable and the first Amtrak timetable to where we are today.  Now, the Shinkansen didn't start all the way to Hakata.  Had to change trains, so the total time assumes a fifteen minute dwell in Shin-Osaka then taking a traditional Limited Express.  Of course, Acela didn't come on the scene until December, 2000.  Anyway, here are some comparisons to they way they were in 1964/1971 vs today.

 

I think that the most interesting part is that the Shinkansen is almost 1/4 of the cost per mile vs Acela.  Now, there is no fancy meal or booze included on the Japanese train.  Probably because it's so fast, there's no time.  :)

 

Attached Files


Edited by VentureForth, Yesterday, 10:05 AM.

14,223 Amtrak Miles. Many more to go.
Completed Routes: Capitol Limited, Palmetto
Also Ridden: Carolinian, Crescent, Pacific Surfliner, Piedmont, Southwest Chief, Silver Meteor, Silver Star, Texas Eagle


#10 seat38a

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Posted Yesterday, 11:52 AM

As promised.  Here is a comparison to the first Shinkansen timetable and the first Amtrak timetable to where we are today.  Now, the Shinkansen didn't start all the way to Hakata.  Had to change trains, so the total time assumes a fifteen minute dwell in Shin-Osaka then taking a traditional Limited Express.  Of course, Acela didn't come on the scene until December, 2000.  Anyway, here are some comparisons to they way they were in 1964/1971 vs today.

 

I think that the most interesting part is that the Shinkansen is almost 1/4 of the cost per mile vs Acela.  Now, there is no fancy meal or booze included on the Japanese train.  Probably because it's so fast, there's no time.  :)

 

 

Also, just to put a little perspective, JNR which was the government agency which originally built the Shinkansen went bankrupt because of the high debt.

 

 

 

By 1987, JNR's debt was over ¥27 trillion ($280 billion at 2009 exchange rates) and the company was spending ¥147 for every ¥100 earned.[3] By an act of the Diet of Japan, on April 1, 1987 JNR was privatized and divided into seven railway companies, six passenger and one freight, collectively called the Japan Railways Group or JR Group. Long-term liabilities of JNR were taken over by the JNR Settlement Corporation. That corporation was subsequently disbanded on October 22, 1998, and its remaining debts were transferred to the national budget's general accounting.[4] By this time the debt has risen to ¥30 trillion ($310 billion in 2009 dollars).


#11 VentureForth

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Posted Yesterday, 12:14 PM

Yeah, but JNR was the whole Nationalized rail system, including many local municipal lines, probably about the equivalent to today's Amtrak + ALL commuter lines.  I don't think that the development of the Shinkansen directly resulted in the mountain of debt they acquired.  Shinkansen, particularly the Tokaido and Sanyo (which were the primary lines along with the Tohoku and Joetsu when JNR was privatized) kept the system from totally crashing.  JR was the best thing that happened to JNR.  Rolling stock was almost immediately updated, then more frequently.  More Shinkansen lines were built.  And each of the 7 companies (the smallest of which is the Freight, lol) have varying degrees of profitability, so much so that these now private companies are paying off JNR's debt.

 

I truly think that the biggest obstacle to US high speed rail is the reluctance to dig.  Virtually no tunnels through mountains or under cities.  Yes, it's expensive, but it's also the best way to draw a straight line while protecting a LOT of private land.


Edited by VentureForth, Yesterday, 12:14 PM.

14,223 Amtrak Miles. Many more to go.
Completed Routes: Capitol Limited, Palmetto
Also Ridden: Carolinian, Crescent, Pacific Surfliner, Piedmont, Southwest Chief, Silver Meteor, Silver Star, Texas Eagle


#12 jis

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Posted Yesterday, 04:55 PM

Also going with it, reluctance to use long high viaducts. This is how Asia is managing to build literally thousands of miles of grade separated low and high speed lines all over the place. Something that is done in spades for highways in the US, but not so much for rail.
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#13 seat38a

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Posted Yesterday, 06:11 PM

Also going with it, reluctance to use long high viaducts. This is how Asia is managing to build literally thousands of miles of grade separated low and high speed lines all over the place. Something that is done in spades for highways in the US, but not so much for rail.

Also the case with highways. They seem to tunnel straight through the mountains rather than winding up and over a pass.



#14 VentureForth

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Posted Today, 02:38 PM

So we know how to viaduct and tunnel, but just won't for rail.  Sigh.


14,223 Amtrak Miles. Many more to go.
Completed Routes: Capitol Limited, Palmetto
Also Ridden: Carolinian, Crescent, Pacific Surfliner, Piedmont, Southwest Chief, Silver Meteor, Silver Star, Texas Eagle





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