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Daytime Salt Lake City train


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#21 zgscl

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Posted 04 July 2018 - 03:03 AM

What about a 1055PM departure out of LAX with a 0600 arrival and longer stop in Las Vegas? This would make Fullerton and San Bernadino a bit better  I also agree about the overland route between SLC and DEN. You could then add Lairme, Cheyanne Fort Collins, Boulder, etc. 

 

Going to NYP would require the entire route to be served by single level cars. Do we have enough of these? Would two separate trains through Chicago make more sense (not sure we have enough of the Superliners either if it were two different routes. 



#22 railiner

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Posted 05 July 2018 - 11:59 AM

While it is always fun to speculate on such dream addition's, the current reality of things at Amtrak, unfortunately is a struggle just to keep the status quo... :(


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#23 cpotisch

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Posted 05 July 2018 - 12:05 PM

While it is always fun to speculate on such dream addition's, the current reality of things at Amtrak, unfortunately is a struggle just to keep the status quo... :(

All too true.  :unsure:


Routes Traveled: Silver Meteor, Silver Star, CrescentLake Shore LimitedCalifornia Zephyr, Sunset Limited, Texas EagleEthan Allen Express, Empire Service, Maple Leaf, AdirondackAcela Express, Northeast RegionalKeystone Service, Downeaster w/ Great Dome
 
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#24 Alexandria Nick

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Posted 05 July 2018 - 05:03 PM

 

 

 

Utah, with a total area of some 84,899 sq. miles, is nearly 2x larger when compared to Ohio at 44,825 sq. mi.

Ohio has a population of about 11.6 million (7th nationally) to Utah's 3.1 million (13th nationally). 

I'm not talking about the state, I am just talking about Salt Lake City.

 

 

You said:

I'm confused about why everyone is obsessed about daytime Ohio trains but no one cares that Salt Lake City is in the graveyard shift. If another Chicago-Denver train is established, it could overnight through the mountains and reach Salt Lake City during the day.

 

KmH's point was that the entire state of Utah has a quarter the population of Ohio. So it helps a hell of a lot more people to add a daytime Ohio train than to add a daytime SLC train.

 

Another thing to note is that Salt Lake City has a significantly smaller population than that of Toledo, Cleveland, or Cincinnati:

  • SLC           – 193,744
  • Toledo       –  278,508
  • Cleveland  –  385,809
  • Cincinatti   –  298,800

So if you compare the population of Utah to that of Ohio, Ohio wins. If you compare the population of SLC to that of the major Ohio cities, Ohio wins.

 

Salt Lake City-Provo-Orem, UT Combined Statistical Area 2,423,912

Columbus-Marion-Zanesville, OH Combined Statistical Area 2,398,297

Cincinnati-Wilmington-Maysville, OH-KY-IN Combined Statistical Area 2,208,450

Toledo-Port Clinton, OH Combined Statistical Area 648,610

Cleveland is bigger though.

 

Also, keep in mind that a daylight Ohio train potentially serves Pennsylvania (or PA and New York) in daylight too.  From the Ohio border on the Capitol Limited route, you get Toledo (650k, Sandusky included here), Cleveland (3500k, Elyria included here), Youngstown (650k, served by Alliance), and Pittsburgh (2600k).  No matter how you finesse those numbers, it is impossible for SLC or even Utah to compare.  That's 7.4 million people along that route.  Even a LSL routing still gets Buffalo and Erie in daylight, which puts it more like 6 million.  Still far more people than Utah can muster.



#25 dogbert617

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Posted 17 August 2018 - 10:51 PM

 

 

 

Utah, with a total area of some 84,899 sq. miles, is nearly 2x larger when compared to Ohio at 44,825 sq. mi.

Ohio has a population of about 11.6 million (7th nationally) to Utah's 3.1 million (13th nationally). 

I'm not talking about the state, I am just talking about Salt Lake City.

 

 

You said:

I'm confused about why everyone is obsessed about daytime Ohio trains but no one cares that Salt Lake City is in the graveyard shift. If another Chicago-Denver train is established, it could overnight through the mountains and reach Salt Lake City during the day.

 

KmH's point was that the entire state of Utah has a quarter the population of Ohio. So it helps a hell of a lot more people to add a daytime Ohio train than to add a daytime SLC train.

 

Another thing to note is that Salt Lake City has a significantly smaller population than that of Toledo, Cleveland, or Cincinnati:

  • SLC           – 193,744
  • Toledo       –  278,508
  • Cleveland  –  385,809
  • Cincinatti   –  298,800

So if you compare the population of Utah to that of Ohio, Ohio wins. If you compare the population of SLC to that of the major Ohio cities, Ohio wins.

 

Salt Lake City-Provo-Orem, UT Combined Statistical Area 2,423,912

Columbus-Marion-Zanesville, OH Combined Statistical Area 2,398,297

Cincinnati-Wilmington-Maysville, OH-KY-IN Combined Statistical Area 2,208,450

Toledo-Port Clinton, OH Combined Statistical Area 648,610

Cleveland is bigger though.

 

It'd be a lot easier to establish a daytime Amtrak train to Salt Lake City, if say like the Desert Wind(this is the long distance train that served Las Vegas till the mid 90s) was ever brought back as a separate train from the California Zephyr. IIRC till about 1997(or whatever year it was eliminated for good, along with also the Pioneer which served Wyoming, Boise, ID, etc) the Desert Wind operated like how currently the Sunset Limited and Texas Eagle are in San Antonio, where they are separated(going east) and combined there(going west) to run together between San Antonio and LA. Correct me other posters on this board, if my memory of the Desert Wind is wrong. :) My gut feeling is that it'd be a tough sell, for Union Pacific to agree to new passenger train service. Since as it is, I know whatever freight railroad that runs the tracks east of New Orleans continually blocks any efforts to restore long distance train service between NOLA to Jacksonville. :(

 

Not saying it's impossible though to ever see happen, since Metra(Chicago commuter rail agency) finally put enough pressure on CN where they relented, and allowed an extra afternoon outbound train run on the Heritage Corridor Metra commuter train line. But that was a battle that dragged on for years, as I remember.



#26 west point

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Posted 18 August 2018 - 08:24 AM

All this western talk ignores the ATL - CLT - RGH - RVR -WASH route.   The population thru that corridor is what 4 times that of Utah or the LSL route ?  Of course that train will never be started under present management because it would be even more successful that the Palmetto that serves a much less population density.


Edited by west point, 18 August 2018 - 08:31 AM.


#27 jis

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Posted 18 August 2018 - 01:34 PM

But CLT - RGH - RVR - WAS is already served nicely. So the relevant question would be what the incremental ridership gain would be for taking on the entire expense of the train, which at present is picked up by NCDOT.




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